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Author Topic: How many of you have actually used Ethereum as a smart contract system?  (Read 1589 times)
commandrix
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February 03, 2016, 02:42:46 AM
 #1

Just out of curiosity. I have an idea for something I could do with smart contracts but I'd like to know exactly where the "state of the art" is before I do.
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February 03, 2016, 08:49:43 AM
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A friend of mine was programming something there, but not finished right now.
But there are some if you google about this, but most of them are not finished.
I guess Lisk/Crypti would be the easier plattform for Smart Contracts, because you can use their JavaScrypt to make decentral Apps.
Problem is of course, at the moment nobody knows about Crypti/Lisk...

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February 03, 2016, 03:44:13 PM
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Just out of curiosity. I have an idea for something I could do with smart contracts but I'd like to know exactly where the "state of the art" is before I do.

it's a get rich quick scam coin so don't expecting to use it anytime soon.

ethereum platform references ---- nick szabo - the father of smart contracts - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Szabo
gav wood - the father and creator/coder of piece of shzit etherieum platform - http://gavwood.com
butterin vitalic - the little freak scammer left to take care of broken shzit platform which he is forking nonstop - he don't even believe in crypto so is gav wood before he made millions. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1979233.80
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February 03, 2016, 03:55:34 PM
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How many actually ran a smart contract on a large 1000+ decentralized node mining network and ran it at production transaction rates?

They can't. Ethereum is broken for that sort of real world application.

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February 03, 2016, 04:04:12 PM
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Silly PTSD, Ethereum will scale!

because you forgot about the sharding!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYJjR3dd1I8#t=42s

I didn't forget sharding. I explained why it is nonsense. Why do fools always disrespect me ("PTSD").  Roll Eyes

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February 03, 2016, 04:36:14 PM
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Came into this post just out of curiosity and to lear more about ethereum contracts. Feel a bit discouraged as I see there is no contract running that users can refer to. Does not looks like it is going well.

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February 03, 2016, 06:07:19 PM
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Came into this post just out of curiosity and to lear more about ethereum contracts. Feel a bit discouraged as I see there is no contract running that users can refer to. Does not looks like it is going well.

Don't worry, it's just clueless shitcoin bagholders spreading FUD as usual.  Move on nothing to see here.

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February 04, 2016, 03:11:30 PM
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how is their smart contract system compared to blackcoins/bitbays?

I thought blackcoin was the first with smart contracts?

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February 04, 2016, 03:25:49 PM
 #9

how is their smart contract system compared to blackcoins/bitbays?

I thought blackcoin was the first with smart contracts?

bithalo/blackhalo/blackcoins smart contracts is more advance and worked
get rich quick premined scam eth is still poking around and soon to be out of money and abandoned, every devs is millionaires.

ethereum platform references ---- nick szabo - the father of smart contracts - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Szabo
gav wood - the father and creator/coder of piece of shzit etherieum platform - http://gavwood.com
butterin vitalic - the little freak scammer left to take care of broken shzit platform which he is forking nonstop - he don't even believe in crypto so is gav wood before he made millions. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1979233.80
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February 05, 2016, 12:53:13 AM
 #10

how is their smart contract system compared to blackcoins/bitbays?

I thought blackcoin was the first with smart contracts?

bithalo/blackhalo/blackcoins smart contracts is more advance and worked
get rich quick premined scam eth is still poking around and soon to be out of money and abandoned, every devs is millionaires.

Thanks.  I believe your broken english empty scam accusations are bullish for eth value.

Haters gonna hate.

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February 05, 2016, 11:37:25 AM
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Here's a cool example of a useful smart contract app

http://www.blocktech.com

using ipfs/bitcoin/ether/florincoin/etc.

I'd use it anyway.

Sorry but afaics that sucks.

I can't find any mention of how it uses Ethereum? Appears it is using Florincoin. If it is using Ethereum, that doesn't mean Ethereum can scale decentralized (which I have already explained it can't!).

Nevertheless, there are other flaws in this Alexandria project.

