The miners were delivered November 6, 2015, UPS tracking: 1ZY764W66898990355. More like beginning of November, but you did not power them on until a week after.
Yes that is true. But I don't see how any of this is relevant. Just like you took your time testing them when you got them back we were constrained by our time table. We did our best to test them as soon as we could. End of story on this front.
You admitted to me twice that your PSUs were the issue. One time while the Neptunes were still in your procession and second time when I showed you screenshots of them working fine after I got them back.
The PSUs were an issue to an extent, but it is not fair to put the blame entirely on the PSUs. Those very same PSUs power batch 1 Neptunes just FINE. Your shitty compensation batch Neptunes are shitty. It is a reality. The compensation batch seem to be flaky as hell. They have no thermal pads on them and hence VRM cooling is an issue. That is why you suggested that I put fans on them and do all sorts of ghetto rigging to get them working reliably. Sadly we did not have any EVGA or other ATX style PSUs in the shop to test with so called different PSUs. They should've still worked reasonably stable even with ANY PSU. When we got them we saw that you tuned the hell out of the cores and dies which suggests that there were not reliable at stock setting for you either. Your hardware is flaky and thus only suitable for your use. We made you aware of this. We need stable hardware and not hobby gear.
Not sure why you are lying about the agreed upon price. It was $655 shipped. At the time it was a bargain, but BTC price was low. So the total in BTC came up to 17.73BTC. I am assuming he is trying to hide the fact that he had buyer's remorse because the price of BTC skyrocketed afterwards.
Sorry, I am not lying, it was just so long that I forgot what we paid for them. I have a mountain of PMs and I relied on my memory of what I thought we paid. Once again sorry I did not do this intentionally.
The reason why only 4 were even tested was because he and his technician waited until last minute before they were about to set off to Labrador to test the miners. After a very brief test of only half the machines they assumed the machines were faulty and forced me to accept the return. They then kept them for another 1-2weeks before shipping them back to me. Not sure why you mentioned the packaging. I offered insurance shipping there, but you rather avoid tariffs and self insured them. You also decided to not buy insurance on the return back, so any shipping damage is on you.
You know very well that I told you this and we did not test the other ones because we wanted to avoid getting blamed for any damage that may come as a result of the testing process. We wanted to keep your miners in a pristine condition. It took 1 to 2 weeks to convince you to take them back. Look we are not arguing about shipping damage for shit's sake. I told you already I will pay for shipping damage!! It was a risk we took both ways , yes, and we will cover the damage. The sticking point is and continues to be the fact that you will want to be compensated for "depreciation".
What risk are we talking about here? That a buyer would test miners with faulty PSUs then blame it on the seller? The problem is you held my gear up and tried to make me pickup the depreciation tab. The miners work fine and you admitted to your PSUs being the issue. You are breaching our agreement by backing out of it, so you should be responsible for the depreciation costs. If I chose to hold the gear under my own free will then that would be a totally different story.
*sigh* again with the PSUs. The PSUs are not faulty. They power other miners just fine. It's just your Neptunes that had issues with them. I told you this already. At the time we did not have any other PSUs to use or test with. We decided rather than hold up your gear for longer it would just be best for BOTH parties to send your gear back! We were trying to do you a favor. You got the gear back in the beginning of December, and you sat on your ass and did not test them until the beginning of January. If depreciation is such a boogeyman for you why did not put a greater importance on this? Were you sure that you could hold us on the hook for depreciation.
Seller offered no $ figures of any sort.
13BTC
Give me a detailed breakdown, don't just pull a btc figure out of your ass cause you feel 4.7 btc is what you are owed for nothing. You want $2K compensation in total?!
I need you to justify what you think is the current market value of each rig, your "time", your repair costs.
Once again, give me detailed breakdown and I will discuss it with my associate and see if it's a reasonable loss to take to get you off our backs and never deal with you again!
I agreed to take them back because you were blaming the miners for being faulty. I would have told you to take a hike, if you wanted to return them because your power supplies are faulty. You breached the agreement, plain and simple. You returned miners that were as advertised. You should be responsible for any losses I have incurred, which included depreciation.
I'm still blaming them for being faulty with expected settings and under normal conditions. You will see the next person you sell them to will tell you the same, but anyways, that is besides the point. It could end up being that way or it could not. We wanted to run all cubes at stock 475 MHz with PSUs that power SP20s and S5s just fine. No issues there. Just your Neptunes. I have no idea what power supplies you use. You told me you have fans blowing on them and other ghetto rigging. No doubt that is to cool the VRMS or whatever cause your Neptunes have no thermals pads and the VRMS will easily overheat and shutdown. This leads to dead dies that do not come back until a power cycle. That is what was happening in our case.
