Renting GPU power

[lemonginger]

Am interested in renting about 2Ghashes worth of computing power for 1 month. Payment in USD (or your countries equivalent). Potential for longer-term contract if first month works out with minimal downtime and consistent hashing. PM me your terms or make them here.

[SgtSpike]

How about 1950MH/s?  That seems to be my average...

What is your offer for payment?

[Bitonetta]

I would probably consider renting my hardware out.  Unfortunately it probably won't be cost worthwhile for someone.

Basically it'll have to be more then what I can mine coins at.  Especially if the price of coins keeps on rising.  Would there be any scenario where I would be better of using my equipment to 'rent' then to mine?  I wouldn't rent my GPUs for less then I can make mining. And if you're the person renting I assume you're in it to make some profit yourself.  So unless your electricity is really high it'll be hard to make the math work.

Luckily I have free electric.  Well, it's included in the usual quarterly maintenance fee which hasn't moved in years.

[ensign_lee]

I would probably consider renting my hardware out.  Unfortunately it probably won't be cost worthwhile for someone.

Basically it'll have to be more then what I can mine coins at.  Especially if the price of coins keeps on rising.  Would there be any scenario where I would be better of using my equipment to 'rent' then to mine?  I wouldn't rent my GPUs for less then I can make mining. And if you're the person renting I assume you're in it to make some profit yourself.  So unless your electricity is really high it'll be hard to make the math work.

Luckily I have free electric.  Well, it's included in the usual quarterly maintenance fee which hasn't moved in years.

Main situation I can think of is that the price of bitcoins falls (or difficulty increases more than anticipated). OP will already have locked in a cost with you assuming the higher BTC price (or lower difficulty), so you in essence get paid at that price / difficulty instead of actuality.

It's kind of like running a short position on BTC, in essence. He takes on the risk of bitcoin prices falling or difficulty increasing more than expected, but conversely reaps the benefits of bitcoin prices rising or difficulty increasing less than anticipated

[lemonginger]

How about 1950MH/s?  That seems to be my average...

What is your offer for payment?

~~ $1000 USD either held in escrow or with 50% up front 50% at end depending on delivery of expectations. Could be specified in contract if desired (ie; how many average MH/day over course of month with allowances for temporary hardware outages/pool outages/etc with some specified discount per average MH not delivered)

[bcpokey]

Where is vladimir? He runs a Hashing rental service.

Here you go:

http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3380

I'd rent gpu power if I werent so lazy. Good business

[lemonginger]

yes but he wants 4 month minimum contract. I just want one month at this point, then re-evaluate.

[tunatime]

1g for 2Ghs seams low you could make more by just mining your self

[lemonginger]

yes you could, at the moment.

[SgtSpike]

Intriguing offer, but I think I'll have to pass.  At current difficulty/price rates, I'm making just over $3k/month.  I understand that things could take a turn for the worse, and this is a good way to hedge that risk, but I'd rather take the risk. 

[bcpokey]

1g for 2Ghs seams low you could make more by just mining your self

This is true, you'd have negotiate a model that was attractive to both parties. There is also one thing you are missing, an up-front payment of cash for future Hashing power allows the renter to re-invest the instantaneous monies gained from that agreement into more mining equipment NOW (before higher difficulty rather than after with selling mined BTC). Therefore you own both the hashing power you are renting (assuming you already had it to rent) + the new hashing power you purchased with the rental money, you gain the new bitcoins from the new hardware, and when the contract expires you have all the hashing power back making bitcoins for you (unless the client re-ups, then more hardware).

This is a great risk-free way of expanding your farming power.

[lemonginger]

Intriguing offer, but I think I'll have to pass.  At current difficulty/price rates, I'm making just over $3k/month.  I understand that things could take a turn for the worse, and this is a good way to hedge that risk, but I'd rather take the risk. 

fair enough, it seems like that is about going rate in vladimir's server farm, so I might just bit the bullet and get a contract with him.

[Bitonetta]

1K for 2GHash/sec for a month wouldn't be worth it.

Worked out even a 'bad' case scenario.
Assuming BTC drops to $25 and stays there for the whole 30 days.
Assuming a 50% increase in difficulty every time for 3 periods of 10 days each.

After 30 days you would have mined over $2100 worth of BTC.

So unless the price of BTC drops significantly.  It wouldn't be worth it.

