[General] Bitcoin Wallets - Which, what, why?

[nc50lc]

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All I wanted to say is there are too many wallets to choose from, and being new to crypto, I want to open a wallet that is relatively easy to use ant that is secure compared to other available counterparts.

I remember back in the days somebody who was given bitcoin as gift so that he would use a wallet or a miner, It was a couple years back, i can't remember exactly what it was.

Wait, so he received bitcoins first before he had a wallet? Must be a paper wallet then (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Paper_wallet).
But free btc to use a miner?
The only instance where it could happen is in a fake "cloud mining scam" where the user is handed free (fake) hashrates or bitcoins to rent them in order to earn BTC which he can't withdraw.

BTW, it was a long reply because of the "free bitcoin wallet", adding "free" to it is perplexing.

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[OmegaStarScream]

No online "wallets", that makes sense. Not comfortable with a hardware wallet because it might be stolen, lost, etc.         

A desktop/mobile software wallet, that is the deal.

There's nothing to be uncomfortable about. A thief won't be able to access the funds without the PIN code and even you lose the device, you can always recover it using the seed phrase, the same thing you would do if you lose access to your desktop or mobile wallet.

[SFR10]

"Other wallets" like Coinbase aren't in the list because those are not actually wallets but a custodial service where that company is the actual hodler of your coins.

As much as I hate Coinbase, I have to mention they've created a non-custodial wallet ^{[not sure when they've introduced it]} that it isn't directly connected to their Coinbase app ^{[it has a different icon as well]}:
^{- Despite saying the above things, I still wouldn't recommend "any" of their services.}

• The Coinbase app, where you buy and sell crypto, is a hosted wallet. You can also download the standalone Coinbase Wallet app to take advantage of the benefits of a non-custodial wallet.

• Coinbase Wallet is a user-controlled, non-custodial product. The app generates a 12 word recovery phrase which is what gives you, and only you, access to your account to move received funds. Coinbase will never have access to this seed, meaning that we cannot move funds on your behalf even if you lose access to your recovery phrase.

I want to open a wallet that is relatively easy to use ant that is secure compared to other available counterparts.

When it comes to its security, it heavily depends on how secure both of your devices are.

Update:

Yes, I have mentioned "Coinbase" which is different from their non-custodial wallet: "Coinbase Wallet".

Sorry, I thought you were referring to them as a single wallet/app.

[nc50lc]

"Other wallets" like Coinbase aren't in the list because those are not actually wallets but a custodial service where that company is the actual hodler of your coins.

As much as I hate Coinbase, I have to mention they've created a non-custodial wallet ^{[not sure when they've introduced it]} that it isn't directly connected to their Coinbase app ^{[it has a different --snip-}

Yes, I have mentioned "Coinbase" which is different from their non-custodial wallet: "Coinbase Wallet".
In fact, I have afew replies here in Beginners & Help differentiating the two  

e.g. (plus more info):

-snip-
Coinbase wallet app:- said to have private key(s) but is it accessible?

-snip-
The actual names are:
Coinbase - Buy and sell Bitcoin (Just "Coinbase"): Their custodial wallet with simple buy and sell feature, same as the web version.
Coinbase Pro - Bitcoin & Crypto Trading: The actual Exchange that has real exchange features.
Coinbase Wallet - Crypto Wallet & DApp Browser: The non-custodial wallet app, just like blockchain()com's, it has no option to export private keys individually,
the only way to export the keys is to use BIP39 compatible wallets and tools.

Confusing naming system right?
More info: https://wallet.coinbase.com/faq/

[Charles-Tim]

No online "wallets", that makes sense. Not comfortable with a hardware wallet because it might be stolen, lost, etc.         

A desktop/mobile software wallet, that is the deal.

I think you are confused about what online wallets are, you meant web wallet. Web wallet are the most vulnerable wallet type, their private key are stored on a databas.

Offline wallets/Cold wallets

• Paper wallet

• Hardware wallet like Trezor, Ledger Nano and ColdCard
• Wallet on airgapped devices, like Electrum cold storage wallet on airgapped device.

