[ANN][LSK] Lisk | Blockchain Application Platform for JavaScript Developers

[MrWhiteBites]

Morgen Today...

Morgen ist es soweit

The Lisk rocket takes off!

Rocket just blew past the Ethereum rocket that falling back to earth with a BIG Crash!   Vitalik Butterin Cashing out Ethereum to buy LISK!

[michaelwang33]

You won't find a project in Crypto that is already finished and big business. All big projects are work in progress and about future potential. Or do you believe Ethereum is already worth it's marketcap for real? Or Factom, my favorite, also not the system yet it will be after the release of the full protocol.

The question is not, if a system is perfect at launch. No project ever was, and Ethereum was pretty scary btw. (and still is in my opinion). The question is, if a team has the ability to realize what is planned - and if they are able to work hard, if they are serious and legit. And of course it's also about the potential business-model.

The thing is: If you analyze all this in LISK, there may be weak points like everywhere. But what I'm totally sure about: The idea has a lot of potential. The team is legit and hard working and growing. And they have a plan.

Just for example: Many believe the marketing is just about the price. But it's not. It's out of the conclusion that a project needs attention, not just because of exchanges and trading, but even more to grow, to attract Devs to develop for LISK. And the combination of a lot of attention and financial incentive (not too cheap prices) is very promising.

If it will work out as planned, and if they are able to avoid mistakes that would be hard to solve, LISK has a lot of potential. In short- and even more in longterm.

indeed ive never once said ethereum should be where it is. if it is you thank whales. ive just pulled out a weak point something i noticed and have said they have money to close these flaws. others saying if they set it up wrong but shouldn't the funds be protected from the start why does lisk even give developers the option to "SET IT UP CORRECTLY". then they say dapps when the owner can run off with the funds. if they set it up correctly then it won't be misused but if it isn't bye bye user's funds.

max even said he is working on this to make it more trustless

Nothing wrong with it to point on possible weaknesses. I just wanted to say that it's always about good development, finding solutions and before all: avoiding steps that would lead into a direction with possibly unsolvable problems. I believe that is one of the highest risk in all projects, because the technology is very young. LISK has one big advantage in my opinion: the side-chain-concept on a stable base. That already has some value because it can grow into all kinds of use-cases.  

indeed max spoke of blockstream facing the same issues which they have not resolved yet

a second thing i wanted to ask was the DPoS protocol for dApps differs in that the dApp creator PERSONALLY APPROVES who can "mine" the dapp-sidechain. if a value is associated with an appcoin in a sidechain, against LISK, or a decent buy-wall is built for it, dapp owners can adjust the DPOS list of active delegates and abuse the system to gain disproportionate mining rewards, short term. the validity checking for delegate voting on the main chain may be open enough to scrutiny, but dapp sidechains on LISK dont have that

[sluppy]

If Polo & Kraken don't offer Lisk on launch,are you guys still gonna go for Yo Bit and Bloombit?

100% not Bloombit. YoBit maybe.

Chances that Kraken will list it on launch are 0.
Having 10btc or even 1btc on yobit is only for the brave/stupid.
Hopefully Bittrex and Poloniex will list it from launch but that's up to the devs if they reached out to them or they could spend some of the ICO to get us on at least one "trustworthy" exchange.(bittrex lists for money)

Personally id be very hesitant to send anything of real value to Yobit or Bloombit.

[LiskHQ]

This means you "invest" into the sidechain. In this example legally the LSK on the app owner account belongs to him. There are more solutions. Additionally, the blockchain industry and our team consists of extremely intelligent individuals who will find even more solutions. We are releasing now to see exactly how Lisk sidechains should be structured, we want to build our product around the user.

[ibrahim11]

If Polo & Kraken don't offer Lisk on launch,are you guys still gonna go for Yo Bit and Bloombit?

No we're going to bittrex and btc-e  

Is bittrex adding it tonight?

We don't know, all we know for sure is yobit and c-cex are adding it tonight. IMO bittrex will add it tonight, there's money to be made from trading fees and bittrex won't want to let yobit cut into its profits.

I've transferred my btc to bittrex but then should I transfer some to C-cex??

[Black Mamba]

If Polo & Kraken don't offer Lisk on launch,are you guys still gonna go for Yo Bit and Bloombit?

100% not Bloombit. YoBit maybe.

Chances that Kraken will list it on launch are 0.
Having 10btc or even 1btc on yobit is only for the brave/stupid.
Hopefully Bittrex and Poloniex will list it from launch but that's up to the devs if they reached out to them or they could spend some of the ICO to get us on at least one "trustworthy" exchange.(bittrex lists for money)

Personally id be very hesitant to send anything of real value to Yobit or Bloombit.

No problem

More cheap coins on yobit and c-cex for me  

[rtrtcrypto]

Thx.

Will be at the lambo dealership on your belief 
Good luck.