1. It is relying on IPFS, which is a decentralied file storage system. IPFS is interesting for orthogonal reasons (which I will discuss below), but there is an insoluble flaw of decentralized file storage in that copyrighted content illegally distributed without compensating the copyright owner, can't be forceably removed from all nodes, and thus the protocol ends up banned by hosts[1]. Not only is it economically and technologically unrealistic to fight the enforcement of copyrights by having users stand up their own nodes connected over asymmetric upload bandwidth of home ISPs[1], but it also deprives all of us of the Knowledge Age decentralized economic ecosystem and social networking we will need to implement the Knowledge Age devolution of the corporation (see the last link in [1]). Note it might be possible to design a decentralized file storage system that enforce removal orders and enforced per-per-download royalties to the copyright holder, it is impossible for these decisions to be made without centralizing the control over these decisions. I suppose one could dream up a design where all the nodes voted and reached a consensus about each copyright claim, and the participants would be motivated to do the right thing so as to avoid the protocol being banned/regulated by government, such a design is going to suffer from unbounded preemption and thus will need to use centralized trust, so it is right back to being centralized after all.

2. In the video for Alexandria, note how he pins the files to his local computer in order to attain free access. But as soon as he has done downloading, he can unpin and thus he has given nothing to the network if no one has downloaded the pinned files while he was downloading them. For this and other economic/marketing/technical reasons, the aims of this project are unrealistic and insoluble.


Regarding IPFS, I read some of the white paper and viewed some of the video presentation (which I highly recommend) and about 17 or 18 minute point it gets into the key points I want to share my analysis on. So I entirely agree with the creator of IPFS (Juan Benet) that resources should be referenced by hash rather than by URLs. As even he points out in his presentation, that is orthogonal to whether there is a decentralized protocol for storing these resources (and add my point that storing on home user's P2P servers such that copyright and royalties can't be enforced). And I entirely agree with him that we need a way to declare resources as immutable so they can be cached nearest to the use, which is needed both by offline use cases and to minimize redundant transfer of content (and Juan makes the astute point that bandwidth is not scaling as fast as storage nor CPU computation ... and I would draw the analogy to that the Scrypt paper also points out the same for RAM latency not scaling as fast as RAM storage and speed).

So how to we reconcile these needs and the issue of needing to enforce copyrights? We need a decentralized protocol because we don't want to rely on any one host or federated collusion of them (and also to wrap high availability and optimization in an algorithm/protocol versus inferior/non-interoperable adhoc solutions), and we need to record the copyright parameters in a block chain. But how can the block chain verifiers determine whose claim to a copyright is valid? I don't think there is an algorithmic way yet to determine for example if two songs are close enough (including for example in the case of musical content, DJ mix songs that resample other songs) in content to be a copyright violation? If there was, we could have a rule that the first person to sign a hash of content (and submit it to the block chain) is the copyright holder. But change even one bit of the content and the hash of the content changes. I believe there can be an algorithmic solution probably drawing from existing technologies that have not yet been applied to this problem. So then we'd need a way for the copyright holders of existing works which are already public (so any one could submit the hash to the block chain) to prepopulate their hashes on this block chain.

[1]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1340057.msg13670558#msg13670558
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1344997.msg13730325#msg13730325
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1342065.msg13782055#msg13782055 (alternate copy: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=355212.msg13782246#msg13782246)

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February 05, 2016, 11:50:27 AM
 #12

I've played around with some of the contracts that involved lottery/pyramid type games, just for fun. It's pretty cool how they work. There was no GUI, so obviously once those sorts of things are available it will be much better. I think for gambling type games, especially once augur gets implemented, there is real potential here. No guarantees of course, but much more interesting IMO than bitcoin blockchain at the moment.

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February 06, 2016, 10:04:32 AM
 #13

1. It is relying on IPFS, which is a decentralied file storage system. IPFS is interesting for orthogonal reasons (which I will discuss below), but there is an insoluble flaw of decentralized file storage in that copyrighted content illegally distributed without compensating the copyright owner, can't be forceably removed from all nodes, and thus the protocol ends up banned by hosts[1].

