Exchangers - Fake Volumes- FRAUD

[patronis]

Bitfinex, Kraken, Coinbase, Bitstamp all charge fees. It is too expensive to manipulate volume on those exchanges as every trade will cost you money.

The only exchanges where the volume may be suspect are the ones that don't charge fees - Huobi and the other Chinese ones. But some of their trade is definitely real.

This is nonsense - if the bots are run by the exchange then the fees "cost nothing" (as it is coming from their own profits).

You can't trust *any* exchanges volume in Bitcoin (and never have been able to).

People seem to confuse Bitcoin exchanges with things like regulated stock exchanges - a very naive thing to be doing.

It depends on where they are based. In the western world, an exchange with that kind of volume and which is charging fees on every trade, is expected to show revenue in line with that and pay tax on the profits generated. There is no benefit in pretending you are making more than you really are because you only attract the attention of the taxman who wants his share. Tax authorities: keeping business from over stating revenue since the dawn of time.

but what their statistics shows that faking volume increases revenue and number of people trading causing them to profit more then what would need to be paid in tax?

[CIYAM]

It depends on where they are based. In the western world, an exchange with that kind of volume and which is charging fees on every trade, is expected to show revenue in line with that and pay tax on the profits generated. There is no benefit in pretending you are making more than you really are because you only attract the attention of the taxman who wants his share. Tax authorities: keeping business from over stating revenue since the dawn of time.

And you are very wrong to think that any Bitcoin exchange is being properly run in the way you are stating (show me who is auditing them for a start).

NOTE: It is possible that Gemini is being run this way but I doubt any other western exchange is (they would be the exception rather than the rule).

The tax authorities don't even understand crypto (so they are hardly going to be sending experts in to check the trading records logs which can all be forged anyway).

In many western countries the "tax man" has actually been outsourced to the businesses themselves (it's known as GST or VAT).

[gtglener]

No I don't think that they are fake transactions, as in some exchanges i am seeing that the price sometimes reach to a much higher value and on yobit I am selling my bits at much higher that the normal price.

[RawDog]

Even the most trusted exchanges are suspected for manipulating volumes.

Bitcoin - the whole damn thing is just filthy

Well that's a funny approach, but it might not be that far off. The biggest and most compliant bitcoin company has an orderbook so thin and disproportionate to the volume on their exchange^[1] that manipulation even for them doesn't sound that far off. And yes, I'm talking about Coinbase. Perhaps volume manipulation is an industry standard.

[1]

Also, what happened to your videos?

Here you go Slavetard!! Here is my latest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKw_7sh1LSY
Thanks for watching

...and here is an important one on that lying bitch Hillary Clit-on: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE43M1Z8Iew

[lumeire]

No I don't think that they are fake transactions, as in some exchanges i am seeing that the price sometimes reach to a much higher value and on yobit I am selling my bits at much higher that the normal price.

These aren't fake transactions IMO they're bots trying to raise the volume by trading with themselves. What's new anyway, even the mining's controlled by 'btc mining cartels.'

[Kprawn]

What else did you expect with non-regulated exchanges all over the place? The Chinese has been doing this for years and for that reason many people do not even use their volumes as a indicator of the

average price per Bitcoin. I use the average price listed by these exchanges, Bitfinex | Bitstamp | BTC-E | LocalBitcoins as a guideline. The private sales are a much better indicator, but in many cases

a bit inflated. The regulated exchanges should be a bit more trustworthy... well, more that Mt Gox. 

[CIYAM]

The regulated exchanges should be a bit more trustworthy... well, more that Mt Gox.  

And which exchanges are actually "regulated"?

(the firms that audit them should be public as well as their audit reports - if not then I wouldn't say they are any more trustworthy than the "unregulated" ones)

It seems to some extent that this thing about exchanges often is just a "racist" thing - if you're non-western then your exchange must be suspect but if you are western then somehow it is not.

Perhaps it is just sour grapes from western exchanges that can't work out how to make a profit without charging trading fees.

[European Central Bank]

And which exchanges are actually "regulated"?

Gemini, Itbit and now Bitstamp? I assume they gotta do something to satisfy the authorities to get their pieces of paper like banking charters and so on.

[CIYAM]

Gemini, Itbit and now Bitstamp? I assume they gotta do something to satisfy the authorities to get their pieces of paper like banking charters and so on.

Well even if all of those - that is three out of how many?

