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Author Topic: Purchase Bitcoins from your iPhone.  (Read 10087 times)
armenmerikyan
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January 27, 2013, 10:11:18 PM
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Brownie Coins is an iPhone app which lets users purchase brownie coins with in-app purchases and exchange them for bitcoins. 

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
Buy Bitcoins using iTunes and Brownie Coins App
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January 27, 2013, 10:14:11 PM
 #2

Oh boy... grab popcorn... anyone care to wager on how long this will last?

I'm not saying it's a bad deal for the customers... but this will be seen as a way to monetize stolen Apple accounts and iTunes credit and will attract fraud.  It'll be a terrible deal for the operator of said brownie coins when the chargebacks start rolling in to Apple and Apple shuts it down.

Companies claiming they got hacked and lost your coins sounds like fraud so perfect it could be called fashionable.  I never believe them.  If I ever experience the misfortune of a real intrusion, I declare I have been honest about the way I have managed the keys in Casascius Coins.  I maintain no ability to recover or reproduce the keys, not even under limitless duress or total intrusion.  Remember that trusting strangers with your coins without any recourse is, as a matter of principle, not a best practice.  Don't keep coins online. Use paper or hardware wallets instead.
armenmerikyan
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January 27, 2013, 10:20:34 PM
 #3

Lets see how it goes, I am experimenting.

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
Buy Bitcoins using iTunes and Brownie Coins App
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January 27, 2013, 10:28:39 PM
 #4

This is incredibly foolish.  You are going to give Bitcoin a bad name with Apple's review team.  They will associate Bitcoin with fraud and give us a much harder time getting legitimate bitcoin apps into the app store.

App Store Review Guideline 11.3 “Apps using IAP to purchase physical goods or goods and services used outside of the application will be rejected”

You've got about 1 hour to remove this from the App Store yourself before I report it to Apple for you.

EDIT to add:  I am sorry I don't mean to jump down your throat over this, and want to express my gratitude to you for having gone to the effort of coming up with a novel new way to solve the "how do I get Bitcoins" problem.  But while you're experimenting to find out what might happen, many of us already know the most likely end game.  This can end no way but bad.  We want Bitcoin apps in the app store, and would love to see this if Apple were endorsing it, but this is such a blatant violation of their current policies and there's no way they won't eventually notice it under the unpleasant circumstances of dealing with certain predictable fraud if left alone.  This app is penny wise, pound foolish.

Companies claiming they got hacked and lost your coins sounds like fraud so perfect it could be called fashionable.  I never believe them.  If I ever experience the misfortune of a real intrusion, I declare I have been honest about the way I have managed the keys in Casascius Coins.  I maintain no ability to recover or reproduce the keys, not even under limitless duress or total intrusion.  Remember that trusting strangers with your coins without any recourse is, as a matter of principle, not a best practice.  Don't keep coins online. Use paper or hardware wallets instead.
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January 28, 2013, 01:10:56 AM
 #5

My intentions are good, and I am not foolish enough to think that this is going to make me a million dollars or even a dollar. However I put a lot of thought and effort into building this app and getting it approved by the app store.  I promise this if I do see anything unusual I will take down the app my self.

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
Buy Bitcoins using iTunes and Brownie Coins App
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January 28, 2013, 06:11:10 AM
 #6

Bitcoins give me a great way to reward people. It's cheap to deliver, I can give away small prizes and it's international. Go Bitcoins.

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
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January 28, 2013, 06:20:53 AM
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My intentions are good, and I am not foolish enough to think that this is going to make me a million dollars or even a dollar. However I put a lot of thought and effort into building this app and getting it approved by the app store.  I promise this if I do see anything unusual I will take down the app my self.

That's what sucks: you put a lot of effort into building the app, and you're liable not to make one or a million dollars, but actually to make negative dollars.  Or more precisely, negative bitcoins.

It is clear you put in a lot of effort, but I'm not sure about the thought.  Here is what will happen.  People will buy brownie coins with stolen Apple accounts or with stolen credit cards.  You'll send them Bitcoins.  The real owners of the Apple accounts or credit cards will complain, and charge back their credit card.  Apple will want you to cover that (or, just as bad, they'll be forced to take it in the shorts, and that makes all of us Bitcoiners look bad to the App Store review team).  You've already sent the bitcoins, too late, so they're gone.  You lose!

How can this be good?  Do you honestly believe that nobody will try to buy brownie coins with stolen money?  Because this never happening is the only way it could ever work.

Meanwhile, we as a community are already facing an uphill battle trying to get legitimate Bitcoin wallet apps into the App Store.  Having Apple lose money to fraud perpetrated through your app is actually contrary to all of our interests as Bitcoiners.  By the time you see anything "unusual" it will already be too late, so from my view, hopefully the next unusual thing you see is a removal of your app from the App Store.

Companies claiming they got hacked and lost your coins sounds like fraud so perfect it could be called fashionable.  I never believe them.  If I ever experience the misfortune of a real intrusion, I declare I have been honest about the way I have managed the keys in Casascius Coins.  I maintain no ability to recover or reproduce the keys, not even under limitless duress or total intrusion.  Remember that trusting strangers with your coins without any recourse is, as a matter of principle, not a best practice.  Don't keep coins online. Use paper or hardware wallets instead.
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January 28, 2013, 06:38:37 AM
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It is clear you put in a lot of effort, but I'm not sure about the thought.  Here is what will happen.  People will buy brownie coins with stolen Apple accounts or with stolen credit cards.  You'll send them Bitcoins.  The real owners of the Apple accounts or credit cards will complain, and charge back their credit card.  Apple will want you to cover that (or, just as bad, they'll be forced to take it in the shorts, and that makes all of us Bitcoiners look bad to the App Store review team).  You've already sent the bitcoins, too late, so they're gone.  You lose!

