I wish Spoetnik and other critics of ICOs would realize you can't build s/w like Bitcoin with volunteers.

Bitcoin wasn't built by a lone Japanese guy in his basement. It was built by the DEEP STATE as a TrojanHorse in the coming global sovereign debt collapse and the lurch to digital currency and a one-world reserve currency controlled by the global elite. The DEEP STATE has at least the $4 trillion Black Budget that is stolen from the USA DoD as admitted by for example Donald Rumsfeld.

Idiots who think s/w can be built with volunteers don't seem to understand that all major open source projects are corporate funded.

It's interesting to note that the author of the above comment is the (former?) employer of the OP, kushti.

"Drugs"? What is your issue man?

You obviously don't have much reading comprehension. It was in reference to the bad shit crazy post above mine. Alex and I have a great relationship. Try again son.

Is Bill Moyers on drugs?

http://billmoyers.com/episode/the-deep-state-hiding-in-plain-sight/

Is this the same Charles who once told me that everyone knows (speculates) that the NSA created Bitcoin? Did you conveniently forget you used to think that, somewhere along your journey  

Cripes man, I was supporting your employee's position on the necessity to raise funds to fund the development of block chain software.

I've never in my entire life tried the class of "drugs" you are alluding to, unless you count the very few times I took sleeping pills in my 30s, the Codeine I took when my wisdom teeth were extracted, and the high powered morphine analog I was given only twice (two 3 hours respites from 4 days of nonstop huffing and puffing burning like hell inside) during the acute peptic ulcer ICU hospitalization in 2012.


Btw, perhaps you've detected that I really don't support governance as a solution. I believe in the "code is the law" and finding solutions other than Foundations and governance. So perhaps that might be a reason for lack of harmony between our respective plans and platforms. I am not sure about that, because I can't read your mind. Just saying.

Edit: also that doesn't mean I entirely reject Bitcoin. Even badly intentioned things can sometimes be leveraged for good outcomes, or even the good can be intentionally obscured within the bad because often people disobey their orders when they feel it is necessary to do so. And I expect the reality is multifarious. We each speak from a perspective of it.

From my perspective, Bitcoin is clearly designed to co-opt traditional finance powers at the nation-state level, i.e. disposable nation-state central banks and too-big-to-fail banks. And the control of Bitcoin is shifting to the Chinese miners and mining farms.

So who in hell had the $millions it cost to develop Bitcoin to risk on some unproven decentralized concept?

Take yourself back to 2007 or 2008 when the first stages of development likely began. Not many investors would have had any confidence that an electronic money scheme could work. Chaum's ecash had failed.

Heck even years later after Bitcoin was launched, 10,000 BTC was only exchangeable for a pizza. Hindsight is 20/20 vision. Try to really put yourself back 8 years and think who would've invested $millions in creating Bitcoin?

And look at what Bitcoin is designed to disrupt economically. And look how Bitcoin's economics was intentionally designed to become centralized on mining farms. And don't tell me that Satoshi didn't know that because not only did he write that he expected that, but Nick Szabo had also written years before that ASICs would take over any such scheme.

This is the same as when I got banned for speaking out against Ethereum (wonder who paid off the mods for that one?). The capacity for delusion and ignoring basic facts possessed by the guys on BCT knows no boundaries.

Yet according to Charles I am "batshit crazy". Yet he is one of the founders of this Ethereum debacle. He claims (in his recent video) he got kicked out of Ethereum because of he wanted stronger governance, stricter budgets, and more regulatory complaint ICO, yet no where has he admitted that I told him frankly that Turing-complete scripting would be a clusterfuck (in spite of gas limitations on how long a script can run).

Honestly back in those days I politely told Charles that I couldn't start a project with him at that time. Because frankly speaking I could see he was going to stuff any project with too many mouths to feed instead of hunkering down and focusing on the work to be done. So I kindly told him, "I am not ready to do some big ICO thing, go forth without me". So now Charles is this big TedTALK personality and I am batshit crazy. Ain't it nice how it works out that way. We also learned in Charles' recent video that he is the one who hooked up the Chinese money with the ProtoShares ICO.

Let's not forget that recently kushti (and Charles' company) were trying to re-start my proof-of-diskspace concept that I had invented in 2013 and had abandoned because I realized it was insolubly flawed. Perhaps they are pissed off because I explained to them again that was a flawed direction for them to not pursue. Maybe they intended to raise a lot of money again with a flawed technology.

Charles, so who is "bat shit crazy" here?

Be careful with your mouth Charles. I've respected the confidence of other things you've told me. Don't push me. I empathized with you. I never thought you were like this. Now I know.

Are you pissed off because I criticized Russian scammers in the thread you started about how WAVES was using your company assets without your permission?  (and no it doesn't mean I discriminate any ethnicity, cripes!) Cripes I supported you in that thread also. And now we see that maybe WAVES has already scammed.


And then you posted this in thread I started about the potential legal quagmire for Vitalik and Tual, which sure seemed like another attack on me:


And it was hilarious when you subsequently a day later used my legality thoughts (from entire thread quoted) in your "Thoughts on the DAO" blog post.

