Bitcoin is EXACTLY where it needs to be right now, what the hell!

[interbtc]

Recently i had to pay 10% fee to bank to pay smaller amount to a bussiness account, and if that's not a rip-off i dont know what is.
Ofc there are options to have 0 fee with banks, but sometimes you get f*cked.

Overall, bitcoin is perfect for almost anything, and in regards to the fee, i hope there will be a smart solution some time soon, so that we once again
can send coins with 0 fee and get confirms. I just don't think bigger blocks is the right answer to it

[1715241200]

1715241200

[1715241200]

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[rocks]

Recently i had to pay 10% fee to bank to pay smaller amount to a bussiness account, and if that's not a rip-off i dont know what is.
Ofc there are options to have 0 fee with banks, but sometimes you get f*cked.

Overall, bitcoin is perfect for almost anything, and in regards to the fee, i hope there will be a smart solution some time soon, so that we once again
can send coins with 0 fee and get confirms. I just don't think bigger blocks is the right answer to it

Right let's limit bitcoin to the equivalent of 1/4 of a Facebook page load every ten minutes, because 1/2 of a Facebook page load every ten minutes is impossible.

[SebastianJu]

I'm not sure where you live but sending 100 bucks from one bank account to another costs zero fee in my country. Holding the bank account is free too. So how should i explain why bitcoin needs higher fees now?

It's different when it comes to sending over country borders but rarely i get to know a person that needs to do this regularly.

The other advantage is the speed of course. But how long until we have fees like paypal have?

Where the heck do you get a free bank account in germany?

You don't have?  I have one since ages and when you search comparison websites then you will find alot of these banks. Mostly internet banks where you can use atm from other banks or atm that are part of cashpool.

For example i use netbank since years and they are fine. The only disadvantage for me is when i want to put in cheques. I have to mail them to them. Though that did happen only twice in all the time when i received cheques from escrow.com.

[SebastianJu]

I'm not sure where you live but sending 100 bucks from one bank account to another costs zero fee in my country. Holding the bank account is free too. So how should i explain why bitcoin needs higher fees now?

It's different when it comes to sending over country borders but rarely i get to know a person that needs to do this regularly.

The other advantage is the speed of course. But how long until we have fees like paypal have?

Instantly?

Fine.

$10,000+

Still instant?

Didn't try but i would think so or do you think some kind of observation program will start to check where the money comes from? Besides that there are no higher fees for higher transactions that i know of.

[SebastianJu]

I'm not sure where you live but sending 100 bucks from one bank account to another costs zero fee in my country. Holding the bank account is free too. So how should i explain why bitcoin needs higher fees now?

In Canada it's $1.50 to send an interac e-transfer, regardless of the amount.  And that's from my "no fee" account, which is in fact free.

Most big banks will only give you free transactions (and a limited number at that) if you keep at least a minimum amount in the account - something like $1000+.

In fact most german banks want a fee if you don't get your payment from job into it each month or something like that. But there are other banks that don't care about that. There the incoming money only has an effect on the automatically calculated size of the dispo credit.

I know the times when transactions would cost a fee but that is long gone.

I believe america might be different because it is the land of credit cards. In germany, or europe generally, credit cards are pretty uncommon. Most don't even have one. I, for example only have a vcc on a website. It's sufficient for when i need a credit card but seldom needed.

[SebastianJu]

but bitcoin anyway, allow you to move big funds, without anyone breaking your door and asking you why you transfered 10k+ of money, this is a big plus for me

I see what you mean but when the average person on the street is asking you "And for what do i need bitcoin?" then this most likely is not a good argument since it sounds very much like the dark side of bitcoin everyone fears bitcoin for in the real world.

[tss]

Recently i had to pay 10% fee to bank to pay smaller amount to a bussiness account, and if that's not a rip-off i dont know what is.
Ofc there are options to have 0 fee with banks, but sometimes you get f*cked.