[...]

[1]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1340057.msg13670558#msg13670558
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1344997.msg13730325#msg13730325
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1342065.msg13782055#msg13782055 (alternate copy: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=355212.msg13782246#msg13782246)

I received a reply from Juan Bennet (author of IPFS) and he referred me to the following:

  • IPFS has as a design requirement that nodes be able to only store and/or distribute content they explicitly want to store and/or distribute. This means that computers that run IPFS nodes do not have to host "other people's stuff", which is a very important thing when you consider that lots of content in the internet is -- in some for or other -- illegal under certain jurisdictions.
  • IPFS nodes will be able to express policies, and subscribe to network allow/denylists and policies that express content storage and distribution requirements. This way, users and groups can express what content should or should not be stored and/or distributed. This is required by users to (a) comply with legal constraints in their respective countries, (b) required by users with stricter codes of conduct (i.e. content that is legal but undesired by a group -- e.g. a childrens website).

Question and Answers:

    Q: When I add content, what happens?
    A: It is stored in your local node, and made available to other nodes in your network, via advertising it on the routing system (i.e. the IPFS-DHT). The content is not sent to other nodes until they explicitly request it, though of course some content may already exist in the system (content-addressing).

I don't see how that solves the problem that IPFS is a protocol that enables people to advertising the availability of illegal content on the DHT, and then illegal content can move to new ephemeral nodes, i.e. Whack-A-Mole. Thus authorities are eventually very likely to regulate Hosts and tell them that by running IPFS they are providing hosting for a DHT which routes illegal content. IPFS can infringe the millions of indie artists who struggle to earn an income.

Also as pointed out in that thread, then there is very low guarantee that any data is backed up by the system or that the other desired properties of content being cached closer those who need it will be achieved.

Decentralized file storage requires fungibility of data, but this can't be attained without BOTH a block chain for recording the policies of content owners and algorithms that automatically detect which content infringes other content.

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February 06, 2016, 10:12:06 AM
 #14

Just out of curiosity. I have an idea for something I could do with smart contracts but I'd like to know exactly where the "state of the art" is before I do.

for the moment i only had some gain whit the eth pump, sincerely i don't know how to use it for smart contract system
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February 06, 2016, 10:14:52 AM
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Even if I have a few Ethereum, I never used the smart contract thing. I don't even know what it can do.
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February 06, 2016, 11:37:30 AM
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1. It is relying on IPFS, which is a decentralied file storage system. IPFS is interesting for orthogonal reasons (which I will discuss below), but there is an insoluble flaw of decentralized file storage in that copyrighted content illegally distributed without compensating the copyright owner, can't be forceably removed from all nodes, and thus the protocol ends up banned by hosts[1].

[...]

[1]https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1340057.msg13670558#msg13670558
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1344997.msg13730325#msg13730325
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1342065.msg13782055#msg13782055 (alternate copy: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=355212.msg13782246#msg13782246)

I received a reply from Juan Bennet (author of IPFS) and he referred me to the following:

  • IPFS has as a design requirement that nodes be able to only store and/or distribute content they explicitly want to store and/or distribute. This means that computers that run IPFS nodes do not have to host "other people's stuff", which is a very important thing when you consider that lots of content in the internet is -- in some for or other -- illegal under certain jurisdictions.
  • IPFS nodes will be able to express policies, and subscribe to network allow/denylists and policies that express content storage and distribution requirements. This way, users and groups can express what content should or should not be stored and/or distributed. This is required by users to (a) comply with legal constraints in their respective countries, (b) required by users with stricter codes of conduct (i.e. content that is legal but undesired by a group -- e.g. a childrens website).

Question and Answers:

    Q: When I add content, what happens?
    A: It is stored in your local node, and made available to other nodes in your network, via advertising it on the routing system (i.e. the IPFS-DHT). The content is not sent to other nodes until they explicitly request it, though of course some content may already exist in the system (content-addressing).

