You Know Whats f**king Sad?

[Adrian-x]

:-) http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/has-anyone-really-been-far-even-as-decided-to-use-even-go-want-to-do-look-more-like

in reply to OP -- been sitting on the idea of making this post for a few days.

LOL thanks for the definition.

[mentalove]

I'm sorry but I haven't the faintest what you are on about, your post isn't coherent enough to really convey anything. Better luck next time.

lol. i love it. many references but no facts or arguments

[firefop]

I think it's sad that I can't get decent thai food in norther california.

[myrkul]

I think it's sad that I can't get decent Thai food in northern California.

If enough people also think this is sad, and you can cook (or at least, can hire a good cook), maybe you should scratch that itch yourself. Start a restaurant. Call it Thai Mai Shu or some such.

[johnniewalker]

I'm sorry but I haven't the faintest what you are on about, your post isn't coherent enough to really convey anything. Better luck next time.

Alright, apparently I have to simplify it for you.
Before Eisenhower eliminated the Silver Standard, every $note represented a certain bit of silver. If you had $5 you could go to the bank and get $5 in silver (as in silver certificates).
Now, our (USA) currency is tied to NOTHING. Literally it is a piece of paper. What gives things value? Utility and scarceness. Obviously dollar bills don't have much utility. But they have a certain degree of rarity. However, the Fed Rsrv can print as much money as it wants, causing inflation and making $1 worth less.
Bottomline: only FINITE forms of currensy work (gold, silver, etc). Our money system is INFINITE and therefore gives way to inflation.
make more sense?

I understand your view of fiat. Others have this view as well.  You may be right, you may be wrong (regarding your assertion that "only FINITE forms of currency work"), only time will tell.

What I don't understand is what you meant when you said: "First of all, the need to create Bitcoins. But even more than that-bitcoins are tied to the USD."

I was referring to the need to create a P2P form of currency. And by "tied to the dollar" I meant we assess btc at their USD value that day. Its not like we think of them in units of gold or something.

[myrkul]

And by "tied to the dollar" I meant we assess btc at their USD value that day. Its not like we think of them in units of gold or something.

So, are you likewise depressed that the Big Mac is "tied to the dollar"? Or your flatscreen TV?

You can express anything of value in terms of anything else of value. You could say that the Big Mac buys 3.14 dollars, instead of the other way around. That doesn't make it "tied to" the currency, just expressed in terms of that currency.

At the current value of Bitcoins, they're worth about 2/5ths of an ounce of silver each. Happy?

[creativex]

I was referring to the need to create a P2P form of currency. And by "tied to the dollar" I meant we assess btc at their USD value that day. Its not like we think of them in units of gold or something.

It's funny you say that because I've been training myself to break my programming(brainwashing) as it relates to valuing everything in consistently devalued FRNs for some while now. I'm nearly there, though sometimes I still regress. Instead of fiat toilet paper I try to think of the value of everything in terms of Ozt of silver. Try it some time, it can be very enlightening. When you think of purchases in terms of exchanging something of intrinsic value like AU, AG, or BTC, you're generally less likely to give them up for something of marginal value, unlike valuing things in USDs or other fiat trash.

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

I was referring to the need to create a P2P form of currency. And by "tied to the dollar" I meant we assess btc at their USD value that day. Its not like we think of them in units of gold or something.

It's funny you say that because I've been training myself to break my programming(brainwashing) as it relates to valuing everything in consistently devalued FRNs for some while now. I'm nearly there, though sometimes I still regress. Instead of fiat toilet paper I try to think of the value of everything in terms of Ozt of silver. Try it some time, it can be very enlightening. When you think of purchases in terms of exchanging something of intrinsic value like AU, AG, or BTC, you're generally less likely to give them up for something of marginal value, unlike valuing things in USDs or other fiat trash.

There is no difference between valuing something in "fiat trash" and in gold/bitcoins, because gold can be converted to "fiat trash".

