Bitcoin Forum
October 18, 2019, 10:31:00 PM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 0.18.1 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Warning: One or more bitcointalk.org users have reported that they strongly believe that the creator of this topic is a scammer. (Login to see the detailed trust ratings.) While the bitcointalk.org administration does not verify such claims, you should proceed with extreme caution.
Pages: [1]
  Print  
Author Topic: Bitvest.io provably fair rigging  (Read 721 times)
MRKLYE
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000


Designer - Developer


View Profile WWW
December 16, 2015, 08:27:00 PM
 #1

Hey guys something very disturbing has come to my attention while using the site Bitvest.io.

Basically it's a BTC plinko site with investments and whatnot, but on further investigations I've come to see that the provably fair system they have in place could easily be used to manipulate gambler's roll outcomes causing them to lose. Further details below.

The way the site works by design is that after every bet the client seed and the server seed hashes are changed and supplied by the server...

What does this mean?

It means that they have time to pre-generate the next seeds you will use. Giving them a chance to give you sets of client/server seed combos that would ultimately lead to your bust. Most gamblers stick to a system or pattern when they roll, and given that the server and client seeds are changed for you, every roll, by THEIR systems, leaves anyone gambling on the site open to roll manipulation all while hiding under the disguise of a provably fair system.

The only way this sort of "provably fair system" would in fact be fair at all is if the user takes his time to re-enter a client seed of his own choice (Not the rigged one the server could give you) after EVERY roll. And let's be honest here, Most gamblers aren't even going to bother checking the seeds..

Let alone notice that the client AND server seed are both given to him, every roll. This is not provably fair at all.

When I brought this up their moderators were extremely defensive and I believe one of their moderators/admins basically threatened to mute me for claiming the site was a scam without evidence.. Between the signature campaign payouts being botched recently and now the provable fair system being found to be exploitable by the developer, I would have a serious look at the site before you consider using it.





I'm not directly accusing lightlord of being a scammer at this point, Perhaps this is an oversight in his coding.
But as it sits at the moment this site could very easily be rigging users rolls. And looking at the sites stats you could see how they might be./
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
1571437860
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1571437860

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1571437860
Reply with quote  #2

1571437860
Report to moderator
1571437860
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1571437860

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1571437860
Reply with quote  #2

1571437860
Report to moderator
MRKLYE
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000


Designer - Developer


View Profile WWW
December 16, 2015, 08:36:51 PM
 #2

Bump for visibility as well as reserved for later comments.

Would be nice if lightlord or zodiac weighed in on this.

Your moderators threatening to ban me when I brought this up put a more than nasty taste in my mouth.
MRKLYE
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000


Designer - Developer


View Profile WWW
December 17, 2015, 03:14:20 AM
 #3

Has anyone else looked at this site?

Any weigh in from lightlord?
yahoo62278
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1932
Merit: 1839



View Profile
December 17, 2015, 09:04:27 AM
 #4

I stopped using the site when the staff gave me a demotion for nothing at all but i do remember seeing you all over the place promoting your referral link for the site.

What made you turn against them? Something had to happen for you to even bring this up

.WOLF.BET.
▀  ▀▀▀▀▀▀
  ▀ ▀▀▀
 ▄ ▄▄▄ 
  ▄ ▄▄▄
▄  ▄▄▄▄▄▄
        ▄▄▄▀▀▀▀▄▄▄
    ▄███▌        ▀▀▄
  ▄▀   ▐█████████▄  ▀▄
 ▄▀  ▄█████████████▄  █
 ▌  █████████████████  █
▐  ████████████████ ▄█
█  █████████████████████▌
▐  ██████████████████ ▀█▌
 ▌ ▐█████████████████▌ ▐▀
 █  ██████████████▀ ▄▀
  █   ███████████▀  ▄▀
   ▀▄▄██ ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀  ▄▄▀
     ▀██▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▀▀▀
▄███████████▄
███████    ████████████▄
███████    ███████   ▀██
██████████████████    ██
██    ██████████████████
██    ███████    ███████
█████████████    ███████
███████    █████████████
███████    ███████    ██
██████████████████   ▄██
██        ▀███████████▀
██
██
      ▄█▄         ▄█▄
 ▄██ ███ ███████ ███ ██▄
▐███▄ ▀ ▄███████▄ ▀ ▄███▌
▐█▌▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▐█▌
▐█▌   ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄        ▐█▌
▐█▌   ████████        ▐█▌
▐█▌       ███     ▄▄▀▀▀██▄
▐█▌      ███    ██▀      ▀█
▐█▌     ███    ███         █
▐█▌    ███     ███          █
 ██▄           ███▄         █
  ▀█████████████████▄     ▄█
                  ▀▀█████▀▀

