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Author Topic: The Voluntary City - No public services yet so prosperous.  (Read 2596 times)
Anonymous
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June 10, 2011, 04:11:43 PM
 #1

Gurgaon  has no publicly provided “functioning citywide sewer or drainage system; reliable electricity or water; public sidewalks, adequate parking, decent roads or any citywide system of public transportation.” Yet Gurgaon is a magnet for “India’s best-educated, English-speaking young professionals,” it has 26 shopping malls, seven golf courses, apartment towers, a sports stadium, five-star hotels and “a futuristic commercial hub called Cyber City [that] houses many of the world’s most respected corporations.” According to one survey, Gurgaon is India’s best city to work and live. So how does Gurgaon thrive? It thrives because in the absence of government the private sector has stepped in to provide transportation, utilities, security and more...

http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2011/06/indias-voluntary-city.html

The myth that taxes are for the common good and provide services that wouldn't otherwise exist?

BUSTED, liberal parasites.
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epi 1:10,000
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June 10, 2011, 08:29:52 PM
 #2

It would be interesting to try this experiment in a U.S. city.
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June 10, 2011, 09:55:13 PM
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You make it sound like they dont pay taxes in Gurgaon.
And what does this have to do with liberal values?

If you always think in categories you will miss the bigger picture.
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Anonymous
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June 10, 2011, 10:08:41 PM
 #4

You make it sound like they dont pay taxes in Gurgaon.
And what does this have to do with liberal values?
I can only imagine how much better it would be if they didn't.

American liberals tend to support the absolute centralization of these services because they don't believe they can exist otherwise.
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June 10, 2011, 10:44:02 PM
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If they had no taxes, how can you guarantee the necessary public services that cannot run with a profit?
This has nothing to do with liberalism, and I think most people agree that some basic services are needed. If they are most efficient government run or privatized depends on culture, general welfare and preservation of human rights amongst other things. I dont think there is much of a difference between the "liberals" and the "conservatives" (?) (not that the terms are mutually exclusive) when it comes to the amount of government control. They just want the government to control different things (often based on who is donating the most and goes with the "party's image"). How much the government controls is not important as long as they can fulfill their policies.

While this is a politic system that works in Guragon, where big companies gets big tax benefits and produce cheap labor for export to wealthier countries, it would not work everywhere. There is no one solution until we humans start acting the same way.

I am sad to see how US politics manage to smear and change the meanings of words with propaganda and newly invented insults through media. I would consider binding political terms to strong emotional reactions and exploiting them a form of political corruption, especially when you are getting paid to do so. Or actually, I would call it mass brainwashing.

I mean I could show you endless of different political models make different cities very successful. These discussions and ideas goes so much further than "attacking" stereotypical political views that are simplified to a point where it get ridiculous.

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Anonymous
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June 10, 2011, 11:12:40 PM
 #6

If they had no taxes, how can you guarantee the necessary public services that cannot run with a profit?
You don't. You don't define neccessary and you don't make the arrogant attempt to group individuals into something called 'the public'. You let the people decide individually what they want to do with their labor and their desires will be met accordingly.

This has nothing to do with liberalism, and I think most people agree that some basic services are needed.
Well, I don't give a fuck. I'll pay for whatever services I deem fitting for me when it comes to MY labor. You want <insert service here>? Pay for it yourself.

 If they are most efficient government run or privatized depends on culture, general welfare and preservation of human rights amongst other things.
Absolute bunk. There has never been an efficient government service. I'll give you $1000 if you show me one thing that can be more efficiently done by a monopoly on force besides massive theft and holocaust.


I dont think there is much of a difference between the "liberals" and the "conservatives" (?) (not that the terms are mutually exclusive) when it comes to the amount of government control.
Agreed.

They just want the government to control different things (often based on who is donating the most and goes with the "party's image"). How much the government controls is not important as long as they can fulfill their policies.

