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Author Topic: The bASIC Refund Tracking Thread  (Read 40218 times)
buzzdave
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February 05, 2013, 12:30:14 AM
 #341

Dave did his best to constantly spin events in a "positive" way, stringing everybody along to the best of his ability. TO PREVENT THEM FROM ASKING FOR A REFUND.  Even in that epic thread where LukasBradley told us the truth, if you look at Dave's version he was still spinning, and stalling, and basically misrepresenting the situation, to the "customers" detriment.

Maybe politicians and MSM has conditioned some of you to be too forgiving of "spin" and "pr"?  Anybody else remember how Dave lied to us quite a bit apart from that stuff? 

Do you think Dave's "information" updates and his stalling have anything to do with why people didn't ask for a refund until it was too late?

Wow Michael - considering how much I worked with you to get you your coins.  I'd remind you of a few of your quotes to me:

Quote from: MichaelBliss (email)
"I think I owe you a major thank you for pushing tom to refund me..."
"I appreciate you and count my lucky stars I got anything back..."
"I'm sorry for you as well, it must be hard dealing with this and maybe
nerve racking for you as well.  You've been exceptionally stand-up
from what I've seen..."

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buzzdave
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February 05, 2013, 12:37:54 AM
 #342

i am simply saying anyone could put two and two togather. As it looks right now it can be made dave assisted tom in the ablity to scam the btc by refunding the cc refunds. Althought he may have been doing his job he layed this ground to be open that he was assisting tom with the btc scam and all that somone has t prove was the cc refunds were made so that nothing could be done about this and to allow the btc scam.

This, coming from someone who actually had no money invested in bASICs.  He won the sig contest Tom put up, took delivery of one MMQ and put the 100 BTC Bar towards a bASIC pre-order.  Furthermore he had Tom make up an order for him on BTCFPGA.com, and then contacted me separately to set up an order on bitcoinASIC.com.  Knowing he had two orders (one of them false), he attempted to scam our refund process, contacting me with refund requests citing both order numbers.

It was only when I called him on it that he admitted what he was up to:

Quote from: dmcurser (Skype)
[1/28/2013 12:03:56 AM] David Carlson: I'll put you down for 100BTC - but man I'll be honest - I think you were trying to game the refund - not appreciated.
[1/28/2013 12:06:42 AM] dmcurser: i am sorry for that although at times i wish i would i would never let it go that far
[1/28/2013 12:06:58 AM] dmcurser: i was just mad bc noone is there to talk to everytime try to opwn a convo
[1/28/2013 12:07:05 AM] dmcurser: it just doesnt get ansewered
...etc.

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February 05, 2013, 12:58:24 AM
 #343

i am simply saying anyone could put two and two togather. As it looks right now it can be made dave assisted tom in the ablity to scam the btc by refunding the cc refunds. Althought he may have been doing his job he layed this ground to be open that he was assisting tom with the btc scam and all that somone has t prove was the cc refunds were made so that nothing could be done about this and to allow the btc scam.

This, coming from someone who actually had no money invested in bASICs.  He won the sig contest Tom put up, took delivery of one MMQ and put the 100 BTC Bar towards a bASIC pre-order.  Furthermore he had Tom make up an order for him on BTCFPGA.com, and then contacted me separately to set up an order on bitcoinASIC.com.  Knowing he had two orders (one of them false), he attempted to scam our refund process, contacting me with refund requests citing both order numbers.

It was only when I called him on it that he admitted what he was up to:

Quote from: dmcurser (Skype)
[1/28/2013 12:03:56 AM] David Carlson: I'll put you down for 100BTC - but man I'll be honest - I think you were trying to game the refund - not appreciated.
[1/28/2013 12:06:42 AM] dmcurser: i am sorry for that although at times i wish i would i would never let it go that far
[1/28/2013 12:06:58 AM] dmcurser: i was just mad bc noone is there to talk to everytime try to opwn a convo
[1/28/2013 12:07:05 AM] dmcurser: it just doesnt get ansewered
...etc.

hey dave if you win the lotto and order somthing and you dont get it you want your money back oo to bad you only won it you didnt earn it. Yes at the time of my refund request i was mad and yes there was two order made. One of which tom said didnt go thur and he couldnt figure out why. The second was another attempt on the bitcoin asci site which he still didnt get to go thur bc of the order system. So he told me to contact you which i did.