It was my fault for not double and triple checking with you every fine details. I do remember at first that I confused myself and though they were batch 1 Neptunes. Only later I found out they were compensation units. I asked you what hashrate I should expect, and you said 3.0 ~ . We expected them to hash at around 2.9 to 3.0 TH. Nope, that was not the case. 1.5 to 2.0, 2.3 were the kind of hash rates were were expecting.
Selfish? From the guy that returned working product and leave the seller holding the bag. I am a reasonable person, we can negotiate the compensation. If you don't believe I should be compensated then there is no point in negotiating. What risks? That a buyer will return working product a month later? This isn't eBay, you go do your scam there.
How are you holding the back man! Explain!! You have the gear in hand and we did NOT damage it. You can hash!
Of course I believe you should be compensated but it should be fair for BOTH of us, not just the most you can squeeze from US. I agreed to pay you for repair costs of the 3 damaged cubes, your shipping costs, and as you said "your time". Not sure what $ value you'll put on your time but as long as it's reasonable I will pay it. If you can give me a total of how many hours you spent testing the units and getting them to hash to your liking and what hourly rate you expect to be paid I will once again pay that.
We want this behind us with no hard feelings as much as you do, but don't try to lord it over us an think that just because you are a seller the buyer gets no protection and we are at your mercy.
If you are a reasonable person than let's negotiate the compensation. Don't accuse us of being scammers. We are not. I realize this is not ebay but I think that resonable buyer protection rules should still apply. Just because this is a btc transaction does not mean we are in the wild west.
Find these buyers who would buy it for $700 each. I would sell it to them and we can use $700 in BTC to calculate the compensation.
Have you tried to sell them again or not? Put it for sale and see - either here or on ebay or wherever you want. We don't care for how much you sell them for. We paid a specific $ figure at the time of purchase and we expect a refund of that amount. As you said it's $600 per Neptune rig. The shipping you pre-paid we will pay you back. The repair costs, we will pay for. The time you put into testing we will pay you for it. Simple! We ask for nothing more. I even told you we'd offer a bit of extra money on top as a sorry for wasting your time payment.
Selfish hypocrites are going to be selfish hypocrites. How about this? If you think I had no loses then I offer you to be in my position. I ship the miners back to you on my dime and you release the escrowed funds to me. You can be in my shoes, as easy as that.
Us selfish?! That is uncalled for and you know it. If your gear performed as expected we'd would've gladly kept them and even so gladly accept them again. The only reason you're offering this now is cause you are being selfish too and you think that you will hit a windfall cause btc price is higher. We paid for them in $ terms and that's all that should be factored into this. If btc price would be lower than when you sold them you would NOT be even offering this.
You know this and stop trying to take us for fools.
From the above conversation, he actually says that he would return them even if he found them to be working. Buyer's remorse? You be the judge.
Be careful when dealing with Allivain. It will get ugly when the shit hits the fans with him.
Ummm, no we returned them without testing the other 4 cubes because we did not have the time to test them and mess around with them. My associate had to leave for Labrador and could not spend 4 to 5 days messing with your unstable gear. Rather than waste our time and yours further (by keeping your gear idle longer) we decided that we'd ship them ALL back including the untested ones and let you see if you can sort them out.
This decision was a loss cutting decision and I thought at the time it is what you wanted too. You never said or mentioned ANYTHING about depreciation compensation BEFORE we sent you back your gear. Had I known about this beforehand I may have never sent it back. This is unfair and a bait and switch. Anyone can see this is not a fair business practice.
I've sold and bought a ton of gear here and I've never had any problems with any transactions except YOU. If anything people should be careful when dealing with YOU as you try to do everything in your power to have everything work in YOUR favor without any loss. This has been your whole attitude.
I don't think we are on the same page with the situation here. It is starting to become obvious that this is your negligence. The miners I have tested are all working so far.
I will need to be compensated fully for any lost you have caused me for returning the units. It isn't just as easy as I return your BTC in full and I am shit out of luck.
So let me finish testing them and we can talk about the compensation.
Depreciation exists. So if you aren't paying for it, why should I?
If you want to sort this out here is what I need from you:
1) What market value you think these miners have NOW in $. We can then subtract that from the purchase price. Even though I do NOT agree that you should be compensated for depreciation we are curious to know what figure you come up with.
2) A $ figure for your repair costs for those 3 cubes that got damaged during shipping
3) A $ figure for your time spent testing them and ensuring they hash to your liking
4) Shipping costs we know and those I will cover. I covered shipping costs back to you already.