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Question: What should the nomination of the funded coins be?
1 BTC
0.1 BTC
0.05 BTC
0.01 BTC
They shouldn't be preloaded.
They shouldn't be pre-assembled (DIY coins).

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Author Topic: [POLL][PRE-ANN] Project XEROLA | Modernly designed physical Bitcoins  (Read 1165 times)
Zeroxal (OP)
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June 27, 2016, 08:52:44 PM
Last edit: June 28, 2016, 07:08:21 PM by Zeroxal
 #1


Presenting you project XEROLA.
I aim to bring new series of coins into the physical collectible bitcoin market by introducing whole new designs with a modern touch.
Because this will be the first ever physical bitcoin I'll will make and sell, I kindly ask you for opinions.

What will the mintage be?
No more than 100 coins will be minted for each design. Each design will consist of 50 preloaded high quality .999 silver coin and 50 more affordable unloaded or DIY version of the coin (plated zinc alloy or brass).

What's the goal?
The absolute highest priority is quality and uniqueness. Every coin will be engraved with their unique serial number and encapsulated immediately after the minting process. An unique hologram for each year will be placed onto the back of the coin, covering and protecting the private and public key. The public key will be shown through a small transparent "window" in the center of the hologram. My goal is to make a series of coins that will suit everybody while being innovative at the same time.

Why should this coin be so special?
The packaging will contain the following:
1x Unique PGP signed certificate of authenticy
1x Xerola branded Velvet pouch
1x Airtite Coin capsule
...and many more to come along with the coin announcement.

To make the project more original and stand out of the crowd, the whole packaging of the coin and and COA will be sealed using an unique seal that hasn't been seen on the market ever before which looks absolutely beautiful. It will be revealed along with the first coin.
Each coin will have a securely generated vanity address that will relate to the series, material and serial number. For example a "X" series coin made out of silver with the serial number 1 will have a public address starting with: 1XS001

What will the design look like?
Serveral designs have been created by me and I decided to show one of them for you to judge Wink
The "X" Coin (X because of Xerola):

Either gold highlighted or pure silver.
(Note that this is only a design concept and the final design will probably be retouched to fully suit the coin)
Due to the first coin ever being made by me, the nomination will likely be changed to 0.01 or 0.05 BTC.

Edit: Design concept number 2:

This was originally planned to be released as a bitcoin token with no face value (similar to bitcoin penny). Let me know your thoughts on this design. Should it be released as a token or a funded coin?
3d renderings of design 1:



How do you ensure security of the private keys?
Now comes the part that frustrates me the most. Because I will be selling prefunded coins with a private key generated and printed by me, I want to ensure that none of the prefunded coins will be unloaded by a third party or even me.
To ensure printing and generating security, the vanity addresses will be generated on a Macbook with a freshly installed operating system. These keys will then be combined into a print document which will be printed on an offline printer directly connected to the Macbook. The whole process will be done offline.
After printing, the private key files will be destructed and the public key file will be kept in order to fund the coins. That being said, it's up to the buyer to trust me on not keeping any private key info.

Pricing:
1 Troy ounce .999 silver coins will cost around 0.15-0.3 BTC/each (excluding funding amount)
Plated coins will cost around: 0.03-0.08BTC each.
Prices may vary on the bitcoin market price of coin launch.

Please give suggestions!
I'm not sure yet if the coins should be prefunded, therefore I kindly ask you to give me some suggestions by voting on the poll.
All suggestions and opinions are very appreciated!

It isn't confirmed yet if any coins will launch. But they most probably will when there is enough interest in them Wink
(I know this thread is a little messed up, I'll put more effort in it and edit it when I'll have time)
Bitcoin addresses contain a checksum, so it is very unlikely that mistyping an address will cause you to lose money.
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Zepher
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June 27, 2016, 09:06:33 PM
Last edit: June 27, 2016, 09:17:33 PM by Zepher
 #2

Sounds awesome, seems like you've put a lot of thought into this project Smiley

Definitely think a good percentage of the community will agree that a low loaded amount at first would be best, I'd be willing to buy a Silver with 0.1BTC on it if this project comes to fruition. Looking forward to seeing actual pics when you're ready. Good luck!