I don't see how that solves the problem that IPFS is a protocol that enables people to advertising the availability of illegal content on the DHT, and then illegal content can move to new ephemeral nodes, i.e. Whack-A-Mole. Thus authorities are eventually very likely to regulate Hosts and tell them that by running IPFS they are providing hosting for a DHT which routes illegal content. IPFS can infringe the millions of indie artists who struggle to earn an income.

Also as pointed out in that thread, then there is very low guarantee that any data is backed up by the system or that the other desired properties of content being cached closer those who need it will be achieved.

Decentralized file storage requires fungibility of data, but this can't be attained without BOTH a block chain for recording the policies of content owners and algorithms that automatically detect which content infringes other content.


IPFS looks great - and yes, I see the legal aspect - but once the idea is there & great, I just imagine the hunting - but then there will be an IPFS_1, _2,.... and you need to close the internet.


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February 06, 2016, 12:00:57 PM
 #17

Even if I have a few Ethereum, I never used the smart contract thing. I don't even know what it can do.

the idea is just there to hype the scam from other shit coins, nothing is useful about it. the idea was to have other shit coins to use it smart contracts and buy into it. the problem with it now is it have no direction with the mist wallet at this moment. this idea and etheoriem got lost in the black hole with 1 etherium.

ethereum platform references ---- nick szabo - the father of smart contracts - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Szabo
gav wood - the father and creator/coder of piece of shzit etherieum platform - http://gavwood.com
butterin vitalic - the little freak scammer left to take care of broken shzit platform which he is forking nonstop - he don't even believe in crypto so is gav wood before he made millions. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1979233.80
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February 06, 2016, 12:14:03 PM
 #18

Even if I have a few Ethereum, I never used the smart contract thing. I don't even know what it can do.

the idea is just there to hype the scam from other shit coins, nothing is useful about it. the idea was to have other shit coins to use it smart contracts and buy into it. the problem with it now is it have no direction with the mist wallet at this moment. this idea and etheoriem got lost in the black hole with 1 etherium.

I would like to see the scientific evidence of your claims.

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benthach
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February 06, 2016, 12:20:01 PM
 #19

Even if I have a few Ethereum, I never used the smart contract thing. I don't even know what it can do.

the idea is just there to hype the scam from other shit coins, nothing is useful about it. the idea was to have other shit coins to use it smart contracts and buy into it. the problem with it now is it have no direction with the mist wallet at this moment. this idea and etheoriem got lost in the black hole with 1 etherium.

I would like to see the scientific evidence of your claims.

simple, where is a working wallet/mist with other shit coins smart contract? isn't that what it claimed and hype all about?
two years and you still don't have a solid working wallet with dapp and smart contracts?
if i dissecting the tech you have now it would take forever!

ethereum platform references ---- nick szabo - the father of smart contracts - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Szabo
gav wood - the father and creator/coder of piece of shzit etherieum platform - http://gavwood.com
butterin vitalic - the little freak scammer left to take care of broken shzit platform which he is forking nonstop - he don't even believe in crypto so is gav wood before he made millions. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1979233.80
monsanto
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February 06, 2016, 12:42:21 PM
 #20

Even if I have a few Ethereum, I never used the smart contract thing. I don't even know what it can do.

the idea is just there to hype the scam from other shit coins, nothing is useful about it. the idea was to have other shit coins to use it smart contracts and buy into it. the problem with it now is it have no direction with the mist wallet at this moment. this idea and etheoriem got lost in the black hole with 1 etherium.

I would like to see the scientific evidence of your claims.

simple, where is a working wallet/mist with other shit coins smart contract? isn't that what it claimed and hype all about?
two years and you still don't have a solid working wallet with dapp and smart contracts?
if i dissecting the tech you have now it would take forever!

I think the devs would argue this wasn't a priority because it is beta and isn't ready yet for widespread use. They haven't even transitioned to PoS... they don't even know exactly how they are going to do that.  Once they are more confident in everything then they release all the tools and GUIs for general public. It was always supposed to be phased release, although I agree it is behind schedule.

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