Overall, bitcoin is perfect for almost anything, and in regards to the fee, i hope there will be a smart solution some time soon, so that we once again
can send coins with 0 fee and get confirms. I just don't think bigger blocks is the right answer to it

Right let's limit bitcoin to the equivalent of 1/4 of a Facebook page load every ten minutes, because 1/2 of a Facebook page load every ten minutes is impossible.

i am sure that you do understand that bitcoin is a decentralized worldwide financial system that gives you great powers to control your own destiny...  with that there must be some fees and some limits.  this isn't utopia world where everything is free and everyone gets what they want.  no one promised it as such.  

[Amph]

but bitcoin anyway, allow you to move big funds, without anyone breaking your door and asking you why you transfered 10k+ of money, this is a big plus for me

I see what you mean but when the average person on the street is asking you "And for what do i need bitcoin?" then this most likely is not a good argument since it sounds very much like the dark side of bitcoin everyone fears bitcoin for in the real world.

well that's my point, they always think that when you move big amount of money, you're "money laundering" or you've done a criminal activity and stuff like that, i hate this

i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe, or for whatever other reasons, can i do this without the monitoring of my money each time? it's really frustrating

it's like someone watching you each day while you take your dump at bathroom

[CuntChocula]

<>
i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe, or for whatever other reasons, can i do this without the monitoring of my money each time? it's really frustrating

it's like someone watching you each day while you take your dump at bathroom

AML laws = someone watching you poop?
Considered spending some of those funds on psychiatric help.

*Also love "i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe"

[uki]

I'm not sure where you live but sending 100 bucks from one bank account to another costs zero fee in my country. Holding the bank account is free too. So how should i explain why bitcoin needs higher fees now?

In Canada it's $1.50 to send an interac e-transfer, regardless of the amount.  And that's from my "no fee" account, which is in fact free.

Most big banks will only give you free transactions (and a limited number at that) if you keep at least a minimum amount in the account - something like $1000+.

In fact most german banks want a fee if you don't get your payment from job into it each month or something like that. But there are other banks that don't care about that. There the incoming money only has an effect on the automatically calculated size of the dispo credit.

I know the times when transactions would cost a fee but that is long gone.

I believe america might be different because it is the land of credit cards. In germany, or europe generally, credit cards are pretty uncommon. Most don't even have one. I, for example only have a vcc on a website. It's sufficient for when i need a credit card but seldom needed.

I don't agree that the credit cards are pretty uncommon in Europe - I wouldn't generalise that quickly.
You are right about Germany, when most prefer the cash, and even most of the banks somehow push you to either use cash directly (many offer cards that you can withdraw money from ATMs worldwide at no fees, but charge you fees if you pay with the same card in a restaurant outside of Eurozone), or indirectly via debit cards. But that is not the case for Spain or Ireland. At least that is the experience that I had. In Spain I always had a credit card that offered the best deals when paying driectly with the card, and charged you fees if you wanted to withdraw money from atm (opposite to German system). Same for Ireland.

[Amph]

<>
i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe, or for whatever other reasons, can i do this without the monitoring of my money each time? it's really frustrating

it's like someone watching you each day while you take your dump at bathroom

AML laws = someone watching you poop?
Considered spending some of those funds on psychiatric help.

*Also love "i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe"

it was an analogy, to say that they control everything you do with your fucking money, it's like if the money are always owned by them

the example make sense, what if i want to move my funds from a bank to under my pillow? i can not without wasting plenty of days, because there is a withdrawal limit of 500 in cash

and also you must tell them why you're doing so and shit like that, they are never your money, never, only with bitcoin they are truly your money, i can do whatever i want with my coins

[CuntChocula]

<>
i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe, or for whatever other reasons, can i do this without the monitoring of my money each time? it's really frustrating

it's like someone watching you each day while you take your dump at bathroom

AML laws = someone watching you poop?
Considered spending some of those funds on psychiatric help.

*Also love "i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe"

it was an analogy, to say that they control everything you do with your fucking money, it's like if the money are always owned by them

the example make sense, what if i want to move my funds from a bank to under my pillow? i can not without wasting plenty of days, because there is a withdrawal limit of 500 in cash

and also you must tell them why you're doing so and shit like that, they are never your money, never, only with bitcoin they are truly your money, i can do whatever i want with my coins

You're not free to do anything with your money for the same reason you aren't free to poop anywhere & whenever you feel like it: because you live in a fucking society.
Society tries to balance your creepy craving to stuff cash in pillows with the needs of others.
If you absolutely must do whatever you want any time you feel like it, go live on Mars. 100% fiat-free.

