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Author Topic: Treasury Draws Negative Yield for First Time During TIPS Sale  (Read 2319 times)
jgarzik
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October 26, 2010, 01:50:13 AM
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URL: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-25/treasury-draws-negative-yield-for-first-time-during-10-billion-tips-sale.html

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The Treasury sold $10 billion of five-year Treasury Inflation Protected Securities at a negative yield for the first time at a U.S. debt auction as investors bet the Federal Reserve will be successful in sparking inflation.

The securities drew a yield of negative 0.55 percent, the same as the average forecast in a Bloomberg News survey of 7 of the Fed’s 18 primary dealers. The sale was a reopening of an $11 billion offering in April. Conventional Treasury notes erased gains amid speculation on the amount of debt the Fed may buy to spur the economy in a tactic called quantitative easing.

Jeff Garzik, bitcoin core dev team and BitPay engineer; opinions are my own, not my employer.
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hugolp
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October 26, 2010, 06:00:55 AM
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Investors are expecting a heavy rise in the CPI that will offset the negative interests and will end up giving them money. Otherwise it makes no sense. Its a sign that investors expect heavy inflation.
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October 26, 2010, 07:23:31 AM
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You guys ever listen to peter schiff? He'll tell you all about the coming inflation in the USA.
www.youtube.com/user/schiffreport

He thinks the dollar is going to collapse and he makes a very good case for this.

He'd probably think Bitcoin is awesome too.
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October 26, 2010, 07:34:50 AM
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You guys ever listen to peter schiff? He'll tell you all about the coming inflation in the USA.
www.youtube.com/user/schiffreport

He thinks the dollar is going to collapse and he makes a very good case for this.

He'd probably think Bitcoin is awesome too.

Peter Schiff was, for a short while, my financial advisor.  Well, his company, not him in particular.  I have a lot of respect for the man's insights, particularly with regard to overseas investing, but he's been crying inflation for about a decade.  Mish seems to be a more accurate a forecaster of monetary issues than Schiff, and I already know that he doesn't regard Bitcoin very highly, but he is aware of it at least.

Austrian economics is a tight field at the national level, I'd bet dollars to donuts that a great many are already aware of Bitcoin and are either watching it from a quiet distance or have written it off because it's not backed. 

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
hugolp
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October 26, 2010, 08:04:23 AM
 #5

Peter Schiff was, for a short while, my financial advisor.  Well, his company, not him in particular.  I have a lot of respect for the man's insights, particularly with regard to overseas investing, but he's been crying inflation for about a decade.  Mish seems to be a more accurate a forecaster of monetary issues than Schiff, and I already know that he doesn't regard Bitcoin very highly, but he is aware of it at least.

Austrian economics is a tight field at the national level, I'd bet dollars to donuts that a great many are already aware of Bitcoin and are either watching it from a quiet distance or have written it off because it's not backed.  

LewRockwell published an article about Bitcoin. In fact it was one of the first big internet publications to do it.

Peter Schiff has not been claiming inflation for decades... Peter Schiff claims that the crisis will turn into an inflationary crisis (most people agree). What Peter missed was the disinflationary phase after the crash of the bubble and he has acknowleged it.

I dont trust Mish. He got the desinflationary crash right, but the way he treats people that discusses with him is very very suspicious. He manipulates his words and builds strawman to attack them. I dont trust that kind of people. Also, his focus on the coming deflation when the inflatariony phase is about to hit is suspicious. Specially because his business is based in the USA and looks more interesting with a strong dollar...

Peter Schiff is in the same but opposite situation. Peter has a business that focus on foreign stocks, so the projection of a weak dollar makes his business look better, which is what might have lead him to downplay the desinflationary phase. Whether intentional or a mistake by Peter, in both cases I think it was a big mistake that did not help him, on the contrary it hurt his business. I think he same is going on with Mish but towards deflation.

What I really like about Peter is that he is funny and brings people to the movement. When I started discovering austrian economics I watched a lot of Peter videos, and that lead me to more complex stuff. Someone funny always help to spread whatever you want to spread.
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October 26, 2010, 12:15:36 PM
 #6

Peter Schiff's  father would probably like bitcoin as well. Lips sealed

hugolp
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October 26, 2010, 12:32:12 PM
 #7

Peter Schiff's  father would probably like bitcoin as well. Lips sealed



Irwin Schiff is a real hero.
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October 26, 2010, 12:45:36 PM
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Peter Schiff's  father would probably like bitcoin as well. Lips sealed



Irwin Schiff is a real hero.

Agreed.

Ed and Elaine Brown also.
kiba
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October 26, 2010, 03:32:44 PM
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Austrian economics is a tight field at the national level, I'd bet dollars to donuts that a great many are already aware of Bitcoin and are either watching it from a quiet distance or have written it off because it's not backed. 

Bitcoin is a free market currency! It arise spontaneously! What not to like?

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October 26, 2010, 03:38:13 PM
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What I really like about Peter is that he is funny and brings people to the movement. When I started discovering austrian economics I watched a lot of Peter videos, and that lead me to more complex stuff. Someone funny always help to spread whatever you want to spread.

+1
Peter Schiff is one of the funniest austrian economist commentator.  Very pleasant to listen.  I like his analogies for instance.
BrightAnarchist
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October 26, 2010, 09:39:55 PM
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I'm actually going to an investment conference in New Orleans (http://www.neworleansconference.com/) this week. If I get a chance to speak to Peter Schiff then I'll be sure to mention Bitcoin to him!
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October 26, 2010, 10:02:34 PM
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I'm actually going to an investment conference in New Orleans (http://www.neworleansconference.com/) this week. If I get a chance to speak to Peter Schiff then I'll be sure to mention Bitcoin to him!