If you take todays BTC with a zero increase over 30 days.  With a more believable but still HIGH 33% increase in difficulty, you'll be at $3300.  Bad for the miner for only 1K.  And my numbers gets even worse for the hardware owner if I add in the electrical costs. 

My personal risks vs reward breaks even at $4k/month @ 2GHash/sec.  With these numbers, it'll be $5k/month before it's considered.

[bcpokey]

1K for 2GHash/sec for a month wouldn't be worth it.

Worked out even a 'bad' case scenario.
Assuming BTC drops to $25 and stays there for the whole 30 days.
Assuming a 50% increase in difficulty every time for 3 periods of 10 days each.

After 30 days you would have mined over $2100 worth of BTC.

So unless the price of BTC drops significantly.  It wouldn't be worth it.

If you take todays BTC with a zero increase over 30 days.  With a more believable but still HIGH 33% increase in difficulty, you'll be at $3300.  Bad for the miner for only 1K.  And my numbers gets even worse for the hardware owner if I add in the electrical costs. 

My personal risks vs reward breaks even at $4k/month @ 2GHash/sec.  With these numbers, it'll be $5k/month before it's considered.

Well again you're missing my above point. The reason you can rent for less than the price of what you could mine yourself is because of re-investment.

Really the price of renting GHash should be set only at the cost to add an additional Ghash of mining power.

You should be able to add 2GHash of power to your network for about $1600. $2000 max if you're really bad at pricing out parts. So that'd be about right for a month of mining (figuring you'd normally pay off a new rig in a month).

[Bitonetta]

1g for 2Ghs seams low you could make more by just mining your self

This is true, you'd have negotiate a model that was attractive to both parties. There is also one thing you are missing, an up-front payment of cash for future Hashing power allows the renter to re-invest the instantaneous monies gained from that agreement into more mining equipment NOW (before higher difficulty rather than after with selling mined BTC). Therefore you own both the hashing power you are renting (assuming you already had it to rent) + the new hashing power you purchased with the rental money, you gain the new bitcoins from the new hardware, and when the contract expires you have all the hashing power back making bitcoins for you (unless the client re-ups, then more hardware).

This is a great risk-free way of expanding your farming power.

Wow, so many replies while I was writing my last post.  This is true but he did say only 50% upfront.  So you'll be able to put in an extra $500 worth of equipment.  If you can even find the cards and get them up and running quickly it wouldn't be AS bad for the miner but imo still will not close the gap of 1k vs mining profit.

Too bad I can't rent out just an electrical outlet and ethernet port.  Someone can pay me monies to place a miner they already own here.  My electric is included as part of my quarterly maintenance fee.  It would be my very own bitcoin data center.  LOL.   

[lemonginger]

you all are missing the mark here. The market price has already been somewhat set by Vladimir who is clearly competent, clearly not running servers out of his spare bedroom and prone to downtime, and is offering 1Ghash/month/$600-$650 . I would expect someone with unknown credentials that is not running large scale racks to be much close to $500/month/ghash.

[Capitan]

1K for 2GHash/sec for a month wouldn't be worth it.

Worked out even a 'bad' case scenario.
Assuming BTC drops to $25 and stays there for the whole 30 days.
Assuming a 50% increase in difficulty every time for 3 periods of 10 days each.

After 30 days you would have mined over $2100 worth of BTC.

So unless the price of BTC drops significantly.  It wouldn't be worth it.

If you take todays BTC with a zero increase over 30 days.  With a more believable but still HIGH 33% increase in difficulty, you'll be at $3300.  Bad for the miner for only 1K.  And my numbers gets even worse for the hardware owner if I add in the electrical costs. 

My personal risks vs reward breaks even at $4k/month @ 2GHash/sec.  With these numbers, it'll be $5k/month before it's considered.

Well again you're missing my above point. The reason you can rent for less than the price of what you could mine yourself is because of re-investment.

Really the price of renting GHash should be set only at the cost to add an additional Ghash of mining power.

You should be able to add 2GHash of power to your network for about $1600. $2000 max if you're really bad at pricing out parts. So that'd be about right for a month of mining (figuring you'd normally pay off a new rig in a month).

I don't think that's quite accurate. You are either ignoring the currently inflated prices of the graphics cards it would take to build such a system, ignoring some of the parts required (extender cables, ram, hdd, cpu, mobo, case, shipping, etc), under-powering the PSU, or assuming that everyone will overclock (which I would argue you shouldn't do because people need an apples to apples basis when discussing hardware power/costs).