Online wallets/ Hot wallets

• Web wallet
• Mobile wallet
• Desktop wallet

No online "wallets", that makes sense. Not comfortable with a hardware wallet because it might be stolen, lost, etc.         
A desktop/mobile software wallet, that is the deal.

There's nothing to be uncomfortable about. A thief won't be able to access the funds without the PIN code and even you lose the device, you can always recover it using the seed phrase, the same thing you would do if you lose access to your desktop or mobile wallet.

Litespirit, some newbies do not know all they need is their seed phrase (+passphrase if included) or private key which they can be used to regenerate back their wallet and be able to spend the Bitcoin the private key control. With the pin said by OmegaStarScream, it will be difficult or nearly impossible for the thief to get access to the wallet while if passphrase is included, it will be impossible for hackers to know the keys and address through physical attack on wallet like Trezor. Hardware wallets are one of the safest wallets so far as the private keys and seed phrase are stored offline and can never be revealed to hackers, but the passphrase which is not stored at all will make it safer for open source wallets like Trezor, while no physical attack can reveal the seed phrase on the ones that make use of secure electrum to generate the seed phrase like on Ledger Nano. Only attack that can get through is clipboard attack which is an online attack while making transaction, no private key will be revealed but recipient address can be changed to a hacker's address through this type of clipboard (and maybe QR code) malware, but it is advisable to check and recheck the address you intpued before sending, but online wallets listed above are not as safe as hardware wallet because hardware wallets are cold/offline wallet.

As much as I hate Coinbase, I have to mention they've created a non-custodial wallet ^{[not sure when they've introduced it]} that it isn't directly connected to their Coinbase app ^{[it has a different icon as well]}:
^{- Despite saying the above things, I still wouldn't recommend "any" of their services.}

But one thing I do not like about Coinbase wallet (the noncustododial wallet) is that it will first bring up users to store their seed phrase on Google cloud, while seed phrase storage suppose to be stored offline for best safety because we can not trust anything stored online.

Yes, I have mentioned "Coinbase" which is different from their non-custodial wallet: "Coinbase Wallet".
In fact, I have afew replies here in Beginners & Help differentiating the two  Wink

Yes, you are absolutely right. But in addition, what I noticed is that people (I am not saying SFR10 is getting confused, in fact, he knows the differences between the two wallets and replied accurately) are getting confused and do not know the difference between Coinbase and Coinbase wallet, I am not certain if the wallet is open source of which I doubt, I guess it will be close source, but being a wallet of confusion makes me not to recommend it to anyone.[/list]

[suboo112123]

What is the best BTC wallet for use?

[n0nce]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but is there a (tier) list of fully airgapped (imho safest option) hardware wallets?

I know so far of

• Foundation Devices Passport
• Keystone (previously Cobo!!) Vault

[decodx]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but is there a (tier) list of fully airgapped (imho safest option) hardware wallets?

I know so far of

• Foundation Devices Passport
• Keystone (previously Cobo!!) Vault

You can find a list of all hardware wallets here: [BIG LIST] Hardware wallets (80+) (Ratimov deserves credit for this)
However, I do not know if it has been updated.

[dkbit98]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but is there a (tier) list of fully airgapped (imho safest option) hardware wallets?

There are several list of hardware wallets I collected before, and I am still maintaining them:
- LIST of all Open Source Hardware Wallets
- Secure Element in Hardware Wallets

Some of this hardware wallets may claim they are airgapped but they are closed source, and I would avoid using them (Ellipal and Safepal for example).
Note that Open Source, airgapped device and secure elements alone by itself doesn't make some wallet safer or better.
It should be tested by security professionals and user for some time to identify if there are any bugs and flaws in code.
Even then, hardware wallets are not perfect and you will always have tradeoffs with them.

[n0nce]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but is there a (tier) list of fully airgapped (imho safest option) hardware wallets?

I know so far of

• Foundation Devices Passport
• Keystone (previously Cobo!!) Vault

You can find a list of all hardware wallets here: [BIG LIST] Hardware wallets (80+) (Ratimov deserves credit for this)
However, I do not know if it has been updated.

Not sure if this is the right thread, but is there a (tier) list of fully airgapped (imho safest option) hardware wallets?

