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Author Topic: No trade too small (6 BTC) for 'them' to come after.  (Read 1576 times)
The Sceptical Chymist
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January 25, 2016, 01:59:43 AM
 #21

Why oh why do people come here to cry about their trading decisions?  The market is impersonal and doesn't give a fuck about you and there's no conspiracy.

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NorrisK
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January 25, 2016, 07:51:25 AM
 #22

Why oh why do people come here to cry about their trading decisions?  The market is impersonal and doesn't give a fuck about you and there's no conspiracy.

They did price analysis and used trading strategies to determine their entry and exit points.

It sucks when they were just a little bit too narrow and doesn't always work for bitcoin, hence the crying.
MatTheCat (OP)
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January 25, 2016, 08:06:13 AM
 #23

Why oh why do people come here to cry about their trading decisions?  The market is impersonal and doesn't give a fuck about you and there's no conspiracy.

They did price analysis and used trading strategies to determine their entry and exit points.

It sucks when they were just a little bit too narrow and doesn't always work for bitcoin, hence the crying.

Precisely.

This was a scalp trade, targeting just a $10 move, off a point that *should* have been the top. Stops had to be tight, because r/r was tight. But anyone buying any amount of Bitcoin (for the 'right' reasons) post the time where I shorted, would have needed to have had their fucking head read. Very weak rise up to $406, with raging divergence confirming on 15 min charts. Spot also tagged 61.8% range Short RLZ.

However, it didn't work on this occassion, because the whole BTC market actually moved against my 6 BTC Stop Order, which I find utterly astonishing. Or should I say, Bitfinex moved against my position, and other markets mimicked thier trading. Had I not placed my trade or my Stop Order rather, then the market would never have moved up one last gasp beyond the $406.15 high, when momentum was clearly retreating.

Like I say, no position too small for 'them' to come after.

I can only conclude that much of the volume on all exchanges is just fakery. 'Padding' to give traders the impression that they are playing against the market, other than the reality which is they are playing against the Bucket Shops, and the Bucket Shops has tricks up its sleave to ensure it is the favourite to win.


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January 25, 2016, 04:16:31 PM
 #24

If you have to use a stop order then your exposure is too high  Wink

spazzdla
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January 25, 2016, 04:25:15 PM
 #25

where did you trade?

On this occasion.

Bitfinex.

My Stop made the Top of the Market.

6 BTC.

6 FKN BTC!!!!!

And they came after it....

Makes you think how much that volume is even real, and how much is just utter fkn bullshit.

Ain't that the truth :S..

Any REAL action in buying and dear lord..
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January 25, 2016, 04:37:48 PM
 #26

If you have to use a stop order then your exposure is too high  Wink

We are talking about non-hodl issues here. We like to preserve capital Smiley

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January 25, 2016, 04:52:39 PM
 #27

You realize, matthecat, that what you're saying is that Bitfinex has painted a bullseye on you, specifically. Obviously there are bigger fish to fry out there if they're stop-hunting on their own exchange. Surely even when you got stopped out, there must have been bigger orders that could have gotten the same treatment. So why did they go after you?

Is it that you have the mark of death on you? Or is it that you're just seeing things that aren't there?

Selling out to advertisers shows you respect neither yourself nor the rest of us.
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January 25, 2016, 06:00:09 PM
 #28

What can I say, the odds of winning with the bitcoin market is getting worse for everyone. One should not forget, that this isn't simply a zero-sum game.
A large part of the speculator money is flowing to mining, to develop and build faster ASICs and to pay the electric bills. This part has gone out of proportion since 2014 Q4, when the price took a deep plunge, but the mining sector kept expanding and overheating. Most of the new coins are sold OTC to professional traders who will use their experience + the weight of their wealth to overplay most.
All this makes the market environment very hostile, with wealth leaking out and the competition being strong. Small players can only make their bets blind, because they don't have the information processing capabilities of their competition, nor the weight of their available wealth.
You'll have better odds with alts, that have smaller markets. If you properly learn a new smaller market, then you'll have much better odds and you have more control of the outcome.

In my eyes, the bitcoin market is currently extremely fragile and a catastrophic collapse of value is probable. My main surprise is that it already hasn't happened yet. This could be because of the corrupt exchanges that have brought non existent money into the market, like MtGox did. When Karpeles started buying bitcoins with willybot and dollars he didn't actually have, then this caused the rise of 2014 Q4. Now I think that the non-existent wealth is only used to keep the price from a collapse, because "any minute now big investor money will start flowing into the market, and we can cover our previous losses!!1".
Greed makes people stupid like that..


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spazzdla
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January 25, 2016, 07:09:58 PM
 #29

You realize, matthecat, that what you're saying is that Bitfinex has painted a bullseye on you, specifically. Obviously there are bigger fish to fry out there if they're stop-hunting on their own exchange. Surely even when you got stopped out, there must have been bigger orders that could have gotten the same treatment. So why did they go after you?

Is it that you have the mark of death on you? Or is it that you're just seeing things that aren't there?

He is just claiming the situation is so bad exchanges are gaming the price to steal 6 BTC......  $2,300.00 .... ...

Exchanges giving out stop loss info and people moving on it is not something new..

They DID NOT go after him.. they went after $2k.... ...
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January 25, 2016, 07:20:21 PM
 #30

They DID NOT go after him.. they went after $2k.... ...

Hardly. The potential gain for Bitfinex would have been ([stop execution price] - [average buy price for position closed]) * 6 BTC. Since matthecat says he was looking to scalp a move on the order of 10 usd, I think it's pretty clear we're talking a maximum of a few hundred USD at the very most here.

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January 26, 2016, 12:07:02 AM
 #31

Nearly a good trade Mat. I think you have makings of a good trader. Keep your emotions in check. May the force be with you.
MatTheCat (OP)
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January 26, 2016, 12:27:02 AM
 #32

You realize, matthecat, that what you're saying is that Bitfinex has painted a bullseye on you, specifically. Obviously there are bigger fish to fry out there if they're stop-hunting on their own exchange. Surely even when you got stopped out, there must have been bigger orders that could have gotten the same treatment. So why did they go after you?

Is it that you have the mark of death on you? Or is it that you're just seeing things that aren't there?

Nope. Not a bullseye painted on me....

Just that their bot calculated....

Bucket Shop Volume - Real Volume + Stop Orders = Profit....

and off the bot went, after my, and no doubt a few other hapless traders orders.......

But from the several hundred BTC of volume that it took to run my Stop....how much was actually 'real'. I am thinking..not nearly as much as we may like to think.....Of course the exchange can plough through a few hundred worth of 'volume', if only 10% of it is actually orders from real (non exchange) customers and their is a juicy clutch of Stop Orders needing picked....

....these exchanges are bucket shops. Not only did they steal a few bucks from me by Running my Stop, they pervented me taking a considerable amount more money from them. Even if we are just talking little trades for pennies, as mine was, multiply that by 20 or 30 per day, and it soon adds up to a substantial income stream...not to mention substantial loss prevention...(they dont Stop Run people who are in losing trades...the market will take care of them all by itself).




Kraken Account, Robbed/Emptied. Kraken say "Fuck you, its your loss": https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1559553.msg15656643#msg15656643

Bitfinex victims. DO NOT TOUCH THE BFX TOKEN! Start moving it around, or trading it, and you will be construed as having accepted it as an alternative means of payment to your USD, BTC, etc.
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