[Bitonetta]

you all are missing the mark here. The market price has already been somewhat set by Vladimir who is clearly competent, clearly not running servers out of his spare bedroom and prone to downtime, and is offering 1Ghash/month/$600-$650 . I would expect someone with unknown credentials that is not running large scale racks to be much close to $500/month/ghash.

No.  He's offering 1Ghash for 440£.  You are asking for 2Ghash/sec.  That comes out to $1440/month USD.  He's also offering at a much longer term contract.  So that basically means if nothing else, you would have paid for the computer you were using at the end of the contract.  There is nearly ZERO risk for him.  If a 'small time' miner here offered what you asked for and bitcoin crashes and burns in a month.  Well, he'll be stuck with a 2Ghash/sec machine without the possibility of recouping the cost.

Next, he's much larger then your average miner.  So he's bound to get economies of scale for his purchases and operations.  Now I know that's not your fault (or the miners) but still.  He's buying bulk and more then likely have new machines up and running before a customer has 'purchased' that machine.  You are asking for even larger benefits then what he's offering for less then he's willing to.

He has professional 'front'.  Someone else here can very well be an unknown.  True.  Very fair point.  There's no argument there.  I still wouldn't expect someone to offer you in their eyes a money losing transaction without any benefit.

If you'll match or 'better' his offer people would JUMP at that chance to help you.  Lets see.  440£ comes out to about $720 USD.  You asked for 2GHash/sec so that'll be at $1440/month.  For 4 months = $5760.  For that so you can 'rent' a $1600-2000 computer for the 4 months.  I'll BET you money that people would jump all over that deal here.  You were asking it to be less cause of someone from unknown credentials.  OK.  What would you consider less per month? $700? $600? $500?  At $500, that's 33% less then what he's offering.  So that's $1000/month that you asked for but it's the 4 months guarantee contract that makes it worth while for the operator.  If you said I'll offer $4k for 4 months of mining use, you'll probably still get interest from people.  There's no (very little) risk for the miner to just buy/build a $2000 PC for your use when they know they'll make that up (plus electric/fees) over the life of the contract.  And that's with a 33% discount from Vladimir's prices.

[SgtSpike]

Sgtspike,

$3K a month is pretty darn good, what's your setup like?  Multiple PCs?  What pool (if any) do you use?

Thanks!

6 PC's, running the following cards:
(1) 4650
(3) 5830
(2) 5850
(1) 5870
(1) 5770

Nets me 1950MH/s, which brought in $108 worth of bitcoins for me yesterday on deepbit.  Of course, I'm making the assumption that price and difficulty will remain similar to extrapolate that income across the whole month, but in actuality, it does seem to follow fairly closely.

you all are missing the mark here. The market price has already been somewhat set by Vladimir who is clearly competent, clearly not running servers out of his spare bedroom and prone to downtime, and is offering 1Ghash/month/$600-$650 . I would expect someone with unknown credentials that is not running large scale racks to be much close to $500/month/ghash.

Agreed.  It's just not for me though.  I'd rather mine and sell the coins myself.  I'll probably make very close to $1000 of coins before the next difficulty increase even comes around.

[bcpokey]

I don't think that's quite accurate. You are either ignoring the currently inflated prices of the graphics cards it would take to build such a system, ignoring some of the parts required (extender cables, ram, hdd, cpu, mobo, case, shipping, etc), under-powering the PSU, or assuming that everyone will overclock (which I would argue you shouldn't do because people need an apples to apples basis when discussing hardware power/costs).

Well this was just an off the cuff rough estimate, 5870s used to go for $225, but I see people have been bidding them up to $275 lately, sheesh. Well anyway, 5x$275 = $1375 + $175 mobo + $175 PSU + $40 CPU + $20 ram + $30 HD + $100 custom case = $1900. Those are desperation prices, so I'd say that's a good ceiling.

This is how vlad makes his money. He locks you in for 4 months, at a cost of which can pay for the equpiment you are renting flat out (as I recall he uses 6990s so his profits are a bit lower but easier to manage) twice over (your rig + a rig for himself). So for this to be seen as reasonable for one months time you would need to pay a slightly higher premium. It's still a pretty good deal imho (for the renter).