I dont have to hid it ill willing admit i was mad since all this shit has gone down. At time of refund request all we got from you was one run around after another and more bs seemed like you were trying to help tom which it still seemed you did.

Further more my agreement with tom was a btc bar of 100 btc for a basic not for 1069 usd i got all the Skype messages and whatnot to prove that all i did was ask for the equivalent of the 1069. I was trying to be far and realistic.

Trying to attack me isnt going to help the fact that you helped tom get away with this. and im not really mad at you in a way i think you did the right thing but in the end i know you didn t you helped tom point blank.

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MichaelBliss
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February 05, 2013, 12:59:05 AM
 #344

Dave did his best to constantly spin events in a "positive" way, stringing everybody along to the best of his ability. TO PREVENT THEM FROM ASKING FOR A REFUND.  Even in that epic thread where LukasBradley told us the truth, if you look at Dave's version he was still spinning, and stalling, and basically misrepresenting the situation, to the "customers" detriment.

Maybe politicians and MSM has conditioned some of you to be too forgiving of "spin" and "pr"?  Anybody else remember how Dave lied to us quite a bit apart from that stuff? 

Do you think Dave's "information" updates and his stalling have anything to do with why people didn't ask for a refund until it was too late?

Wow Michael - considering how much I worked with you to get you your coins.  I'd remind you of a few of your quotes to me:

Quote from: MichaelBliss (email)
"I think I owe you a major thank you for pushing tom to refund me..."
"I appreciate you and count my lucky stars I got anything back..."
"I'm sorry for you as well, it must be hard dealing with this and maybe
nerve racking for you as well.  You've been exceptionally stand-up
from what I've seen..."

Dave, how did yuo "work with me" to get my coins?? I emailed repeatedly and finally after a week Tom refunded them. It's not as much work as you made out while you were stalling for Tom.  You can forgive me for having no clue, since you worked to make the process as opaque as possible.  LukasBradley said in that post that he and you had to talk Tom into making BTC refunds, which I assume included mine.  That is what I thanked you for.  Which has nothing to do with how you stalled and misled everybody about the project, then the refund process, and now there seems to be many people SOL.  Even in that post, I remember you wording and Lukas' being quite different actually; you were trying to word things in such a way that people still had hope in the project, Lukas was more sure that Tom didn't have all the $ for everyone's refund... Of course that post has been taken down so I'm going from memory.
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February 05, 2013, 01:00:51 AM
 #345

i am simply saying anyone could put two and two togather. As it looks right now it can be made dave assisted tom in the ablity to scam the btc by refunding the cc refunds. Althought he may have been doing his job he layed this ground to be open that he was assisting tom with the btc scam and all that somone has t prove was the cc refunds were made so that nothing could be done about this and to allow the btc scam.

This, coming from someone who actually had no money invested in bASICs.  He won the sig contest Tom put up, took delivery of one MMQ and put the 100 BTC Bar towards a bASIC pre-order.  Furthermore he had Tom make up an order for him on BTCFPGA.com, and then contacted me separately to set up an order on bitcoinASIC.com.  Knowing he had two orders (one of them false), he attempted to scam our refund process, contacting me with refund requests citing both order numbers.

It was only when I called him on it that he admitted what he was up to:

Quote from: dmcurser (Skype)
[1/28/2013 12:03:56 AM] David Carlson: I'll put you down for 100BTC - but man I'll be honest - I think you were trying to game the refund - not appreciated.
[1/28/2013 12:06:42 AM] dmcurser: i am sorry for that although at times i wish i would i would never let it go that far
[1/28/2013 12:06:58 AM] dmcurser: i was just mad bc noone is there to talk to everytime try to opwn a convo
[1/28/2013 12:07:05 AM] dmcurser: it just doesnt get ansewered
...etc.

Looks like he should be up for scammer tag too.
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February 05, 2013, 01:04:21 AM
 #346

Still no reply to my email to the real Can Electric.  If I don't get a reply within the next 24 hours, I will phone them.  There is literally no proof right now of them having bought anything from Tom.  The weird initial post announcing the "sale" implied that the new owner had not bought any debt and that Tom would still be responsible for refunds.

And y'all can dox Tom if you want but I'd like to remind you that you ordered your hardware from an LLC, not an individual, and that doxxing Trendon Shavers and his family didn't get anyone back a single Bitcoin.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
dmcurser
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February 05, 2013, 01:08:25 AM
 #347

the sac wheres creativex
and where is this llc plz post link to this.



and to mine i only did mine out of anger if you feel that deserve a scammer tag ill accept it for finaly being the one thats tired of being scamed and wanted to get over on the scammer so sorry.