Edit: actually 0.01 or 0.05 would probably be your best bet as a new merchant of physical crypto as others have stated in your other thread. You'll get more sales. Trust needs to be earned, and that is probably your best way of obtaining it.

My only payment address: 1ZephertJThxkHih7XcaUHBkMSnvkTt5u
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June 27, 2016, 09:14:22 PM
 #3

Yeah !  congratulations Zeroxal !

good luck for this project man !   Smiley
i will be more than happy if i could help in any way ...

I wish you all the best with XEROLA project !   Smiley




defcon23
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June 27, 2016, 09:21:19 PM
 #4

I would recommend not spending a lot on costly fancy packaging etc.... Quality is much more important in the long run.
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June 27, 2016, 09:23:44 PM
 #5

And you gotta use a laser!  Can you burn the private key with a laser in the middle of the coin and then cover with a hologram? Smiley
Zeroxal (OP)
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June 27, 2016, 09:26:45 PM
 #6

Thanks Zepher and defcon for the kind words!

And you gotta use a laser!  Can you burn the private key with a laser in the middle of the coin and then cover with a hologram? Smiley
You mean laser engraving the private key into the coin? Not sure if I'm able to do that though :/
I don't think letting a mint doing that would be secure enough and I don't have any equipment for it Tongue
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June 27, 2016, 09:29:31 PM
 #7

Thanks Zepher and defcon for the kind words!

And you gotta use a laser!  Can you burn the private key with a laser in the middle of the coin and then cover with a hologram? Smiley
You mean laser engraving the private key into the coin? Not sure if I'm able to do that though :/
I don't think letting a mint doing that would be secure enough and I don't have any equipment for it Tongue

Don't laser etch or engrave, it can be revealed with a cheap x-ray that some pawn shops use.  Since packages are also imaged in transit at various locations, it might be compromised enroute.
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June 27, 2016, 09:39:52 PM
 #8

I voted for funded 1BTC each. I also agree that engraved is a security risk. I am interested in 1 of each full silvers.
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June 27, 2016, 09:41:20 PM
 #9

your design looks real nice sir.
Zeroxal (OP)
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June 27, 2016, 09:54:37 PM
 #10

your design looks real nice sir.
Thanks for the compliment. I'm working on a 3d rendering on the coin to bring out the "zigzag / spiky" element of the design.

I voted for funded 1BTC each. I also agree that engraved is a security risk. I am interested in 1 of each full silvers.
Thanks for sharing your vote. May I ask why you decided to choose 1BTC over 0.1 BTC or 0.05 BTC?
I don't think 1BTC would be a good idea to sell on huge volumes because of the laws. Seems like 1BTC is the funding amount the majority wants, if that's going to happen, I'll probably limit the batch to 10 or 25 coins.
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June 27, 2016, 10:02:43 PM
 #11

definitely nice, watching... Smiley
Zeroxal (OP)
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June 27, 2016, 10:11:16 PM
Last edit: June 27, 2016, 10:22:00 PM by Zeroxal
 #12

I uploaded another design concept that was originally planned to be released as a token. Please let me know your opinion on that Smiley
(Edit under the first design)
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June 27, 2016, 10:49:14 PM
 #13

Quote
After printing, the private key files will be destructed and the public key file will be kept in order to fund the coins. That being said, it's up to the buyer to trust me on not keeping any private key info.

You need to consider carefully how to destroy the files. Casascius physically destroyed the harddrives, there might be other safe ways to do it (I am not an expert in this field), but simply deleting the files will not do it. Especially if it is a magnetic drive.

Cryptography is one of the few things you can truly trust.
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June 27, 2016, 11:42:37 PM
 #14

your design looks real nice sir.
Thanks for the compliment. I'm working on a 3d rendering on the coin to bring out the "zigzag / spiky" element of the design.

I voted for funded 1BTC each. I also agree that engraved is a security risk. I am interested in 1 of each full silvers.
Thanks for sharing your vote. May I ask why you decided to choose 1BTC over 0.1 BTC or 0.05 BTC?
I don't think 1BTC would be a good idea to sell on huge volumes because of the laws. Seems like 1BTC is the funding amount the majority wants, if that's going to happen, I'll probably limit the batch to 10 or 25 coins.