There are several list of hardware wallets I collected before, and I am still maintaining them:
- LIST of all Open Source Hardware Wallets
- Secure Element in Hardware Wallets

Some of this hardware wallets may claim they are airgapped but they are closed source, and I would avoid using them (Ellipal and Safepal for example).
Note that Open Source, airgapped device and secure elements alone by itself doesn't make some wallet safer or better.
It should be tested by security professionals and user for some time to identify if there are any bugs and flaws in code.
Even then, hardware wallets are not perfect and you will always have tradeoffs with them.

Thanks a lot for the lists!
I agree that open source software + hardware is needed And the device being airgapped & having an (open source) secure element, is of course not a total guarantee for security, but security wise technologically (aside from bugs and flaws etc.) superior to a wallet lacking one of the features.

Let's take the Trezor without secure element: no need for a bug in the code - just read out the flash and see the keys. So in that case, even a potentially buggy secure element would still be harder than none at all.

[suboo112123]

What are the best hardware wallets that I can buy? Now I'm using the trust wallet to store my cryptos.

[joniboini]

Most would be okay with Nano S or Trezor. It depends on what you need. If you're using it for cold storage, storing only one or two coins, don't want to spend more than $100, then Nano S is good enough. If you want bluetooth, manage your wallet with your phone, etc there is Nano X. There are dozens of HW on the market like Keepkey etc. Check out https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=261.0 for more discussion.

[n0nce]

Most would be okay with Nano S or Trezor. It depends on what you need. If you're using it for cold storage, storing only one or two coins, don't want to spend more than $100, then Nano S is good enough. If you want bluetooth, manage your wallet with your phone, etc there is Nano X. There are dozens of HW on the market like Keepkey etc. Check out https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=261.0 for more discussion.

Imagine recommending Ledger in late 2021, after all the hacks and shit
There are so many wallets these days, I think the real good ones are mentioned all in these threads from dkbit98 - open source and secure element are really a must-have in 2021 imho (additionally to good reputation, independent security analyses and reviews).
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1631151.msg57824908#msg57824908

I highly encourage not just plain recommending the standard "Trezor and Ledger" how we all used to do 4 years ago. Things have changed a lot and there are better options for sure (like BitBox02) that barely cost more than the once go-to-models you mentioned and have open hardware, were not hacked and use secure elements for example.

Btw, since I mentioned it: BB02 got a revised secure element after a security flaw in the previous one was discovered (even though hard to trigger). So I think we can see the guys at Shift handled the situation super well by immediately changing all following units to the new chip. This is just an example, and I'm not an endorser of Shift Crypto, just wanted to give a concrete example of a good alternative to Ledger & Trezor additionally to just linking to the two lists that were mentioned earlier.

[decodx]

Anyone know the most popular hardware wallets of the new generation? I have been searching for a hardware wallet that is both new and reliable. I came across and was thinking of ordering Opolo Cosmos, but it's still not available. Is there anything similar that is verified?

[Husna QA]

Anyone know the most popular hardware wallets of the new generation? I have been searching for a hardware wallet that is both new and reliable. I came across and was thinking of ordering Opolo Cosmos, but it's still not available. Is there anything similar that is verified?

On the website, the hardware wallet can be purchase via pre-order. Even the prices on some of the sales packages are discount.

My advice, try to find valid references or reviews from users who have used the product.
One of the references I found here: https://www.forbes.com/sites/tatianakoffman/2020/09/24/best-crypto-hardware-wallets-of-2020/

[dkbit98]

Anyone know the most popular hardware wallets of the new generation? I have been searching for a hardware wallet that is both new and reliable. I came across and was thinking of ordering Opolo Cosmos, but it's still not available. Is there anything similar that is verified?

There is no hardware wallet that can be new, verified and good, especially not Opolo wallet that is still in presale, it's like you are purchasing experimental cat in a bag.
If you are interested in hardware wallet check out few topics like LIST of Open Source Hardware Wallets and Hardware Wallets with Secure Elements to get better picture of your options.
Going exotic and checking Big List of Hardware Wallets is also an option, but I don't recommend experimenting so much with more than a crypto pocket money.
Best hardware wallet should ideally be Open Source, with secure element, airgapped and tested by security professionals.