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SAC
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February 05, 2013, 01:12:19 AM
 #348

the sac wheres creatorxx
and where is this llc plz post link to this.



and to mine i only did mine out of anger if you feel that deserve a scammer tag ill accept it for finaly being the one thats tired of being scamed and wanted to get over on the scammer so sorry.

Ah the old eye for an eye defence or two wrongs make a right take your pick..
dmcurser
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February 05, 2013, 01:14:00 AM
 #349

i like eye for an eye why cant the btc community fuck over a scammer for a change.

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February 05, 2013, 01:15:59 AM
 #350

i like eye for an eye why cant the btc community fuck over a scammer for a change.

Because then you become scamming piece of shit yourself by doing so.
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February 05, 2013, 01:21:05 AM
 #351

the sac wheres creativex

He's working...why? Something I can help you with?

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February 05, 2013, 01:21:08 AM
 #352

I do have the old BTCFPGA/BitcoinASIC forum backed up minutes after it was locked down...

Personally, I think Dave helped more than he baited people along.. however, re-reading some of his posts on the old forum (now erased and still locked down).. I can see that he was really in the "dark".. but really how far in the "dark" could be up for debate..

From Dave / BTCFPGA Forum:

Quote
I'm amazed that people still seem to be afraid that our ASIC effort is not for real - suggesting that Tom has orchestrated this so he can buy an island is just tuning into your paranoia way too much.  If you are this concerned still, please please ask for a refund - its just not worth the stress you are putting yourself through.  Please understand that if you bail out on us, we won't be able to sell you your position back again - I've already been asked by several people to let them buy back into their positions.  A sad number of Batch 1 positions (really, really good ones) have been given up already.

Quote
Well as it happens I've been down with the flu for the last few days... Tom was sick early last week, and we are on opposite coasts!
^ Tom's famous 2 week radio silence after some questionable render pics.


Quote
Tom has been pushing hard - nothing but riding the engineers to the finish line.  We will be in production very soon.  I have also seen the hashing performance stats on a working pre-prod unit!


Quote
Production run *only* referred to the PCB production run.  The chip production run is a done deal.  We are only waiting to place and route the PCBs.  

I mentioned using engineering samples only because my read on what the Avalon guys said was that they believed we never received them - I was just trying to illustrate that we did in fact get engineering samples.  That being said - it does make more sense that we would use prod chips since I understand that production chips can differ from the engineering samples.

Quote
Keep in mind Tom is more technical about the process than I am - also way more informed.  I'm just sharing my understanding of what he has done and stated in this and other forums.  What is terrifying about this?  Why weren't you terrified before, when Tom explained the process?  

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LTC - LVFukQnCWUimBxZuXKqTVKy1L2Jb8kZasL
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February 05, 2013, 01:23:09 AM
 #353

[1/28/2013 2:56:36 AM] dmcurser: no the first order tom said wouldnt go thur and two do on bitcoin asci which he also could never get to work thats was where you came in to gety on of the order proccesed
[1/28/2013 2:57:18 AM] David Carlson: ok - well since you were giving me two order IDs and asking for refunds, I'm just trying to understand...
[1/28/2013 2:57:58 AM] David Carlson: seemed like you wanted two refunds
[1/28/2013 2:58:20 AM] David Carlson: tell you what
[1/28/2013 2:58:57 AM] David Carlson: seems sketchy to me, but I'll put you on the list for a $1069 refund in BTC, or else you can have Tom send you an MMQ
[1/28/2013 2:59:37 AM] dmcurser: yes that is fine as i still need both id to be taken care of in the end which is why i listed both
[1/28/2013 3:00:07 AM] dmcurser: the contest that i won was for  mmq and a 100 btc bar
[1/28/2013 3:00:11 AM] dmcurser: he sent mmq
[1/28/2013 3:00:20 AM] dmcurser: never sent bar said he didnt have time
[1/28/2013 3:01:00 AM] dmcurser: i said of forgo that and adde me to list for asci which at the time i over paid by like 3 btc but what the hell i was getting an asci
[1/28/2013 3:01:11 AM] dmcurser: he couldnt get cridt to work on btcfpga
[1/28/2013 3:01:58 AM] dmcurser: said he would do on bitcoin asci then he stoped talking to me about it and then you steped in and got the order complete and thats where it stands with the orders
[1/28/2013 3:02:27 AM] David Carlson: ok - I didn't even know what a btc bar was

rest of the logs yes i will once again addmit i was angry and i wantred a mother fucking eye

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repentance
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February 05, 2013, 01:32:03 AM
 #354


and where is this llc plz post link to this.