████
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
████


.AFFILIATE PROGRAM.
   ...FREE FAUCET........
..CHAT RAIN.............
MRKLYE
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000


Designer - Developer


View Profile WWW
December 17, 2015, 09:08:24 AM
 #5

I stopped using the site when the staff gave me a demotion for nothing at all but i do remember seeing you all over the place promoting your referral link for the site.

What made you turn against them? Something had to happen for you to even bring this up

Not turned against them at all.. Simply stating that the provably fair system is infact gameable by the developers.
Zodiac1233
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 607
Merit: 511


Bitvest & 777Coin Developer


View Profile WWW
December 17, 2015, 09:08:28 AM
 #6

Quote
It means that they have time to pre-generate the next seeds you will use. Giving them a chance to give you sets of client/server seed combos that would ultimately lead to your bust. Most gamblers stick to a system or pattern when they roll, and given that the server and client seeds are changed for you, every roll, by THEIR systems, leaves anyone gambling on the site open to roll manipulation all while hiding under the disguise of a provably fair system.

We provide the hash of the next server seed we will use before receiving the player seed, therefore we cannot compute seeds after having knowledge of the client seed

Quote
The only way this sort of "provably fair system" would in fact be fair at all is if the user takes his time to re-enter a client seed of his own choice (Not the rigged one the server could give you) after EVERY roll. And let's be honest here, Most gamblers aren't even going to bother checking the seeds..

The server doesn't give you a "rigged" client seed, or any client seed at all. The client seed is generated using javascript by the client.

Quote
When I brought this up their moderators were extremely defensive and I believe one of their moderators/admins basically threatened to mute me for claiming the site was a scam without evidence.. Between the signature campaign payouts being botched recently and now the provable fair system being found to be exploitable by the developer, I would have a serious look at the site before you consider using it.

I was very transparent and completely explained how our system works, and the only potential flaws that exist, nobody threatened you, nor did anyone mute you.



BITVEST DICE
HAS BEEN RELEASED!


