Will the immense value of bitcoin deter insitive to invest?

[helloworld719]

I have always loved bitcoin for so many reasons. It is decentralized, and fairly unregulated or controlled except by those who own incredible amounts of bitcoin. I love that it has the potential to be anonymous, considering you live in the right place and you know how to trade anonymously on a digital and physical level. Not to mention it is beginning to have a gold standard, not in gold but in illicit goods like drugs which have held and increased in value for thousands of years. There are so many good things going for bitcoin. I understand this halving period is going to arrive, that would increase its demand while decreasing its production, resulting in a spike in value.

I will be honest though, I never invested in bitcoin for any long-term gain, I have been buying bitcoin for almost four years now but always flipped them immediately, trading them to buy goods that I needed. So I am not an investor nor do I have very much knowledge in investing or how bitcoin works as a stock or currency. But I have watched it for a very long time, going up and down, watching how people reacted to certain stages of the currency.

Now I get to the main point and question I have for those who have a greater knowledge than I do in bitcoin. For the bitcoin to sustain its value and/or continue to raise in value does it not have to be accessible to the average investor? If the bitcoin reaches a value over $1000, or even high, possibly much higher would this not deter the average investor/buyer from wanting to buy bitcoin? Most people cannot afford to buy 1 bitcoin when its value is $1000+ dollars. Therefore I feel that the amount of bitcoin that is bought as to the the amount that will be sold will drastically decrease. Unless you can buy a large amount of bitcoin there really is very little money to be made. After all this really is all about becoming wealthy, being able to buy physical goods that we can use and enjoy. This wouldn't be a problem if you could easily go out in the world and buy a house, car, or a brand new tv with bitcoin. But at the moment there are not many vendors that are willing to give you the physical goods you desire in exchange for bitcoin. Right now it is a currency you really can only use to cash out for fiat money that you could then easily use to purchase those physical goods. So considering that why would the average person want to buy a bitcoin at say $1500 dollars knowing they cannot buy that new tv and having to fear that its value will not sustain itself or increase anymore than $1500 dollars. I think bitcoin is here to stay, and this halving event may result in a spike. But at some point I do believe that bubble will burst. I do wish I invested in bitcoin many years ago, I remember when I could have bought a bitcoin for $40 and did, but never as a long-term investment. At the moment I do not plan on buying bitcoin, it will continue to rise but I cannot buy enough for it to lead me to wealth or real change. When or if this bubble bursts I will change my game with bitcoin. What do you investors think of this?

[AgentofCoin]

What investors in Bitcoin/bitcoin are actually investing in, is it's current known and/or future unknown potential.

It is the same for all things that are considered speculative devices (Stockmarket, bonds, coin collections, flipping houses, etc).
It seems by your writing that you are attempting to differentiate Bitcoin/bitcoin from those speculative devices.

I ask you, why would anyone buy apple stock or government bonds when it won't make them outright wealthy?
Or why would the average person want to pay 724 USD for just 1 share of Google Stock?

Why would you admit being part of the Bitcoin community for 4 years, but not understand this concept?

One day, Robot A will pay Robot B in BTC since Robot B won't accept anything else.

[odolvlobo]

1. People invest in bitcoins because they can, but the utility of Bitcoin and its success do not depend on investment.
2. There is no reason to believe that you must buy a whole bitcoin. I cannot afford a 1kg bar of gold, but I can afford to buy 30 grams.

[helloworld719]

Yes I am very well aware that you can buy less than one bitcoin... but I think we can all agree that you won't make any fortune doing so. To actually make a difference in your financial situation you would not only have to buy at least one, but many bitcoins. So there is no incentive to buy less than one bitcoin. And look at the price now, it obviously reached a threshold where people can't afford to buy enough of them to make any real money. So again as it always does the price is going back down. Don't get me wrong if it goes down to 400 or even less I will be buying and holding but I recognize once it goes back to the 700-1000 range I will sell.

[Elwar]

I will never invest in gold because a bar of gold is way too expensive for me (over $400,000 for one bar).

Who would invest in something so expensive?

[helloworld719]

Well I think gold is an entirely different story. Gold is not really an investment anyways, its price increases with inflation. So essentially you don't really make any money but your money keeps its value which is a good thing. And you have to admit gold is far more stable than bitcoin. For one thing gold is universally accepted by just about every single person on the planet as a currency with value, bitcoin is not. Gold has held its value for thousands of years, and obviously bitcoin is new so it has not. I cannot afford a $400,000 dollar bar of gold either but if I had that kind of money I would feel more comfortable using the money to buy gold than bitcoin. Gold has a reputation far greater than bitcoin, it is trusted and has always been valuable. And that really means something. You have to remember all currency depends greatly on its illusion of value, people only  have to believe it has value. And people have believed gold is valuable since our species invented currency. That is a pretty powerful concept IMO.

[European Central Bank]

You're thinking about mom and pop. Forget them. It's not really going anywhere until investment professionals start to take a real interest in proper numbers. When they do, they package it up and sell it back to mom and pop.