And I'm still waiting to see public auditing reports (from any Bitcoin exchange).

[CryptoBjorn]

What else did you expect with non-regulated exchanges all over the place? The Chinese has been doing this for years and for that reason many people do not even use their volumes as a indicator of the

average price per Bitcoin. I use the average price listed by these exchanges, Bitfinex | Bitstamp | BTC-E | LocalBitcoins as a guideline. The private sales are a much better indicator, but in many cases

a bit inflated. The regulated exchanges should be a bit more trustworthy... well, more that Mt Gox. 

This is the exact reason why those volumes are manipulated. Those exchanges are an unregulated and luckily reputable parties put them aside.
Just look how coinmarketcap.com put some of those exchanges which have zero fees not in the total volume. It's from from realistic

[CIYAM]

Also - in regards to "what is taxed" the simple answer is "fiat" (not crypto).

So if any tax department is looking at anything they are only going to look at the fiat bank accounts.

My guess is that any "auditing" that is going on is purely on the "fiat" side and that the actual crypto side is not audited at all.

[RodeoX]

Any Evidence?

[CIYAM]

Any Evidence?

It should be up to those trying to claim that western exchanges are legit to prove that they are (so far I've seen no proof at all).

[RodeoX]

Any Evidence?

It should be up to those trying to claim that western exchanges are legit to prove that they are (so far I've seen no proof at all).

Proof is a rare thing here. 
I would guess that some exchanges are doing what they can to manipulate their trades. It is harder to believe in a conspiracy between lots of exchanges. And impossible to believe in a massive conspiracy between all mines, as stated in the original post.

[CIYAM]

I am not a supporter of conspiracy theories at all.

The simple test about an exchange is how fast you can buy or sell coins and then how fast you can withdraw your coins or fiat (nothing else much matters IMO).

Perhaps if some independents set up something that just does such tests every day we might have a better guide as to which exchanges are actually the best ones to be using.

[European Central Bank]

Well even if all of those - that is three out of how many?

And I'm still waiting to see public auditing reports (from any Bitcoin exchange).

Yup. I think we've seen time and time again that customers don't actually care about it, until they suddenly do. It's the margin thing and volume that keeps them coming back to the other ones no matter how many bizarro blips there are let alone total failures. Greed always wins.

[RodeoX]

As a side note, I think there is a lot of manipulation in most markets. We would probably all cry if we knew the truth about our 401k.

[crairezx20]

I think the transaction is real and they are using bot i think to control the volume and to attract people to invest their money this is a strategy if most of the altcoin owner they are using bot to boost the price..but result of decreases.

[mayax]

Bitfinex, Kraken, Coinbase, Bitstamp all charge fees. It is too expensive to manipulate volume on those exchanges as every trade will cost you money.

The only exchanges where the volume may be suspect are the ones that don't charge fees - Huobi and the other Chinese ones. But some of their trade is definitely real.

This is nonsense - if the bots are run by the exchange then the fees "cost nothing" (as it is coming from their own profits).

You can't trust *any* exchanges volume in Bitcoin (and never have been able to).

People seem to confuse Bitcoin exchanges with things like regulated stock exchanges - a very naive thing to be doing.

It depends on where they are based. In the western world, an exchange with that kind of volume and which is charging fees on every trade, is expected to show revenue in line with that and pay tax on the profits generated. There is no benefit in pretending you are making more than you really are because you only attract the attention of the taxman who wants his share. Tax authorities: keeping business from over stating revenue since the dawn of time.

MTGox was registered in Japan and believe me, you have to pay a lot of taxes there. Even so, MtGox used the Willy bot. It's very simple to setup a bot to make FREE transactions(no fee for trades that it's making).
The rest of the users are setup to be charged.

All the exchangers are using bots and that's why they can manipulate the price. They talk to each other, they know when the price will go up or down. I am referring to the biggest ones that I mentioned above. It's a fraud and the  BTC China CEO admitted an obvious thing...

Yes, if you are financial licensed it's harder to make tricks but it's possible if you setup free charge for your bots

[mayax]

I think we are definitely seeing an exaggerated price increase in such a short period of time. I won't be surprise if there is another "Willy bot" behind this.

However, I do think the current price is reflecting the current value of each coin. Perhaps a slow increase between now an halving is reasonable. If we ever get pass $1000 in the next few weeks, I am sure it is a bubble.

of course, it's "Willy bot" behind this and the exchanger's cartel is in action.