▄████████████████████▄
██████████████████████
██████████▀▀██████████
█████████░░░░█████████
██████████▄▄██████████
███████▀▀████▀▀███████
██████░░░░██░░░░██████
███████▄▄████▄▄███████
████▀▀████▀▀████▀▀████
███░░░░██░░░░██░░░░███
████▄▄████▄▄████▄▄████
██████████████████████
▀████████████████████▀
▄████████████████████▄
██████████████████████
█████▀▀█▀▀▀▀▀▀██▀▀████
█████░░░░░░░░░░░░░▄███
█████░░░░░░░░░░░░▄████
█████░░▄███▄░░░░██████
█████▄▄███▀░░░░▄██████
█████████░░░░░░███████
████████░░░░░░░███████
███████░░░░░░░░███████
███████▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄███████
██████████████████████
▀████████████████████▀
▄████████████████████▄
███████████████▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
███████████▀▀▄▄█░░░░░█
█████████▀░░█████░░░░█
███████▀░░░░░████▀░░░▀
██████░░░░░░░░▀▄▄█████
█████░▄░░░░░▄██████▀▀█
████░████▄░███████░░░░
███░█████░█████████░░█
███░░░▀█░██████████░░█
███░░░░░░████▀▀██▀░░░░
███░░░░░░███░░░░░░░░░░
▀██░▄▄▄▄░████▄▄██▄░░░░
▄████████████▀▀▀▀▀▀▀██▄
█████████████░█▀▀▀█░███
██████████▀▀░█▀░░░▀█░▀▀
███████▀░▄▄█░█░░░░░█░█▄
████▀░▄▄████░▀█░░░█▀░██
███░▄████▀▀░▄░▀█░█▀░▄░▀
█▀░███▀▀▀░░███░▀█▀░███░
▀░███▀░░░░░████▄░▄████░
░███▀░░░░░░░█████████░░
░███░░░░░░░░░███████░░░
███▀░██░░░░░░▀░▄▄▄░▀░░░
███░██████▄▄░▄█████▄░▄▄
▀██░████████░███████░█▀
▄████████████████████▄
████████▀▀░░░▀▀███████
███▀▀░░░░░▄▄▄░░░░▀▀▀██
██░▀▀▄▄░░░▀▀▀░░░▄▄▀▀██
██░▄▄░░▀▀▄▄░▄▄▀▀░░░░██
██░▀▀░░░░░░█░░░░░██░██
██░░░▄▄░░░░█░██░░░░░██
██░░░▀▀░░░░█░░░░░░░░██
██░░░░░▄▄░░█░░░░░██░██
██▄░░░░▀▀░░█░██░░░░░██
█████▄▄░░░░█░░░░▄▄████
█████████▄▄█▄▄████████
▀████████████████████▀




Rainbot
Altcoin Betting
Faucet
Patatas
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1638
Merit: 1105


Crypto-Games.net: Multiple coins, multiple games


View Profile
December 17, 2015, 09:25:42 AM
 #7

Have you spoken about this to lightlord ? You could have tried sending him a pm first before opening this thread.They have couple of successful websites like 777coin but anyway you're issues seems considerable .I have not been betting there since quite a long time.You can try posting this in their official thread for lightlord to see.


▄▄▄████████▄▄▄
▄██████████████████▄
▄██████████████████████▄
██████████████████████████
████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████
▀██████████████████████▀
▀██████████████████▀
▀▀▀████████▀▀▀
   ███████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
██████████
███████
BTC  ◉PLAY  ◉XMR  ◉DOGE  ◉BCH  ◉STRAT  ◉ETH  ◉GAS  ◉LTC  ◉DASH  ◉PPC
     ▄▄██████████████▄▄
  ▄██████████████████████▄        █████
▄██████████████████████████▄      █████
████ ▄▄▄▄▄ ▄▄▄▄▄▄ ▄▄▄▄▄ ████     ▄██▀
████ █████ ██████ █████ ████    ▄██▀
████ █████ ██████ █████ ████    ██▀
████ █████ ██████ █████ ████    ██
████ ▀▀▀▀▀ ▀▀▀▀▀▀ ▀▀▀▀▀ ████ ▄██████▄
████████████████████████████ ████████
███████▀            ▀███████ ▀██████▀
█████▀                ▀█████
▀██████████████████████████▀
  ▀▀████████████████████▀▀ 
✔️DICE           
✔️BLACKJACK
✔️PLINKO
✔️VIDEO POKER
✔️ROULETTE     
✔️LOTTO
mexxer-2
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 924
Merit: 1003


4 Mana 7/7


View Profile
December 17, 2015, 09:30:42 AM
 #8

Anyone but lightlord is going to reply here, even if you wait for over an year
MRKLYE
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1260
Merit: 1000


Designer - Developer


View Profile WWW
December 17, 2015, 09:56:59 AM
 #9

I've talked to the developer of Bitvest (Zodiac) finally and he says they will look into implementing a nonce based system in the future.

So I guess for now as long as you manually change your client seed to something random after each bet (Don't use the random one they give you) The provably fair mechanism still basically works.. But if you use both generated rolls then it is possibly game-able. Not saying its being done but it *could* be done.
Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!