Bitcoin for the homeless

[Jet Cash]

Hi  guys, I hope you will let a Bitcoin newbie join your forum, and I'd be grateful for you comments on some of my projects. At the moment, I'm researching the difficulties in using computers in a mobile lifestyle in England. I started off with a Toshiba Chromebook, which is great for email and normal domestic computing, especially with the addition of an SD card, but I don't like the idea of Google copying all the Bitcoin files. Chromebooks aren't too good for html or video editing either. So I bought an HP notebook running Windows 10, and I'm setting up a Bitcoin wallet on that. I'll look at the security issues when I've got a working wallet.

Updating the blockchain using public WiFi is quite an experience, and I'm glad that it seems to allow me to keep restarting the synchronisation. I've been at it for two days now, and I've still got 3 years and 38 weeks of data to load. MacDonalds and a couple of hotels seem to be happy to let me do this, but Sainsburys and the local library seem to bar access to the blockchain. I reckon MacD is the first to profit from my project - I seem to be drinking black coffee, hot chocolate, and eating egg wraps for most of the mornings.

I have three accounts with Nationwide, and that is great for mobile banking, but most of the others banks are not very convenient, or have security risks imho - I won't use contactless cards for example. Bitcoin seems to be one of the best alternatives, especially if one is concerned about the future of fiat currencies.

[shorena]

Hi  guys, I hope you will let a Bitcoin newbie join your forum, and I'd be grateful for you comments on some of my projects.

Newbies are most welcome here, its the scammers we dont like.

At the moment, I'm researching the difficulties in using computers in a mobile lifestyle in England. I started off with a Toshiba Chromebook, which is great for email and normal domestic computing, especially with the addition of an SD card, but I don't like the idea of Google copying all the Bitcoin files. Chromebooks aren't too good for html or video editing either. So I bought an HP notebook running Windows 10, and I'm setting up a Bitcoin wallet on that. I'll look at the security issues when I've got a working wallet.

Updating the blockchain using public WiFi is quite an experience, and I'm glad that it seems to allow me to keep restarting the synchronisation. I've been at it for two days now, and I've still got 3 years and 38 weeks of data to load. MacDonalds and a couple of hotels seem to be happy to let me do this, but Sainsburys and the local library seem to bar access to the blockchain. I reckon MacD is the first to profit from my project - I seem to be drinking black coffee, hot chocolate, and eating egg wraps for most of the mornings.

I have three accounts with Nationwide, and that is great for mobile banking, but most of the others banks are not very convenient, or have security risks imho - I won't use contactless cards for example. Bitcoin seems to be one of the best alternatives, especially if one is concerned about the future of fiat currencies.

That sounds like its unnecessarily complicated. I would argue that the most mobile wallet you can have is a stand alone electrum[1] on an USB stick. You might run into issue if you use other computers for that though. Still a light client (like electrum, multibit, etc.) requires less data and would be synced within minutes. Consider you want to pay for something and would have to wait 20 minutes for the sync to finish, that does not sound like a usable system to me.

I suggest you look into other wallets[2] besides bitcoin core. Try a few to figure out which suits your needs the best or tell us more about what exactly you expect from your wallet, maybe we can give you a suggestion based on that.

[1] https://electrum.org/#download
[2] https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet

[Jet Cash]

Thanks for your reply. As you probably realise, I'm in the early stages of learning about Bitcoin. I have assumed that using Bitcoin core would give me full control of my wallet, and anything else would involve 3rd parties, or hosting on machines out of my control. I hope that once I have downloaded the blockchain, I will be able to use this computer for transactions, and I will be able to move my coins onto a device without an internet connection. I was thinking about using an old mobile with an expired sim card, but that idea hasn't even made it onto the back of an envelope yet.

[shorena]

Thanks for your reply. As you probably realise, I'm in the early stages of learning about Bitcoin. I have assumed that using Bitcoin core would give me full control of my wallet, and anything else would involve 3rd parties, or hosting on machines out of my control.