The website has been changed and I don't have a screenshot of the old website.  They used to have "BTCFPGA LLC" posted at several locations before it was changed to "CAN-ELECTRIC". 

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
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February 05, 2013, 01:35:34 AM
 #355

I still ask myself this: why would anyone put themselves in the hot seat Tom finds himself in, when his identity and that of his immediate family is so easily retrieved?

Threaten a man's family and he will most certainly not ignore you!!


I have in my possession significant details on the subject and his immediate family, which I found in just 30 minutes of searching. Included are names, home and mobile phone numbers, home and business addresses, other properties/investments owned, and properties/businesses managed. Tom's father is far from being a nobody, and they are both well known in their local community. And pictures to prove it.

I am not an affected party and I certainly don't wish anyone physical harm, but I find this matter disconcerting at many levels. I may be interested in releasing the information if there is a public demand for it (for a very small donation).

If I were in Tom's shoes, which I'm happy is not the case, I would immediately start refunding and paying back all debts. Or, I might try to bribe the author of this post in order to buy their silence (it might be for sale at the right price).


Contact me.

Well done idiot boy!!!!!
In a single post you managed to threaten to physically harm  and blackmail a person in public.




I did no such thing, name caller!! I simply suggested that one could, if they truly wanted to get his attention. You must have missed where I intentionally said I was not affected and don't wish anyone harm.

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February 05, 2013, 02:16:09 AM
 #356


and where is this llc plz post link to this.


The website has been changed and I don't have a screenshot of the old website.  They used to have "BTCFPGA LLC" posted at several locations before it was changed to "CAN-ELECTRIC". 

yha i saw ll c on website i mean actual link to its legitamcy like state website that has it list as a bisness

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puck2
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February 05, 2013, 02:19:16 AM
 #357

http://appext20.dos.ny.gov/corp_public/CORPSEARCH.ENTITY_SEARCH_ENTRY?p_entity_name=BTCFPGA&p_name_type=A&p_search_type=CONTAINS

Quote
No business entities were found for BTCFPGA.

Please refine your search criteria.

To continue please do the following:

Tab to Ok and press the Enter key or Click Ok.


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February 05, 2013, 02:25:25 AM
 #358

Still no reply to my email to the real Can Electric.  If I don't get a reply within the next 24 hours, I will phone them.  There is literally no proof right now of them having bought anything from Tom.  The weird initial post announcing the "sale" implied that the new owner had not bought any debt and that Tom would still be responsible for refunds.

And y'all can dox Tom if you want but I'd like to remind you that you ordered your hardware from an LLC, not an individual, and that doxxing Trendon Shavers and his family didn't get anyone back a single Bitcoin.


I knew of the "Pirate@40" scam but had to familiarize myself with the Trendon Shavers story.

You make a good point.. but it's obvious nobody has done anything material, save research and phone calls.

EDIT: and apparently there is one major difference between Tom and Trendon: one tried to run a legitimate business (selling consumer product) whereas the other was a pure under-the-table scammer (BTC ponzi), the latter is stealthier under regulatory radar.

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February 05, 2013, 02:32:58 AM
 #359

I called the number listed at BTCFPGA (https://www.btcfpga.com/index.php?route=information/contact) and got a voicemail message from Common Sense Computers, also not listed at the NYS business registry or really anywhere on Google.

I'm considering contacting NY State dept of consumer affairs. (https://www.dos.ny.gov/consumerprotection/form/complaintform.asp).
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February 05, 2013, 02:42:42 AM
 #360

I called the number listed at BTCFPGA (https://www.btcfpga.com/index.php?route=information/contact) and got a voicemail message from Common Sense Computers, also not listed at the NYS business registry or really anywhere on Google.

I'm considering contacting NY State dept of consumer affairs. (https://www.dos.ny.gov/consumerprotection/form/complaintform.asp).

I have searched the NYS business registry and exhausted my list of Tom Van Ripper's business entities - none, and I mean NONE, are listed with the State of New York. Without an LLC, Tom's customers can come after his personal belongings.

Common Sense Computers / CNY Sensible PC were just some of the "legit" business entities Tom ran at one time or another in his local community.

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