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Author Topic: Meanwhile on Wikipedia...  (Read 9529 times)
casascius
Mike Caldwell
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December 15, 2012, 05:47:00 PM
 #81

I could see that list of currencies getting nominated for deletion and getting successfully deleted simply due to the volatile nature of the exchange rate information it lists.  Lists of highly volatile figures are already unfavored because it's data with a short shelf life, detracts from Wikipedia as a whole, and that's before factoring in a paparazzi interested in promoting Bitcoin.  The more we edit war for its inclusion, the more negative attention it will attract, and the more likely the whole list soon won't exist at all.

If putting Bitcoin there results in people flocking to fight for the cause of removing it, then strategy wise, I would just leave it alone and try again in 6 or 12 months when Bitcoin is that much bigger and more well known.

Companies claiming they got hacked and lost your coins sounds like fraud so perfect it could be called fashionable.  I never believe them.  If I ever experience the misfortune of a real intrusion, I declare I have been honest about the way I have managed the keys in Casascius Coins.  I maintain no ability to recover or reproduce the keys, not even under limitless duress or total intrusion.  Remember that trusting strangers with your coins without any recourse is, as a matter of principle, not a best practice.  Don't keep coins online. Use paper or hardware wallets instead.
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December 15, 2012, 05:58:46 PM
 #82

If putting Bitcoin there results in people flocking to fight for the cause of removing it, then strategy wise, I would just leave it alone and try again in 6 or 12 months when Bitcoin is that much bigger and more well known.

+1

While it's nice when we make it on there, or as a community work to meet the "requirements" that would get us onto Wikipedia, edit wars are pointless and are at best harmful.

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December 15, 2012, 06:26:47 PM
 #83

If putting Bitcoin there results in people flocking to fight for the cause of removing it, then strategy wise, I would just leave it alone and try again in 6 or 12 months when Bitcoin is that much bigger and more well known.

Yeah, it's actually pretty funny because on the Talk page it looks like this whole discussion first played out with the same results in May/June 2011...
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December 15, 2012, 06:27:20 PM
 #84

No one reads that article anyways, and who cares if it meets some arbitrary definition or not?

If bitcoin works, then it will be used, if it does not, then it will die.

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December 15, 2012, 10:10:07 PM
 #85

I like how Talk page changed over past few days. Massive Bitcoin discussion war. @

19e3fcoLTu8YVFAU1NywJ88YnHH5kF8ScP - donations are welcome.
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December 15, 2012, 10:34:35 PM
 #86

Why does the entry say that the highest value coin is 1 and the highest value bank-note is 1?  There are no "official" coins or notes and if you're going to include unofficial ones then Mike Caldwell produces coins of a much higher value than 1 BTC.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
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December 15, 2012, 10:45:14 PM
 #87

BTC was back for a split second  Lips sealed
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December 15, 2012, 10:54:04 PM
 #88

I loved reading this recent exchange on the discussion page:
Comment: It's about as much of a currency as kids exchanging marbles within their circle of friends for candy.
In reality any currency is a group of people exchanging the units of that currency between themselves. If the marbles were really rare and they all agreed to use them as a common medium of exchange, the marbles would become a currency. The main difference between any two currencies is the size of the group of people who utilize the currencies. At what point does it go from just being a "group of friends" to a legitimate widely used currency? It would be very easy to argue that bitcoin is certainly a "legitimate" currency in that sense, because it's used by hundreds of thousands of people, maybe even millions of people, from all around the world. It's a global currency used to facilitate international exchange... if that doesn't qualify as a currency then I don't know what does. Oh right it has to be Government backed. Roll Eyes

If one defines a key criteria for considering a currency "strong" and "serious" as its geographical reach, Bitcoin is already in the top tier for sure, with USD and EUR and Precious Metals.  Analyzed this way, it's a good rebuttal too the "circle of friends" argument, given that I'm sure no bartering instrument ever concocted by a group of friends is owned and exchanged in every country from Afghanistan to Zimbabwe.