This is true for some wallets, but e.g. multibit can directly query full nodes (like bitcoin core) without disclosing information about your addresses. Electrum depends on community run servers that run a full node and provide information for you, but you can manually select different servers.

I hope that once I have downloaded the blockchain, I will be able to use this computer for transactions, and I will be able to move my coins onto a device without an internet connection. I was thinking about using an old mobile with an expired sim card, but that idea hasn't even made it onto the back of an envelope yet.

Its possible to seperate a wallet into two systems. One kept offline that has the private keys and one kept online that only knows about the addresses. That way the online system knows the balance of your wallet and can create transactions. Without the private key however the transactions can not be signed and are not considered valid. You would create such a transaction on the online system, transfer it to the offline system for signing and once signed transfer it back to the online system for broadcasting it to the network. For that the offline system must not be synced at all, only the online system must be up to date.

These systems also exist for mobile phones, e.g. bither would be an example that offers an offline wallet for a phone. I dont know if it requires a central server though.

[Jet Cash]

It's interesting to watch what is happening, so I guess I'll carry on with the longhand system for a while. I've got 3.5 years of data to go, and I guess it will slow up as there are probably more transaction per year in the recent years. I'm impressed with the way it keeps restarting despite the shutdowns and network failures.

It's interesting that Sainsburys won't allow access to the blockchain, but then they do own a banking service. They do have some strange ideas about site restrictions though. They won't let me look at Kitco gold prices, but they will allow me to look at Kitco copper futures. They also blocked an electric shaver review page. Maybe they don't like clean shaven gold speculators.

[shorena]

It's interesting to watch what is happening, so I guess I'll carry on with the longhand system for a while. I've got 3.5 years of data to go, and I guess it will slow up as there are probably more transaction per year in the recent years.

Correct. The early data is also not verified in depth until a checkpoint is reached.

I'm impressed with the way it keeps restarting despite the shutdowns and network failures.

As long as it shuts down cleanly you can do this as often as you like it will continue where it left off.

It's interesting that Sainsburys won't allow access to the blockchain, but then they do own a banking service. They do have some strange ideas about site restrictions though. They won't let me look at Kitco gold prices, but they will allow me to look at Kitco copper futures. They also blocked an electric shaver review page. Maybe they don't like clean shaven gold speculators.

Most public WiFi is restricted to certain ports (mainly http(s) and common mail ports). Bitcoin core uses 8333 by default which is rarely open. You might have a better chance if you can use a VPN as they are mostly allowed form public WiFi. You might also get high bandwith from a library or university. For a university you will probably have to ask someone to share WiFi as they are commonly restricted to students.

Currently my data directory is 57.6 GB it might take you a while jumping from free WiFi to free WiFi to catch up.

[Jet Cash]

It's quite interesting. It looks as if they may monitor activity, because it seems to slow down after a while. If I log off, and log on again with a different address, then it speeds up again. I hear what you say about the port, and that answers the next q. I was going to ask.

When I started, I could click on the activity bar, and I got a pretty activity graph. That facility seems to  have gone. Is there a way to get it back?

[shorena]

It's quite interesting. It looks as if they may monitor activity, because it seems to slow down after a while. If I log off, and log on again with a different address, then it speeds up again. I hear what you say about the port, and that answers the next q. I was going to ask.

I guess they limit usage per session, but its most likely automated.

When I started, I could click on the activity bar, and I got a pretty activity graph. That facility seems to  have gone. Is there a way to get it back?

I think you are looking for this:



Its under Help -> Debug Window -> Network Traffic

[Jet Cash]

That's it. Thanks for posting the link, it was really helpful. It's all green here. In fact the received traffic is in Mb and the sent is Kb. At MacD, the graph was mainly red. I know there is interference on thir hub, because I can't connect the Chromebook there. I didn't realise it was that bad though.

[shorena]

That's it. Thanks for posting the link, it was really helpful. It's all green here. In fact the received traffic is in Mb and the sent is Kb. At MacD, the graph was mainly red. I know there is interference on thir hub, because I can't connect the Chromebook there. I didn't realise it was that bad though.