I just prefer coins with a full 1BTC or higher face value. I always disliked the Casascius .1 coins due to their low face value.
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June 28, 2016, 02:12:58 AM
 #15

Perhaps make concept 2 DIY and/or token and concept X funded?  Being X, 0.1BTC makes perfect cents [sic].  What's your timeframe (obviously 2017).
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June 28, 2016, 02:43:32 AM
 #16

Thanks Zepher and defcon for the kind words!

And you gotta use a laser!  Can you burn the private key with a laser in the middle of the coin and then cover with a hologram? Smiley
You mean laser engraving the private key into the coin? Not sure if I'm able to do that though :/
I don't think letting a mint doing that would be secure enough and I don't have any equipment for it Tongue

Don't laser etch or engrave, it can be revealed with a cheap x-ray that some pawn shops use.  Since packages are also imaged in transit at various locations, it might be compromised enroute.
Should be fine if the minted coin has a circular cavity, then you use a separate round (same metal) insert with the laser printed priv. key facing into cavity with hologram over it.  Want to get fancy, make both threaded and "screw" the private key in.  The hologram can have foil underneath to further conceal from xray...
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June 28, 2016, 02:51:31 AM
 #17

Thanks Zepher and defcon for the kind words!

And you gotta use a laser!  Can you burn the private key with a laser in the middle of the coin and then cover with a hologram? Smiley
You mean laser engraving the private key into the coin? Not sure if I'm able to do that though :/
I don't think letting a mint doing that would be secure enough and I don't have any equipment for it Tongue

Don't laser etch or engrave, it can be revealed with a cheap x-ray that some pawn shops use.  Since packages are also imaged in transit at various locations, it might be compromised enroute.
Should be fine if the minted coin has a circular cavity, then you use a separate round (same metal) insert with the laser printed priv. key facing into cavity with hologram over it.  Want to get fancy, make both threaded and "screw" the private key in.  The hologram can have foil underneath to further conceal from xray...

I would buy that coin. Smiley
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June 28, 2016, 03:56:57 AM
 #18

I will buy one as well  Roll Eyes
Zeroxal (OP)
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June 28, 2016, 05:04:05 AM
 #19

Quote
After printing, the private key files will be destructed and the public key file will be kept in order to fund the coins. That being said, it's up to the buyer to trust me on not keeping any private key info.

You need to consider carefully how to destroy the files. Casascius physically destroyed the harddrives, there might be other safe ways to do it (I am not an expert in this field), but simply deleting the files will not do it. Especially if it is a magnetic drive.
The Macbook features a 128bit or 256bit built in folder encryption. All the private keys will be managed through the encrypted folder. They will be PGP encrypted using my keybase key and decrypted afterwards to enable printing. The print file (pdf) will also be encrypted.
After the printing process, the keys will be checked one last time for the validness and wiped from the disk afterwards. I have specific software ready for that.

The operating system will be newly installed after each batch.
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June 28, 2016, 06:02:37 AM
 #20

Quote
After printing, the private key files will be destructed and the public key file will be kept in order to fund the coins. That being said, it's up to the buyer to trust me on not keeping any private key info.

You need to consider carefully how to destroy the files. Casascius physically destroyed the harddrives, there might be other safe ways to do it (I am not an expert in this field), but simply deleting the files will not do it. Especially if it is a magnetic drive.
The Macbook features a 128bit or 256bit built in folder encryption. All the private keys will be managed through the encrypted folder. They will be PGP encrypted using my keybase key and decrypted afterwards to enable printing. The print file (pdf) will also be encrypted.
After the printing process, the keys will be checked one last time for the validness and wiped from the disk afterwards. I have specific software ready for that.

The operating system will be newly installed after each batch.
Just buy a flash drive, run a unix system off it, generate keys then destroy the flash drive. Remove the hard drive from the machine before doing this, and I would think many people would be happier. You can still recover data from a disk that has been written over it. I think to reach a moderately safe amount of write overs, you would have to do it 30 times at the very minimum. I believe the software to do this is Dban (Darik's boot and nuke), its a boot and nuke which writes over your disk, and has other options available. If I were producing these coins I would take the time to secure these private keys, destroying the hard drive is the best way.

Also keep a printer that is not hooked to any other devices (i.e. one that can only be accessed using physical cables) just in case the printer caches anything. Do not use a printer that has wifi enabled, that would be the death of you.

Eventually all encryptions will be broken. It just is when?

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