[SebastianJu]

snip
Recently these past weeks I have seen an increase of negative articles covering some Bitcoin issues relating to transaction speed and fees.
/snip

these articles and coverage are a two fold attack. 
first is to make it seem like there's a problem and you shouldn't use bitcoin.
the second more pressing issue is that there should be reform and "fixing" the problems. 
the goal of this is to destroy bitcoin as you know it.

nothing good will come out of changing the basic nature of bitcoin.

BITCOIN IS PERFECT JUST AS IT IS!

The basic nature of bitcoin is safety through encryption or 21mio coins max. But surely not an arbitrary setting that everyone knew would have to be taken out at one point in time in order to not hinder adoption.

I wonder how you imagine that satoshi envisioned a widely adopted bitcoin without taking out that temporary spam protection.

[SebastianJu]

I'm not sure where you live but sending 100 bucks from one bank account to another costs zero fee in my country. Holding the bank account is free too. So how should i explain why bitcoin needs higher fees now?

It's different when it comes to sending over country borders but rarely i get to know a person that needs to do this regularly.

The other advantage is the speed of course. But how long until we have fees like paypal have?

Where the heck do you get a free bank account in germany?

Many bank accounts are free in Germany, and some checking accounts even offer you interest rates and other advantages. You even have the right to a bank account in Germany now, even if you are homeless and have no income. Just look around. Use google. With sepa transfers you can send money anywhere in the EU within one day, by default free of charge!

i just did and i have to say i'm not really impressed.
there are only a handful of middle sized banks that offer a free bank account which usually have some kind of drawback.

at the bigger banks you pay in average 10-30++ € pa. depending on your account. ( "Kontoführungsgebühren")

For what do you need a big bank? Because of ATM to get cash? Then check out those banks that are owned by a bigger bank. You can use the atm of the big bank then too. Or search for a bank that is part of the cashpool, which allows you to withdraw for free from many other banks atm too.

[Ya-ing]

Yes, we should be able to move high ammounts more freely, and Bitcoin is still doing that pretty well. Go Bitcoin.

[SebastianJu]

I just don't think bigger blocks is the right answer to it

But there is simply NO way around it if we really want broad adoption. It is, in my eyes, no solution to start to NOT use bitcoin anymore so ofte, like what it means with using lightning network. Segwit is interesting but it seems very limited in it's effect.

[Amph]

<>
i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe, or for whatever other reasons, can i do this without the monitoring of my money each time? it's really frustrating

it's like someone watching you each day while you take your dump at bathroom

AML laws = someone watching you poop?
Considered spending some of those funds on psychiatric help.

*Also love "i only want to move my funds on another place, for more security maybe"

it was an analogy, to say that they control everything you do with your fucking money, it's like if the money are always owned by them

the example make sense, what if i want to move my funds from a bank to under my pillow? i can not without wasting plenty of days, because there is a withdrawal limit of 500 in cash

and also you must tell them why you're doing so and shit like that, they are never your money, never, only with bitcoin they are truly your money, i can do whatever i want with my coins

You're not free to do anything with your money for the same reason you aren't free to poop anywhere & whenever you feel like it: because you live in a fucking society.
Society tries to balance your creepy craving to stuff cash in pillows with the needs of others.
If you absolutely must do whatever you want any time you feel like it, go live on Mars. 100% fiat-free.

well the analogy is bad since i can not poop anywhere for obvious reason, but restricting my money usage, is practically restricting my freedom

i'm lucky that bitcoin is here and i can say fuck to that corrupted society we are living in, and i'll do my best to pay as few taxes as possible

[CuntChocula]

...
i'm lucky that bitcoin is here and i can say fuck to that corrupted society we are living in, and i'll do my best to pay as few taxes as possible

That's why we can't have nice things.

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