Yes, it should be mainly green for you while you are stil synchronizing. You will obviously send data even though you dont have the full blockchain available, but most traffic should be going your way.

[Jet Cash]

I'm guessing the red is nacks and retry requests as a result of receiving faulty packets (at MacD). I might use that graph to illustrate the problem.

I'm now down to about 2.5 years on this link. I'm down to about 40 minutes on the battery, so I'll quit until I can recharge tomorrow.

Thanks for all your help and info, it's been really useful.

[Jet Cash]

I've noticed that this thread has had over 300 views, and I suspect that the title attracted most of those. I'm now about 3 days into this project, and I thought I should post my opinion for anyone who is genuinely homeless, and is considering the use of Bitcoin. Please remember that these opinions are those of a Bitcoin newbie ( but not a computer newbie).

- Bitcoin is a great alternative to cash
- Downloading the blockchain is only viable for eccentric English coffee addicts, you would be better off using the light services suggested in various posts in my threads.
- Pay special attention to security aspects, and assume that at some time you will lose your mobile/computer.
- A chromebook may be a viable alternative, I'll post about that when I've got it working.
- Earning bitcoin from sig views could be a useful additional income, especially if you can discuss your experiences on other boards.
- Your Bitcoin stache is not immediately visible to those around you.

More info to come when I have some actual experience.

[KingW]

No offence dude but bitcoin is a useless currency for the homeless. How are they going to pay for anything without computer or phone...

[Jet Cash]

All the homeless around here seem to have at least one mobile, and many have tablets as well. Also, you may like to look at some of the videos about the economic migrants that are flooding into Europe.

[CoinBoerse.com]

No offence dude but bitcoin is a useless currency for the homeless. How are they going to pay for anything without computer or phone...

Exactly unless you are giving them a phone to use haha.

[Jet Cash]

You guys should spend some time looking at the real world instead of posting here to scratch a few cents from sigs. There are an enormous number of people in the US who are living in cars, vans and RVs. Some from necessity, and some from choice. They all have mobile phones, and many have computers. In fact quite a few earn a living on the net. The same applies to many other countries. Youtube is full of videos posted by them.

[tommypug]

Yeah you would have to give them an eletronic and hope they dont pawn it off 

[rikrikrik]

You really think BTC is better than cash? You must be a American, I have lived in Australia PNG Malaysia Singapore and now Belgium, homeless people are homeless, let's say you give them 100$ in cash, they can hide it in a brick wall or on there person or spend it anywhere, give them a phone with 100$ of BTC, someone steals the phone the phone breaks the value of BTC changes and also they can't buy anything because McDonald's doesn't take BTC mainly because of people with pipe dreams, maccas wants to be seen doing the right thing, BTC looks like a way of avoiding tax, cool kids don't use BTC because anti government free wifi grabbing people promote it.


And please don't bring refugees into a conversation about finance or the homeless as everywhere has a different status with refugees

[Jet Cash]

I'm not American, I'm English. Have you read some of my other posts? I have stated that Bitcoin will never replace cash, or some other token system. It will/has change(d) other money payment systems though. This is especially true now that the EU has ruled that bank bail-ins are legal. IMHO Bitcoin is safer than cash provided that both parties have a communication facility, and a connection service is available. One of the problems encountered by homeless people is the difficulty in maintaining a bank account - Bitcoin provides an alternative that doen't require references and a stable income. So do you think that homeless people should be repressed and kept out of conventional society? I think they should be given a chance to improve their lot if they want to take it.

refugees and economic migrants are not the issue here, but Bitcoin could help them to survive given the mix of nationalities intheir camps.

Bitcoin is not a pipe dream anymore. I'm politically incorrect, and noted for my criticism of people compromising their beliefs to gain peer acceptance. Free WiFi is a commercial decision made by businesses to increase sales to mobile customers. I spend more in MacD and other places than you pay for your internet (over £400 per month)

[Book672]

Setup a donation address.

I`ll be happy to donate some of my profits that I earn to the homeless people. I earn a lot of bitcoins so it's no big deal for me.