[odolvlobo]

...
Now I get to the main point and question I have for those who have a greater knowledge than I do in bitcoin. For the bitcoin to sustain its value and/or continue to raise in value does it not have to be accessible to the average investor?
...

You already got your answer from people who have a greater knowledge than you:

No. The value of a bitcoin does not depend solely on investment. Furthermore, Bitcoin is accessible to the average investor.

BTW, if buying actual bitcoins is too daunting to an average investor, the investor can simply log into ETrade and buy shares of GBTC.

[helloworld719]

You are right, until these "professional" investors take an interest bitcoin is going to only go up and down like has been. But these professionals aren't going to invest in bitcoin until 50% of the population sees bitcoin as a real currency, which is most definitely not the case. Right now it is to dangerous to invest hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars into bitcoin because you have to rely on cashing out to make money. Until 50% of vendors that sell physical and useful goods accept bitcoin those professionals will not be interested in bitcoin. Now as a small investor it isn't so dangerous because I can cash out $20,000 worth of bitcoin in a week with ease. I can go to each bitcoin atm machine and collect $1000 each day, and I have about 10 of those because I live in a metropolitan area. Also I can go to localbitcoins.com and cash out even larger amounts, up to $10,000 in person with someone who is looking to sell. And I count myself lucky. I live in a metropolis that has a huge interest in bitcoins, with many bitcoin atm machines and independent vendors that buy and sell. In most areas people could not cash out that much in such a short period of time, or at least not anonymously. But if a professional had $1,000,000 in bitcoin and the price started to collapse there would be no realistic way to save their money. No one would buy them out, therefore they would never risk such an investment.

[European Central Bank]

Can we have some paragraphs please?

If the population sees it as a currency then there's no real reason for them to bother. Their existing currency works fine. If they start to look at it as a way of increasing or protecting their savings, as the stock market is thought of, then their interest is gonna be caught.

I think that's where it's eventually headed and that's the angle that is gonna be used to increase the amount of users. Even then that's a long way away yet. A bunch of stuff is gonna have to be ironed out.

[helloworld719]

...
Now I get to the main point and question I have for those who have a greater knowledge than I do in bitcoin. For the bitcoin to sustain its value and/or continue to raise in value does it not have to be accessible to the average investor?
...

You already got your answer from people who have a greater knowledge than you:

No. The value of a bitcoin does not depend solely on investment. Furthermore, Bitcoin is accessible to the average investor.

BTW, if buying actual bitcoins is too daunting to an average investor, the investor can simply log into ETrade and buy shares of GBTC.

This will probably be my last reply. I may have used the wrong terminology. Instead of saying the average investor I should have just said the average person. I am not talking about someone who is actively investing in stocks, new ideas, or new currencies to protect their savings or to increase them. I am talking about the man or women that wakes up every morning to get ready for work.

In a way we are all investors, even the average "person" will put back an x amount of dollars every paycheck for emergencies or to save for more expensive goods they could not buy with just a single paycheck. My point is the average person is going to simply hold the extra US dollars they make from that paycheck and will not use them to buy bitcoin. And that is largely due to the fact that they cannot buy what they need to survive with bitcoin, they do not trust that it will hold its value, and it is to expensive for them to use money they have left over from that paycheck on something they cannot actively use to buy stuff and trust in to keep its value.

Most people are not savvy about investments, and do not understand that bitcoin has a great potential to protect their savings or even increase the value of their savings. I am not trying to devalue or "dis" bitcoin. I want the average person to see its potential and value but you have to look at bitcoin from THEIR eyes. It doesn't matter if they are uneducated, or are not savvy about bitcoin and what it stands for, what it is worth. But they control it's value, the average joe in the end will decide whether or not bitcoin will survive, because they win in numbers, maybe not in intellect but they will outnumber you always and forever. And their opinion on the matter matters more than yours, because you are a minority, and the majority always wins.

@european central bank... I agree with most of what you have said. I think the key in bitcoins success is increasing its user base. We need more regular people to put their savings into bitcoin before its value will stabilize. But this may never happen, and until it does I can only look at bitcoin as a quick source of income, buying when it is low and selling when it is high. I see it as a yearly income boost. Usually at least once a year you will see a spike in bitcoins value. You can make at least $5,000-10,000 a year on top of your daily job income which is great IMO. And you could make a lot more if you have the guts and money to make it happen. I see bitcoin as a way to pay my years rent, maybe one day it will be something a lot more. But free rent is awesome!

[lkjsiugdf]

Hello from Foregney, fellow Visionoreys!!
 
I must to purchuse as meney of your voluable cointellas as i posibley can, my inflating goverment FIAT to much!
But alll i monybills is very big, which I am current unabel to  with transact due too largness is to much.
If you please would trustelesly deposite into my tokenwallet 50 BTC off coin's, i wil rebemeres u massiveley 100 BTC's tomorow.
I egerly owait ur RSVP so please hurry up and send BTC soon.
Sorey four my bad englaisky.

Your friend,

The other sirius invester.