Launch time, plz?
EST

Thx

4pm est

[CryptoNoob1]

I used Bittrex for a while and can confirm they are much better than Yobit! whoever adds Lisk will make some decent trading fees off the volume

[Zenyoguibit]

Folks, just a little reminder:

FUD is not a bad sign because it's always with intention. What does it say between the lines?

Most important: Those who spread FUD are not invested.  

What could their intentions be?

Sometimes they act out of psychological weaknesses, envy for example. But mostly they act out of competition with a project they are invested in, or/and because they want to buy cheap.


What they don't do: Writing posts with good arguments to underline negative claims.

Conclusion: FUD is a good sign.

Total agree!!!

[michaelwang33]

This means you "invest" into the sidechain. In this example legally the LSK on the app owner account belongs to him. There are more solutions. Additionally, the blockchain industry and our team consists of extremely intelligent individuals who will find even more solutions. We are releasing now to see exactly how Lisk sidechains should be structured, we want to build our product around the user.

yes i got my answer from max. users would just need to be cautious that dapp owner doesn't fool them and they set it up correctly.

liskhq the second issue was this one

the DPoS protocol for dApps differs in that the dApp creator PERSONALLY APPROVES who can "mine" the dapp-sidechain. if a value is associated with an appcoin in a sidechain, against LISK, or a decent buy-wall is built for it, dapp owners can adjust the DPOS list of active delegates and abuse the system to gain disproportionate mining rewards, short term. the validity checking for delegate voting on the main chain may be open enough to scrutiny, but dapp sidechains on LISK dont have that

[IOTUSA]

If Polo & Kraken don't offer Lisk on launch,are you guys still gonna go for Yo Bit and Bloombit?

100% not Bloombit. YoBit maybe.

Chances that Kraken will list it on launch are 0.
Having 10btc or even 1btc on yobit is only for the brave/stupid.
Hopefully Bittrex and Poloniex will list it from launch but that's up to the devs if they reached out to them or they could spend some of the ICO to get us on at least one "trustworthy" exchange.(bittrex lists for money)

Personally id be very hesitant to send anything of real value to Yobit or Bloombit.

No reason to trade on shit exchanges when the REAL exchanges will list lisk in hours or days. The $10 value isn't coming for a few months anyway.

[mirrorcrax]

If Polo & Kraken don't offer Lisk on launch,are you guys still gonna go for Yo Bit and Bloombit?

100% not Bloombit. YoBit maybe.

Chances that Kraken will list it on launch are 0.
Having 10btc or even 1btc on yobit is only for the brave/stupid.
Hopefully Bittrex and Poloniex will list it from launch but that's up to the devs if they reached out to them or they could spend some of the ICO to get us on at least one "trustworthy" exchange.(bittrex lists for money)

Personally id be very hesitant to send anything of real value to Yobit or Bloombit.

No problem

More cheap coins on yobit and c-cex for me  

I'm currently checking out Yo Bit but it's full of very strange coins, the troll box is overflowing with FUDers and people with ridiculous claims and messages (much of which is spam). I also can't seem to find any legal information on the company/ owners ...etc.

Also, after seeing Max's warning regarding IOU's and Yobit continuing to trade it, I feel a bit skeptical.

[Block By Block]

Roughly 4 hours till launch!
There's going to be some very nice arbitrage opportunities between all the exchanges once it goes live.

[Wolf Rainer]

4 hours to launch and still no confirmed exchanges? Very unprofesionally.

[ewibit]

what was the dollar price per lisk if you contributed to the crowdsale on day 1?

About 0.08 $

is this price of 0.08 $ with the bonus or not?
thx

[Msile]

Can I invest in Lambo stocks? Because apparently every ICO'er AND the DEVS are buying a Lambo?

[etoque]

4 hours to launch and still no confirmed exchanges? Very unprofesionally.

Also how to access our lisk ? I,ve done the thing on website but my passphrase show me 0 lisk lel (it was testnet I suppose)

[DM0000]

Somebody can explain me, why LISK better than eth?

LISK HOLDS THE FOLLOWING ADVANTAGES OVER ETHERIUM:

Javascript language simplicity vs Solidity language complexity
Like I said ... easy to write a Javascript compiler to Ethereum bytecode  
Let me know when it's done...or even started.  Even if an Ethereum JavaScript compiler  existed, Solidity is still an unstable language - why paste a compiler on top of it?

100,000+ JavaScript programmers vs. few Solidity programmers
The above argument eliminates this so called advantage of lisk
The above argument is vaporware.  JavaScript programmers can start coding Lisk dapps right now.

Single hash generated  vs. trillions of valid but discarded hashes generated to secure blockchain in one blocktime
Makes no sense at all
I've explained this several times.  Churning out trillions of wasted hashes means lots of wasted electricity - like literally a nuclear powerplant's worth for Bitcoin - and is an ever-growing financial overhead that will ultimately kill the coin.

GO LSK GO!