Say $10 = 1 bitcoin.

Laptop: $300 fiat
30 bitcoins



No difference.

[creativex]

I was referring to the need to create a P2P form of currency. And by "tied to the dollar" I meant we assess btc at their USD value that day. Its not like we think of them in units of gold or something.

It's funny you say that because I've been training myself to break my programming(brainwashing) as it relates to valuing everything in consistently devalued FRNs for some while now. I'm nearly there, though sometimes I still regress. Instead of fiat toilet paper I try to think of the value of everything in terms of Ozt of silver. Try it some time, it can be very enlightening. When you think of purchases in terms of exchanging something of intrinsic value like AU, AG, or BTC, you're generally less likely to give them up for something of marginal value, unlike valuing things in USDs or other fiat trash.

There is no difference between valuing something in "fiat trash" and in gold/bitcoins, because gold can be converted to "fiat trash".

Say $10 = 1 bitcoin.

Laptop: $300 fiat
30 bitcoins



No difference.

Actually there's a huge difference. Gold was $39.31 the year I was born. How many rolls of fiat TP does it take to purchase an Ozt of gold today?

1712

http://www.nma.org/pdf/gold/his_gold_prices.pdf

Inflation is a hidden tax. It moves slowly, but it's painfully obvious over time that it's eating your purchasing power.

[Rudd-O]

I was referring to the need to create a P2P form of currency. And by "tied to the dollar" I meant we assess btc at their USD value that day. Its not like we think of them in units of gold or something.

It's funny you say that because I've been training myself to break my programming(brainwashing) as it relates to valuing everything in consistently devalued FRNs for some while now. I'm nearly there, though sometimes I still regress. Instead of fiat toilet paper I try to think of the value of everything in terms of Ozt of silver. Try it some time, it can be very enlightening. When you think of purchases in terms of exchanging something of intrinsic value like AU, AG, or BTC, you're generally less likely to give them up for something of marginal value, unlike valuing things in USDs or other fiat trash.

There is no difference between valuing something in "fiat trash" and in gold/bitcoins, because gold can be converted to "fiat trash".

Say $10 = 1 bitcoin.

Laptop: $300 fiat
30 bitcoins



No difference.

Actually there's a huge difference. Gold was $39.31 the year I was born. How many rolls of fiat TP does it take to purchase an Ozt of gold today?

1712

http://www.nma.org/pdf/gold/his_gold_prices.pdf

Inflation is a hidden tax. It moves slowly, but it's painfully obvious over time that it's eating your purchasing power.

To me, this is the biggest utility of Bitcoin and gold -- they protect me against inflation, and they do so very well.

In choosing one or the other, I personally put these risks in the balance:

- Gold may be a bit overpriced right now
- Governments will want to steal people's gold in the future (they already did once)
- Bitcoin is more volatile than gold

Therefore, I'm pursuing a balanced strategy with both.

[MoonShadow]

- Governments will want to steal people's gold in the future (they already did once)

I find this unlikely.  When this happened last in the US, gold was how most people saved for old age.  These days, that is done via 401k's and IRA retirement accounts.  There is much more value for a failing government to steal in those accounts than all of the privately owned gold in our modern world.  And since those accounts were created as tax-defered savings vehicles by acts of Congress, it's hard to argue that Congress can't just change it's mind on that issue, for the "greater good" and all that.  For that matter, there has been talk of 'nationalizing' private retirement accounts by certain persons on the far left of the political spectrum in Congress since the big health care law was passed.  It's simply the next box to get a checkmark in their social agenda.

[wdBTCtrader]

To any economic experts, please feel free to correct this simplified version...

For the most part currency is not tied to a specific physical item as it once was with the Gold standard.  It is actually tied to the "confidence" one has in the economy of the government backing that currency.  For instance, at one time the de facto currency used to trade in oil was the USD.  There has been a push to change that to the Euro, but that's a different topic.    Since the confidence was high in the USD many were comfortable  exchanging oil for USD and thus this gave the it more stability and therefore it gained more confidence for trading with other commodities.  