I suspect Peter Schiff is not geek enough to understand how good is the bitcoin.

However, if we could convince him that bitcoin is potentially better than gold, and if we could convince him to advocate for it, this would be a huge support for bitcoins.

Tell him some people (like me) have even started to sell their gold for bitcoins Smiley
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October 27, 2010, 01:26:21 AM
 #13

You guys ever listen to peter schiff? He'll tell you all about the coming inflation in the USA.
www.youtube.com/user/schiffreport

He thinks the dollar is going to collapse and he makes a very good case for this.

He'd probably think Bitcoin is awesome too.

Austrian economics is a tight field at the national level, I'd bet dollars to donuts that a great many are already aware of Bitcoin and are either watching it from a quiet distance or have written it off because it's not backed

It's silly to say that Austrian economists insist on backed currency. Backing is something you do to a crappy piece of paper if people won't take it without. Gold is not backed by anything, it IS gold. Bitcoin is not backed by anything it IS bitcoin. The dollar IS paper that used to be backed by gold, now it just IS paper.

The actual thing >>> promises.

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
grondilu
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October 27, 2010, 02:07:45 AM
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It's silly to say that Austrian economists insist on backed currency. Backing is something you do to a crappy piece of paper if people won't take it without. Gold is not backed by anything, it IS gold. Bitcoin is not backed by anything it IS bitcoin. The dollar IS paper that used to be backed by gold, now it just IS paper.

+1
kiba
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October 27, 2010, 02:29:00 AM
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Someday, Jeffrey Trucker is going to run an eloquent article on the beauty of bitcoin and free market money on mises.org. Trust me on this.  Wink

MoonShadow
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October 27, 2010, 04:54:19 AM
 #16

You guys ever listen to peter schiff? He'll tell you all about the coming inflation in the USA.
www.youtube.com/user/schiffreport

He thinks the dollar is going to collapse and he makes a very good case for this.

He'd probably think Bitcoin is awesome too.

Austrian economics is a tight field at the national level, I'd bet dollars to donuts that a great many are already aware of Bitcoin and are either watching it from a quiet distance or have written it off because it's not backed

It's silly to say that Austrian economists insist on backed currency. Backing is something you do to a crappy piece of paper if people won't take it without. Gold is not backed by anything, it IS gold. Bitcoin is not backed by anything it IS bitcoin. The dollar IS paper that used to be backed by gold, now it just IS paper.

The actual thing >>> promises.


First off, don't quote me and then alter the quote without saying that you did so.  As it is, it looks like I was stressing that point.

Second, I am aware that Austrian Economic Theory requires sound money, not necessarily hard money.  As a praxeologist myself, I think that Bitcoin qualifies; but most of the Austrian economists that we are speaking of have been in the battle with Keyesnians for decades.  So as a result, they can be a bit jaded and suspicious of new systems that claim anything near what Bitcoin aims to accomplish.  For many, who also have public reputations to maintain, if it's not a naturally occurring form of money, they are not likely to give it much consideration.

That said, it doesn't even matter what these guys are thinking about Bitcoin, if they are thinking anything at all.  Whatever will be, will be.  If Bitcoin has a future at all, then it does not depend on the advocacy of anyone in particular.  If it needs advocacy to succeed, then it has no long term viability anyway.

I'm sure that some are quietly watching from a politically safe distance, waiting to see what a few crypto-geeks and other early adopters can make of it.  In any case, those Austrians with a public image to cultivate aren't going to advocate for a currency still inflating at the current rate of about 60% APR anyway.  By the time Bitcoin is crossing trendlines with major fiat currencies, we will all know with a measure certainty whether or not we have been backing the winning racehorse or the nag headed for the glue factory, and so will they.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
BrightAnarchist
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November 02, 2010, 03:38:33 AM
 #17

I'm actually going to an investment conference in New Orleans (http://www.neworleansconference.com/) this week. If I get a chance to speak to Peter Schiff then I'll be sure to mention Bitcoin to him!


Okay, I ran into him and gave him a copy of my article (http://www.bitcoinblogger.com/2010/09/bitcoin-electronic-currency-future-of.html).

No clue if he even read it, but at least it was an attempt.
TTBit
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November 06, 2010, 03:48:00 AM
 #18

I'm actually going to an investment conference in New Orleans (http://www.neworleansconference.com/) this week. If I get a chance to speak to Peter Schiff then I'll be sure to mention Bitcoin to him!


Okay, I ran into him and gave him a copy of my article (http://www.bitcoinblogger.com/2010/09/bitcoin-electronic-currency-future-of.html).

No clue if he even read it, but at least it was an attempt.

I just e-mailed support on his radio website asking if they will accept bitcoin as payment for premium services.

good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgment
hugolp
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November 06, 2010, 04:33:48 AM
 #19

I'm actually going to an investment conference in New Orleans (http://www.neworleansconference.com/) this week. If I get a chance to speak to Peter Schiff then I'll be sure to mention Bitcoin to him!


Okay, I ran into him and gave him a copy of my article (http://www.bitcoinblogger.com/2010/09/bitcoin-electronic-currency-future-of.html).

No clue if he even read it, but at least it was an attempt.

Good. I agree with others that Schiff is not the type of guy that jumps into something like bitcoin but who knows. Its always good to promote bitcoin.
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