Cooperative, efficient blockchain generation vs. competitive, wasteful blockchain generation
looks like the same as above
No, it's the key reason Lisk can run on a $9 CHIP computer and Ethereum can't.  Economies of scale hugely favor Lisk over BTC/ETH.

Stable roundtable clockwork forging vs. unsustainable, exponentially growing free-for-all mining
Forging is no different than mining ... just different ways to make the currency
It is so sad to see people that don't understand enough math to get why exponential growth is unsustainable, or why a stable system is different and better from an unstable one.

Dapps on individual sidechains vs. dapps on bloated mainchain
Ethereum dapps are also sidechains .. lol .. you seem to be uninformed
The Ethereum Guide says its dapps are deployed on the mainchain ( https://gavofyork.gitbooks.io/turboethereum/content/dapps_deployment.html ).  Practically, in Ethereum dapps are just specialized "contracts".  There's my showdown cards in this poker hand - what's your counter-reference to prove what you are saying about Ethereum sidechains?  Prove to me that each dapp in Ethereum has its own separate blockchain as they do in Lisk.

Min of 2-4 to max of 101 cheap $35 Pi2 / $9 CHIP microcomputers needed for each sidechain backbone vs. large, unlimited numbers of expensive GPU systems needed for mainchain backbone
The GPU rings will not be used once POS for eth sets in
So...PoS for ETH is vaporware, got it.  How can you know that Eth PoS will run on microcomputers like Lisk does if ETH PoS finally shows up?  What happens to all those sad little GPU miners whose income stream will be cut off?

Sidechain dapps permanently free vs. mainchain perpetual "gas" payments required
Ah ... What can possibly be the use of the beloved LISK then ...
What part of "free" vs. "paying for ETH gas" is so hard to understand?  Free is better.  Lisk is still the exchange coin of choice within the dapp itself.

Difference between Lisk Forging and Ethereum Mining

With Lisk, generating a new block for the blockchain is called "forging" (in the "blacksmith" instead of the "counterfeiter" sense of that term), not mining.  Mining is a Bitcoin / Etherium term that refers to competitive generation of thousands of millions of billions of useless hashes looking for a string of leading zeros in the hash that is a "lucky ticket" declaring a particular miner to be the winner of a reward.  Forging is a cooperative  generation of one and only one necessary hash to secure the Lisk blockchain, for which you are paid a set fee when it's your turn to do it.  During the first year a Lisk forger makes 5 Lisk per block forged, which happens like clockwork about once every 17 minutes, for a total of 150K Lisk in the first year.

In a pure PoS system, the richest coin holders that set up a forging node get most of the rewards from running those nodes.  With DPoS, anybody can set up a forging node no matter how much or how little of the coin they hold, as long as they pay (for Lisk) a 100 coin start fee.   Under DPoS, a poor coin holder / node runner gets the same rewards as a rich coin holder / node runner.  Thus there is incentive for poor coin holders to run a good node to increase their coin holdings.  Since there's a lot more poor coin holders than rich ones, the pool of potential node runners is much bigger.  This is a Good Thing.

Lisk generating only one hash per blocktime is one of its huge advantages over Bitcoin and Ethereum and their huge waste of resources.  

Lisk is literally trillions of times more efficient in CPU cycles per block generated compared to Bitcoin or Ethereum.  This is why Lisk can use really cheap computers, while Bitcoin and Ethereum are trapped forever to use a hugely expensive, wasteful and unneeded overhead infrastructure - all those warehouses full of mining rigs, whether ASIC or GPU based.

Now THAT'S stupid - and most Bitcoin and Ethereum people have no idea just how stupid it is.  

Lisk Coin Inflation Is Much Lower Than Ethereum Coin Inflation

-snip-

... Further down the road Lisk very well might have his own DAO, so it's important to know.

-snip-

For this very reason, it will be foolish to sell any Lisk before this inevitable Lisk DAO crowdsale, which may be announced sooner than we think, since @LiskHQ is pretty much confirming it here.

Some ETH ICO participants are using same ETH they bought at $0.30 to buy 100 DAO tokens, while some of you are buying 100 DAO for $10 (current price of 1 ETH)

History will repeat itself, some Lisk ICO participants will be using same Lisk they bought for $0.10 to buy Lisk DAO tokens, while most people will be buying them for $5 to $10 to $20...

GO LISK GO!

[Msile]

what was the dollar price per lisk if you contributed to the crowdsale on day 1?

About 0.08 $

is this price of 0.08 $ with the bonus or not?
thx

It's an estimation, it also depends on BTC price when you invested it.

I invested 2 BTC and got 0.15 BTC bonus.  So  2.15 BTC / 11800 (amount of LISK I got) = 0.0001822 BTC is about 0.081 $  (so without bonuses because I used the .15 in the calculation)

[Spratan]

I have just seen there is a 2000 $ trade limit on bittrex. So nobody will sell big if it is the main exchange.