How can this be good?  Do you honestly believe that nobody will try to buy brownie coins with stolen money?  Because this never happening is the only way it could ever work.

This. People think Paypal chargebacks are bad, but Apple...

armenmerikyan
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January 28, 2013, 06:54:17 AM
 #9

Take a chill pill dude, You think rewarding people with bitcoins is going to give bitcoins a bad name and ruin other people chances of doing things with bitcoins.

What makes you think you speak for everybody?

Dude you are a Bully.

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
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January 28, 2013, 07:08:30 AM
 #10

Take a chill pill dude, You think rewarding people with bitcoins is going to give bitcoins a bad name and ruin other people chances of doing things with bitcoins.

What makes you think you speak for everybody?

Dude you are a Bully.

He just gave you an advice.

And this advise is based on experience. We all have seen this happening so many times. Each effort to try to sell Bitcoins through any Medium that allows charge backs or the use of stolen accounts Be it through ebay, direct PayPal, Credit cards... you name it. Always results in a loss for the bitcoin selling party.

And I mean always, not most of the Time. A 100%. There is not a single case where this has ended well for the Bitcoin seller.

Nobody wants to discredit you effort. But you will end up with a lost and will be shut down by Apple. That's a 100% sure.

Please don't make the same mistakes other already made before you.

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January 28, 2013, 07:10:08 AM
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Take a chill pill dude, You think rewarding people with bitcoins is going to give bitcoins a bad name and ruin other people chances of doing things with bitcoins.

What makes you think you speak for everybody?

Dude you are a Bully.

He just gave you an advice.

And this advise is based on experience. We all have seen this happening so many times. Each effort to try to sell Bitcoins through any Medium that allows charge backs or the use of stolen accounts Be it through ebay, direct PayPal, Credit cards... you name it. Always results in a loss for the bitcoin selling party.

And I mean always, not most of the Time. A 100%. There is not a single case where this has ended well for the Bitcoin seller.

Nobody wants to discredit you effort. But you will end up with a lost and will be shut down by Apple. That's a 100% sure.

Please don't make the same mistakes other already made before you.
Well, this. Carders and skimmers are always on the lookout for new ways to launder their cards.

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January 28, 2013, 07:23:10 AM
 #12

It's a shame but they are right. If there's a way to scam using your app it will happen. Bitcoin just doesn't play well with others.
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January 28, 2013, 07:30:12 AM
 #13

I do intend to update my process and application as this thing evolves.

- Use the camera to take picture of person claiming the reward
- Use GPS to capture where the user is actually located
- Use push notifications to insure they are actually using an iPhone
- Call them instantly to verify their phone number and text



  

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
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January 28, 2013, 07:33:54 AM
 #14

It's a shame but they are right. If there's a way to scam using your app it will happen. Bitcoin just doesn't play well with others.

That is the case with everything in life, it does not mean we should not try.

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January 28, 2013, 07:42:23 AM
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I probably won't use it personally but it may help some get into the Bitcoin world. As far as making Bitcoin look bad we can hope that the reviewers at Apple won't be that ignorant when it comes to other apps down the road, if this does turn out bad. But good luck with your project.
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January 28, 2013, 07:49:27 AM
 #16

What if any bitcoin payments are limited to very low prices? Would scammers still use stolen accounts to steal half a bitcoin?

for instance what if you made the max amount someone could get with it.... 1 bitcoin per month or something?

armenmerikyan
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January 28, 2013, 07:53:54 AM
 #17

This gives me a lot of control that ebay can't offer.

I really think it's a step forward.

Brownie Coins Available at Apple's App Store
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January 28, 2013, 07:58:26 AM
 #18

I think the only way you could sell bitcoins through a reversible payment system (whether it's apple store... or google play or whatever) is by building some kind of sophisticated white list of trust. For instance if you have users that have bought in app purchases..... and after a period of 30 days or whatever time they haven't charged back then they would be more trusted.... than say someone who hasn't.

scammers would flock to an app that you could buy bitcoins with a credit card or your mobile phone bill. I think the only way you can avoid it is by limiting the app purchases per account to very small quantities or going with a white list of some sort.
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January 28, 2013, 08:55:00 AM
 #19

HI,just tryd this application,somthing is wrong with it? bug problems
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January 28, 2013, 09:07:14 AM
 #20

My intentions are good, and I am not foolish enough to think that this is going to make me a million dollars or even a dollar. However I put a lot of thought and effort into building this app and getting it approved by the app store.  I promise this if I do see anything unusual I will take down the app my self.

That's what sucks: you put a lot of effort into building the app, and you're liable not to make one or a million dollars, but actually to make negative dollars.  Or more precisely, negative bitcoins.

It is clear you put in a lot of effort, but I'm not sure about the thought.  Here is what will happen.  People will buy brownie coins with stolen Apple accounts or with stolen credit cards.  You'll send them Bitcoins.  The real owners of the Apple accounts or credit cards will complain, and charge back their credit card.  Apple will want you to cover that (or, just as bad, they'll be forced to take it in the shorts, and that makes all of us Bitcoiners look bad to the App Store review team).  You've already sent the bitcoins, too late, so they're gone.  You lose!

How can this be good?  Do you honestly believe that nobody will try to buy brownie coins with stolen money?  Because this never happening is the only way it could ever work.

Meanwhile, we as a community are already facing an uphill battle trying to get legitimate Bitcoin wallet apps into the App Store.  Having Apple lose money to fraud perpetrated through your app is actually contrary to all of our interests as Bitcoiners.  By the time you see anything "unusual" it will already be too late, so from my view, hopefully the next unusual thing you see is a removal of your app from the App Store.

What makes you think you speak for everybody?
This.

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