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Author Topic: Hard wired/client based p2p escrow ? (Fees and forfeit transfers go to miners)  (Read 2444 times)
Gandlaf
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June 07, 2011, 09:35:53 PM
 #1

One of the main issues with bitcoin transactions seems to be that it is impossible to do a chargeback, which opens the door for scammers. Obviously a complete chargeback solution would not work either, as it would just reverse the problem.

But what about a system where bitcoins can be sent irreversibly, without the receipient being credited until the sender confirms the transaction?
The coins would be lost to the sender but wouldn´t be credited to the receipient until the sender confirms.

A system of this kind, requiring the sender to send&confirm seperately(without ever being able to regain the funds sent), would make it unattractive for either sender or receipient to engage in a scam, as they would be facing a loss or at best gaining nothing.

I am not qualified to suggest a way of implementing such a system, but the workload for the overall system would not seem much bigger than that of carrying ´lost´ coins.

It might even provide an opportunity to compensate miners in an alternative way: Why not charge:  ´2 x basic fee + basic fee x blocks to live x a factor` for such an escrow transaction, with any unresolved transaction(after the chosen ´blocks to live´ value has been exceeded) credited to the miner of the subsequent block(possibly with some smoothing out)?

I believe such a change to the client/system would really facilitate commerce and exchanges.


Let me try to give an example:

I decide to buy 100 BTC@20$(=2000$) from X. A safe way of trading would be:

1. X would ask me to transfer 10%(=10BTC[escrowed]) to his account as a sign of good will.
2. X transfers 110 BTC(escrowed) to my address.
3. I send my 2k USD to X
4. X confirms his prior transaction
5. I confirm my prior transaction.

The point being: Even for larger amounts, there is no incentive to cheat/scam, along any step of such a chain, the payoff for cheating for either side would be 0 or negative. With any ´leftovers´ going back into the system.

I would really love to see something of this kind implemented in the Bitcoin client.

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justhree
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June 08, 2011, 01:44:12 AM
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How could that possibly work?

Your a absalute idiot!!!
If this is possible theiy(or Satoshi) would have done these right away. These does not work, they will not work, stop wasting the time for developer!
grue
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June 08, 2011, 01:52:33 AM
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use clearcoin. problem solved.

It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.

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Gandlaf
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June 24, 2011, 01:25:11 AM
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Not really, we´ve just seen mybitcoin and MtGox compromised, Clearcoin is not inherently safe either. What I proposed would be a decentraslized option in keeping with the overall philosophy of bitcoin.

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Mike Hearn
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June 24, 2011, 07:13:46 AM
 #5

There are several ways to do this. See example 2 on

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Contracts

The "send or burn" protocol is also possible of course, but it's best to avoid situations where somebody might want to burn coins, as there are a limited number of them.
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June 24, 2011, 08:16:29 PM
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How could that possibly work?

Your a absalute idiot!!!
If this is possible theiy(or Satoshi) would have done these right away. These does not work, they will not work, stop wasting the time for <the?> developer!

I swear I tried to give up judging people on their grammar and spelling. I tried so hard to walk away from it, I really did - and then you had to go and do this... Great. Just Great. I'm back off the fscking wagon again. Look what you did.

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