So then maybe you were pissed off, because I responded to that thread you started by disagreeing with talk about needing governance and all that jizz and stated the real issue is "NO FORKS!":

Would "they" ban a drunk homeless man from the alley way nearest to the Capitol, for wailing incessantly, "Michelle is a HIV-positive, male ICO!"?


Because my arguments have more technological bite than yours. They can deal with you by promoting your reputation. See all that red they put on you. Attacking my reputation doesn't really work. I even attack my own reputation. You've seen the photo of "my" balls right? (even it was stated that wasn't my balls, but let's not engorge on irrelevant details)


Like I said, your arguments are grasping for technological coherence.


I did not implicate the USA govt.

The entire point of Bill Moyers' DEEP STATE presentation is that the USA govt is not in control of the USA.

Satoshi exited after he found out Gavin would be talking to the CIA. So it wasn't the "USA govt" who created Bitcoin.

You don't find it peculiar that no one can find a trace on the "man". Who besides government secret agents are able to accomplish that when everyone is searching for them ("him")  


Bill Moyers and the guy who did the research on the DEEP STATE are mainstream and highly respected. That guy was in a high position in the government.

I did not claim it is falsifiable. I am applying Occam's Razor. It is quacks and walks like a duck, maybe it is a duck. Okay maybe it could be a Spoetnik penguin. So admit you really created Bitcoin didn't ya?  

Please don't use the words "see a shrink" or "batshit crazy" with impunity. Real sane people actually get committed to mental institutions and forcibly enslaved. It is not a joke. I really don't appreciate it.

(not that anyone will ever take me alive in an illegal entrapment, because I am a Cherokee indian and I will die on the spot preempting any unjust attempt to take my freedom)

Roach, good observations and strong points!

Does it mean that only Bitcoin is a good basis for social projects, all other currencies are "private" ones? The holders of currencies will benefit and all other participants will loose sooner or later.

I'm rather new to the topic, so sorry if my question is stupid one.

The simplest explanation is *USUALLY* the correct one means USUALLY.. not ALWAYS.

And you Bill Byrne'd me LOL
He knows a guy who knows a guy "who said"
That is NOT proof.

Is there some conspiracy after Bitcoin was launched ? i bet yes !
We know the FBI had a pow wow with the dude getting 900k a year.

You do realize the topic is morality and you have once again veered off into the bushes gone 4 by'in right ?

I did not mean to insult you just point out how you seem to be oblivious to things on a level.
A tendency to plow on hard & stubborn on tangents never letting up.
They say you were banned for criticizing Ethereum here.
Which is WHY i brought up that i just got banned on their IRC channel.
It was not a pissing contest to see who's opinion is smarter or more feared.
But a correlation and assertion that THEY are scared Frauds.. unwilling to accept criticism.
Worth pointing out i was not doing squat.. they banned me for some past commentary i guess.
I only noticed because i was afk for hours and my ICON flashed telling me something was said.

Cryptsy did the same thing too.. bans all round.. just delayed out of context & random.
I had mentioned before the Cryptsy Points hack incident because that is how the story was relayed to me..
Those were the words people used when they told me the story i passed along over here on the forum
..from the Troll-Box.
Jim Shockney showed up here on the forum and flipped out demanding i was a liar and there was no hack.
and that they had never been hacked.. time stamps show Paul Vernon saying they were hacked even worse
before the points hack and i think JShock was in on it or knew about it.
So he was lying.. but they gave me a 1 year chat ban anyway (for my choice of words here)
When all i did was relay what i had heard from chat box users the next day.. when i went to Cryptsy.
And.. it did happen too !
They rolled back the markets and mentioned it on their Twitter so YES it DID happen.
SO no i never lied about squat.. and they were hacked.. more than once !
if you believe they were hacked for 12.5 million then shut down.. i think Paul stole the money.
So that would be 1 fake hack and 1 real hack LOL

Who are they scared of Shelby ?
I don't know..
Who is smarter ? seems your hinting at that LOL
Who is the smarter guy here Shelby ? Me or You ?

Look left bud.. see a Penguin with an Ak47 ?  
Do i look "banned" to you ?  

Do we have the changesets for the changes from the November 2008 source code:

https://github.com/benjyz/bitcoinArchive/tree/master/nov08

To the v0.1 January 2009 source code:

https://github.com/benjyz/bitcoinArchive/tree/master/bitcoin0.1

So we can see who did most of the work on the source code?

Has any one estimated the man-hours for those changes in that 2.x month timespan?

Remember my point was that it required $millions to develop Bitcoin into reliable system over that 12-18 month timespan. And apparently Gavin is very close with the CIA. Who was funding that early development and why. Bitcoin was only worth less than 10,000 BTC per pizza.

And so we do agree we can't develop something like Bitcoin without $millions of investment. It can't be done a lone Japanese guy in his basement.

Most of Bitcoin core developers and the Foundation are utterly corrupted. Core devs are building startups on top of Bitcoin(Blockstream, Bloq etc) or serving companies around it. The blocksize drama happened mostly because of different devs lobbying different corporate interests. I think there's no reason to explain how miserable Bitcoin Foundation history is.  So Bitcoin in fact is pretty bad example for "public money" concept. Other than that, I see your point and found it quite interesting.