Fuck that. Why should my enslaved labor be fought over between their whims and desires?

While this is a politic system that works in Guragon, where big companies gets big tax benefits and produce cheap labor for export to wealthier countries, it would not work everywhere. There is no one solution until we humans start acting the same way.

Tax benefits? You mean the government being merciful enough not to steal?

I am sad to see how US politics manage to smear and change the meanings of words with propaganda and newly invented insults through media. I would consider binding political terms to strong emotional reactions and exploiting them a form of political corruption, especially when you are getting paid to do so. Or actually, I would call it mass brainwashing.

I mean I could show you endless of different political models make different cities very successful. These discussions and ideas goes so much further than "attacking" stereotypical political views that are simplified to a point where it get ridiculous.

Okay. Sorry to see you're offended.
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June 10, 2011, 11:16:33 PM
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No essential service would not be able to find voluntary funding.

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Anonymous
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June 10, 2011, 11:19:08 PM
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No essential service would not be able to find voluntary funding.
This is nowhere close to a coherent thought.
Sjalq
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June 10, 2011, 11:25:50 PM
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Dude, you need to calm down, you just said that essential services cannot be funded voluntarily, I am arguing your point.

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Anonymous
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June 10, 2011, 11:29:01 PM
 #10

Dude, you need to calm down, you just said that essential services cannot be funded voluntarily, I am arguing your point.
No, that's slander. I said any subjective service that is considered 'essential' by power-hungry parasites should not be guaranteed. No man is obligated to anothers labor.
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June 10, 2011, 11:36:47 PM
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My point is that if it is essential to someone they will find a means of funding it even in the absence of a government guaranteed way of getting it at the cost of society.

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Anonymous
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June 10, 2011, 11:38:38 PM
 #12

My point is that if it is essential to someone they will find a means of funding it even in the absence of a government guaranteed way of getting it at the cost of society.

Haha, I see now. My apologies.
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June 10, 2011, 11:42:52 PM
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No worries :-)

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June 11, 2011, 12:15:15 AM
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I was under the impression that is something was essential then people would pay for it themselves, because they need it. Otherwise it's not essential.

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June 11, 2011, 12:45:40 AM
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I was under the impression that is something was essential then people would pay for it themselves, because they need it. Otherwise it's not essential.

Agreed. A problem you may run into, in practice, are the people who will tell you its not essential when the (voluntary) collection hat comes around, but then use the service anyway (for example a road or public park). So there will need to be a mechanism to prevent such people from using any services they voluntarily chose not to support. But then one begins to wonder if a mechanism like that, if it is robust enough to prevent people from driving down certain roads or admiring the nicely groomed park, is not just another government by a different name. No?

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June 11, 2011, 01:58:17 AM
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Go move there! We Americans are happy paying taxes for public services. We've been doing it since long before you were born. If you really think that Indian slum is better, by all means go there! Either go there or STFU!
Anonymous
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June 11, 2011, 02:00:03 AM
 #17

We Americans are happy paying taxes for public services.

That's changing.
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June 11, 2011, 06:07:17 AM
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We Americans are happy paying taxes for public services.

That's changing.

"It is an enormous simplification to speak of the American mind. Every American has his own mind".

- Ludwig von Mises

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June 11, 2011, 06:54:36 AM
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Go move there! We Americans are happy paying taxes for public services. We've been doing it since long before you were born. If you really think that Indian slum is better, by all means go there! Either go there or STFU!

I love paying taxes for things I never use.
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June 11, 2011, 09:33:02 AM
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You should read "Homage to Catalonia" by George Orwell (well known for his writings "1984" and "Animal Farm") then.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homage_to_Catalonia

George Orwell was fighting in the Spanish civil war with the anarchists. They had an exploding economy, but the anarchism was destroyed by force by the (Hitler-supported) Franco regime.


see also:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism_in_Spain

Misspelling protects against dictionary attacks NOT
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