Thus, a thought experiment on the ultimate test of "moneyness": if you were to be randomly dropped off in one of Ghana, Iceland, Mexico, Uruguay, Hong Kong, Estonia, or Australia, and you weren't allowed to carry USD, EUR, or PMs, where would a wallet full of Bitcoin rank on the list of "immediately useful money" versus all other state-sponsored currencies?  Pretty damn high, I reckon.

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December 15, 2012, 11:28:07 PM
 #89




Thus, a thought experiment on the ultimate test of "moneyness": if you were to be randomly dropped off in one of Ghana, Iceland, Mexico, Uruguay, Hong Kong, Estonia, or Australia, and you weren't allowed to carry USD, EUR, or PMs, where would a wallet full of Bitcoin rank on the list of "immediately useful money" versus all other state-sponsored currencies?  Pretty damn high, I reckon.



Your wallet full of bitcoin would be about as useful as this dude's:  http://youtu.be/H9jC0TP-Yug

It'd be a proxy for real money and I don't think this guy would make it too far in Ghana ("ugh... I can't even get a 4G signal!"), or even Mexico for that matter. 
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December 15, 2012, 11:29:08 PM
 #90

BTC was back for a split second  Lips sealed

Yep, saw that, this time as Decentralized

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December 16, 2012, 01:16:21 AM
 #91


Your wallet full of bitcoin would be about as useful as this dude's:  http://youtu.be/H9jC0TP-Yug

It'd be a proxy for real money and I don't think this guy would make it too far in Ghana ("ugh... I can't even get a 4G signal!"), or even Mexico for that matter. 

It would be pretty damned useless in many parts of Australia, too - only about 25% of Australia's land mass has terrestrial mobile phone coverage.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
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December 16, 2012, 05:00:53 AM
 #92

I put my opinion on the talk page for why bitcoin should be included. A lot of the people arguing against seemed to be making up requirements or just had a very poor understanding of what bitcoin is. They're on the wrong side of history.

I was surprised to see so much bitterness and resentment towards bitcoin, however. I don't know why someone could get so worked up - if you think it will fail or don't want to use it then you're completely free to not use it (unlike other currencies). I guess the hate could be a good sign though:

First they ignore you
then they laugh at you
then they fight you
then you win

I guess we're somewhere between steps 2 and 3 right now.
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December 16, 2012, 05:35:52 AM
 #93

When the drug dealer or child pornographer uses BTC to buy a loaf of bread and the baker of that bread then uses BTC to buy drugs or kiddie porn, then BTC will be a currency rather than just a proxy for fiat currencies. 

You must be really old. No one pays for porn any more  Roll Eyes Seriously, though, what about the people who earn Bitcoin using their web business, and then pay their software developers, and domain and VPS hosts with Bitcoin, and then those domain and VPS hosts use Bitcoin to buy their server hardware? Does that (which already happens) make BTC a currency?

thus, a thought experiment on the ultimate test of "moneyness": if you were to be randomly dropped off in one of Ghana, Iceland, Mexico, Uruguay, Hong Kong, Estonia, or Australia, and you weren't allowed to carry USD, EUR, or PMs, where would a wallet full of Bitcoin rank on the list of "immediately useful money" versus all other state-sponsored currencies?  Pretty damn high, I reckon.

Your wallet full of bitcoin would be about as useful as this dude's:  http://youtu.be/H9jC0TP-Yug

It'd be a proxy for real money and I don't think this guy would make it too far in Ghana ("ugh... I can't even get a 4G signal!"), or even Mexico for that matter.  

Every currency in that example, including Bitcoin, would need to be exchanged to the local currency to be useful. I think the point is that it would be easier to trade it for local currency, or barter with it directly, than try to convince some random bank to accept to trade your suspicious foreign paper into local money.

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December 16, 2012, 01:43:18 PM
 #94

I put my opinion on the talk page for why bitcoin should be included. A lot of the people arguing against seemed to be making up requirements or just had a very poor understanding of what bitcoin is. They're on the wrong side of history.

Totally true. People just have a very poor understanding of cryptography, so bitcoin is like "some kind of scam" to them...

First they ignore you
then they laugh at you
then they fight you
then you win

so we fight now...