So to say Bitcoins are "tied" to the USD is actually incorrect.  It's tied to the confidence that those trading in it have in Bitcoins.  Most have more confidence in the USD than Bitcoins so they mitigate risk by using USD.  At one time many of the exchanges did offer Bitcoins to be traded with other fiat currencies, but those currencies weren't used enough for the exchanges to keep the option available.  

[johnniewalker]

I'm definitely not an economist, but everything you say is how I would have said it. It all comes back to the basic principles of economics: unlimited demand w/limited resources. We value the dollar because of its scarcity. We value $50 more than $1 because accumulating $50 is harder to do than acquiring $1 is. We value the dollar because it is our country's (USA) system of currency, as imposed by the government.
The thing is, though, that with currency mandated by a non-federal agency and backed by absolutely nothing, there is an inevitable crash that will take place in the future, as inflation has made it as such that a $100 bill will literally be worth only its utility; maybe one asswipe or something. No one can argue that our system of money, the dollar, has been in a constant state of inflation. Unless something is done, this inflation will continue until dollar bills are worth only their utility; not much seeing as they are a small piece of paper.
Like I said, I'm not an economist. PLEASE point out any flaws in my argument. This is something that perplexes me, and its so simple. I can't believe people aren't running around rioting!
On the other hand, what is a BTC? A series of digits. BUT, once all of the BTC out there are mined, they are mined. There will be no more bitcoins created. Thus, inflation is impossible in a BTC market.
Like I said, please point out any flaws in what I have said, but it seems so simple to me that a fiat type of currency is the only one that will work over an indefinite period of time.

[furrycoat]

Mr GreenJew (no offense)

Anti-semitism a sign of low self confidense, truly pathetic. Get the fuck out of these forums racists are nothing more then scum.

[odolvlobo]

johnniewalker, I watched your videos. You seem to be good with your hands. You should stick to that. Your logic ability and communication skills are lacking. None of your posts in this thread make any sense and the "greenjew" comment is despicable. I suggest you work on those skills before posting any more of these kinds of threads. And I think you should stop taking steroids. The roid rage is going to get you in trouble.

[thefiniteidea]

I'm sorry but I haven't the faintest what you are on about, your post isn't coherent enough to really convey anything. Better luck next time.

LOL. The OP had groundbreaking discoveries to share with us!!

[gabbergabe]

I'm sorry but I haven't the faintest what you are on about, your post isn't coherent enough to really convey anything. Better luck next time.

LOL. The OP had groundbreaking discoveries to share with us!!

After reading the 1st reply to this thread I knew it was forum gold!

[johnniewalker]

To all the people speaking of "GreenJew"-sorry about that, not tasteful.
And I can't believe almost everyone missed that this was a discussion of fiat currency vs. solid currency (gold, silver, etc), and the BTC's role in that. BTW, I'm pleasured to share a thread with geniuses.

[johnniewalker]

I'd also like to add that BTC are very similar to the NORFED Liberty Dollar. Look it up. It involves-when something costs $1-buying it with $1 worth of silver. And, this is the way our country used to be.
Bottomline: It is simply a mathematical equation; there will be a day that w/fiat currency and constant inflation, money will be worth only what its printed on.

[Xian01]

First of all, the need to create Bitcoins. But even more than that-bitcoins are tied to the USD. And do you know HOW MANY people are buying silver/gold instead of taking their "paper". Cause thats what it is-paper. Even change will be soon. Mr GreenJew (no offense) just stays posted all day making as much money as he wants. The reason things 99% of the time are raised in  price is because of inflation-GreenJew got excited and printed a bunch more.
Basically, the USD is backed by...not even the US (its not Federal)paper?
Now, we've stepped back in time to when the Silver Standard existed.
We are almost literally repeating historical economics that did not work out so well.
God help us.

Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?