[Charles-Tim]

Best hardware wallet should ideally be Open Source, with secure element, airgapped and tested by security professionals.

But it is quite always surprising that the two most sold wallets in the world, Trezor and Ledger Nano do not possess all these characteristics.

Trezor does not have secure Electrum but including passphrase makes it perfect as salting process makes it generate new keys and addresses entirely which is different from the keys and addresses that would have been generated if no passphrase is included, this makes Trezor resistant to Kranken experimental attack which can be done only if Trezor is stolen from someone and if the thief knows about how to go about the attack. This makes Trezor to be perfect for me as it is open source by including passphrase.

Ledger Nano is both open and close source wallet, which means not everything about Ledger Nano is open source, and the only component about the wallet which is close source is the secure electrum which is responsible for seed phrase generation and storage. This makes Ledger Nano to be resistant to such physical attack that can reveal the seed phrase. But yes that the secure element being close source can result to an unknown pre-generated seedphrase that can be used against Ledger Nano owner if the Ledger company has malacious intention, but I do not think they should have malacious intention which will later be obvious to people and affect the company's integrity which can fold up the company possibly.

But above all, close source wallets should be discouraged especially any non-reputed hardware wallet that are completely close source and online wallets that are close source too because malware can be included in their source code without the public knowing about the malware.

[n0nce]

Anyone know the most popular hardware wallets of the new generation? I have been searching for a hardware wallet that is both new and reliable. I came across and was thinking of ordering Opolo Cosmos, but it's still not available. Is there anything similar that is verified?

There is no hardware wallet that can be new, verified and good, especially not Opolo wallet that is still in presale, it's like you are purchasing experimental cat in a bag.
If you are interested in hardware wallet check out few topics like LIST of Open Source Hardware Wallets and Hardware Wallets with Secure Elements to get better picture of your options.
Going exotic and checking Big List of Hardware Wallets is also an option, but I don't recommend experimenting so much with more than a crypto pocket money.
Best hardware wallet should ideally be Open Source, with secure element, airgapped and tested by security professionals.

I agree a lot with this, the tested by security professionals (independent ones) is often overlooked. A new product has not yet been 'tried and tested' thoroughly by the whole community, so bugs might and probably do still exist. Of course, to aid in the security analysis, open source code, firmware, and secure element, helps a ton because then you're not looking at a black box.

Best hardware wallet should ideally be Open Source, with secure element, airgapped and tested by security professionals.

But it is quite always surprising that the two most sold wallets in the world, Trezor and Ledger Nano do not possess all these characteristics.

I think it's because they were the first well implemented wallets, then everyone recommended them and does to this day, even though there are much better alternatives, just because they're this well known by now.

We should always keep our 'recommendation list' for anything really, up to date based on recent developments, found exploits etc., and not just keep recommending something for 10 years imho

[OmegaStarScream]

English version:

Hello,
I still have not received the transfer made on the 7th of december at 10:54 from
-snip-

Name of beneficiary: Coinbase Ireland Ltd
Bank name: AS LOHMUS, HAAVEL AND VIISEMANN / TALLINN
IBAN: EE26 7777 0000 8423 2416
BIC: LHVBEE22

Can you tell me why ? It's been 72 hours, we are on 12/10.

Do we have to validate something in particular? they told me IBANI that it was indeed a SEPA transfer. No money return on IBANI account for the moment.

Thank you for your reply,

According to this [1]. It should take up to 3 business days. I would wait for 24 hours, then reach out to the support, they're the only ones who can help you in this situation. Also, it might be a good idea to remove your bank account from your post.

[1] https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/getting-started/add-a-payment-method/payment-methods-for-european-customers

[zasad@]

Engineer hacks Trezor wallet, recovers $2M in 'lost' crypto
Hacker helps Trezor One owner who forgot his wallet passcode and seed phrase to recover cryptocurrency funds valued over $2 million.
https://cointelegraph.com/news/engineer-hacks-trezor-wallet-recovers-2m-in-lost-crypto
“We are basically causing misbehavior on the silicon chip inside the device in order to defeat security. And what ended up happening is that I was sitting here watching the computer screen and saw that I was able to defeat the security, the private information, the recovery seed, and the pin that I was going after popped up on the screen."