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December 16, 2012, 03:52:32 PM
 #95

I think it's now fair to say that the entire SA "group" is nothing more than a bunch of paid shills. I don’t know who they work for, but it’s obvious they have an agenda.

They attack without reason, and will do anything to have it their "way".

Guess what you moronic, narcissistic, degenerate excuse for scum.

YOU CAN'T HAVE IT YOUR WAY.

My Bitcoins are MINE, and you will never have your "way" with them... How much does that piss you tree-swinging monkeys off? That you can’t control & manipulate Bitcoin like all the other “systems” that your handlers have "blessed" us with? Does it piss you off that people are all now collectively starting to awaken to the invisible chains that you stupid neanderthals gleefully and voluntarily put on each and every single day.  

Or are you all just a bunch of sad degenerate nerds looking to ruin other peoples work, because you lack any sense of creativity or direction yourselves.

Either way it's starting to go from sad, to very very annoying...

Don't rattle a bees nest SA.... You may not like the result.

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December 16, 2012, 05:57:18 PM
Last edit: December 16, 2012, 06:07:28 PM by bitfreak!
 #96

Either way it's starting to go from sad, to very very annoying...
lol... I agree with you but there's no need to get so angry and frustrated, because that's exactly the response they want from you. They're playing a childrens game and the way to win is to be the more mature one. There's no need to "fight" them or get angry about this, the way of the wise will win in the end, and we wont need to do anything. Just let bitcoin take its natural course and eventually it will be impossible for them to fight against it. I agree with casascius here, we need to simply play the waiting game and try again in a few months. Partaking in a childish edit war will solve nothing. Let them have their "win" here and now, it means absolutely nothing.

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December 16, 2012, 06:50:35 PM
 #97


Don't rattle a bees nest SA.... You may not like the result.

Perhaps you can post it on UpTweet and it will be the first thing to ever get UpTweeted? 
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December 16, 2012, 07:07:16 PM
Last edit: December 16, 2012, 07:27:47 PM by slardar
 #98

I think it's now fair to say that the entire SA "group" is nothing more than a bunch of paid shills. I don’t know who they work for, but it’s obvious they have an agenda.
they have threads like this:

https://cdn.anonfiles.com/1355684810821.png

It's pretty obvious they have an agenda, and are funded by *something* to hit their goals.

SA might be a lot closer to the fiat banking industry htan thought before ..

If they want to keep it out of the public eye as much as Possible then why not REMOVE ALL TRACES OF IT from the LARGEST encyclopedia on earth Huh See no evil, hear no evil...
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December 16, 2012, 07:33:54 PM
 #99


Wow that's surprising... Freemasonry linked to a bunch of goon-like idiots who suppress anything that goes against the mainstream. Roll Eyes

Why would anyone pay attention to something awful anyway. I mean why even pay attention to some awful shit.  Grin

The name alone is typical of the negative sinister low-life mentality fueled by misinterpretations of Luciferianism ...

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December 16, 2012, 08:50:12 PM
Last edit: December 16, 2012, 09:21:11 PM by Rassah
 #100

Yeah... no. They're not paid shills. They are just morons stuck in an echo chamber, who never grew out of highschool. Just think of them as the obnoxious kids from the "cool kids" table who live only to harass and annoy anyone who is different in any way, for the sole reason of getting positive feedback from their own little group. Seriously, read their forum, and you'll notice how every other post is "Haha, they are so stupid, right? Guys? Right? Yeah, I'm cool cause I think like you." It's pathetic. Want to know how the secret to beating them? Whatever they are attacking, just own it. Be proud of it and don't let them faze you. If they notice that they can't attack your weakness and can't pick on you, they'll get annoyed and move on. Also, just remember that those cool kids at school usually end up with really shitty lives. SA is no exception (crappy, dead-end jobs, living in the middle of nowhere, REALLY boring lives, and generally poor, with completely ignorant misunderstanding on business or finance. A bunch of them are Occupy types) And Bitcoin will survive without and despite them, as has everything else they ever attacked. You can laugh at them when they march around protesting about how early adopters got an unfair advantage over them.

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