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Author Topic: FREE BITCOINS -- Environmentally conscious mining!  (Read 12303 times)
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June 16, 2011, 11:14:30 PM
 #41

I love this idea.I hope to create an "eco-generator" which consists of battery banks,solar,wind turbine plus a diesel backup generator run on used veg oil (as there's no way I'm payin 4 diesel)

I duno how I'm gonna go about it but it'll b complex I think as this intergrates a switcher between solar,wind and a diesel generator to charge the battery banks which then go through an inverter to run my gear.


I design these systems for a living. I would trade my services for btc. Cheesy
Does this include designing and helping me make blue prints if needed?

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June 16, 2011, 11:20:51 PM
 #42

I can help with:
- Conceptual development
- System design
- Component selection
- Blueprints no, wiring diagrams yes.
- You will need to observe the regulations of your local electrical code and ensure that the end design falls within them. For the most part, these systems would meet local and national electrical codes by themselves.

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June 17, 2011, 11:34:52 AM
 #43

This sounds like a very cool project! Following.

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June 17, 2011, 03:33:15 PM
 #44

I guess it would be wise to set things up in such a way that it's self-booting, just in case some freak weather keeps the energy sources bellow minimum for too long and the whole thing dries off and shuts down; so instead of having to go there in person to pump up the breakers again at risk of being ambushed by raptors, the whole thing will automaticly get back at work as soon as possible.

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June 17, 2011, 03:38:52 PM
 #45

This looks very interesting.  Grin I was thinking about something similar over here, given the fact that I pay very little on electricity in general, so I could use the grid as I set up all the solar panels and start mining ASAP, but the aggressive difficulty increase took me by surprise, sadly, and I began to question the profitability of my little project.  Sad Doesn't help much that I wasn't an "early adopter", either. So I decided it was wise to back up. But if this does work, well, it'll be amazing.

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June 17, 2011, 03:39:59 PM
 #46

Some of us could do with some equipment like that, let us know when you are NOT around, have you added in the cost of potentially having your kit stolen.

Have you thought about using biodiesel from USED Veg oil ( Carbon Neutral )  and a diesel generator, many restaurants will gove you this free since they have to pay to have it disposed of.
Not sure of the numbers but anyone running a serious mining operation might want to look into using waste veg oil and a ( preferably whisper quiet ) Generator.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOFbsaNeZps



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June 17, 2011, 04:25:43 PM
 #47

I guess it would be wise to set things up in such a way that it's self-booting, just in case some freak weather keeps the energy sources bellow minimum for too long and the whole thing dries off and shuts down; so instead of having to go there in person to pump up the breakers again at risk of being ambushed by raptors, the whole thing will automaticly get back at work as soon as possible.
A few issues with remote locations in the full force of the nature:
- very hot summer days could create ambient temperatures of over 35C, this is the air that is used to ventilate, you don't want to cook everything inside, especially the batteries
- lead batteries freeze at -15C if they are discharged, you need to know ahead of time if the charge won't go below 20% overnight while you operate at temperatures that converge to -15C, you don't want to freeze anything
- a controller is needed to manually or automatically shut down everything from the main breaker box, including power sources, battery bank and inverters, in case of extreme heat, equipment issues, etc
- same controller needs to be able to power up everything, for example after a power drain, when the sun or wind has charged the battery bank sufficiently to allow minimal operation (this controller needs it's own battery and internet connection, could easily be a small netbook with large battery)
- several sensors, software and calculations, to allow for graceful degradation of compute power or increase in performance if power is over capacity (think overclocking everything and turning the fans to the max)

This looks very interesting.  Grin I was thinking about something similar over here, given the fact that I pay very little on electricity in general, so I could use the grid as I set up all the solar panels and start mining ASAP, but the aggressive difficulty increase took me by surprise, sadly, and I began to question the profitability of my little project.  Sad Doesn't help much that I wasn't an "early adopter", either. So I decided it was wise to back up. But if this does work, well, it'll be amazing.
In theory you only lose your time and equipment value loss, energy is free, NOBODY can be more efficient than you in mining. Currently some people are fudging over the market value because of their devious acts, and taking a good chunk of the honest market down with them. If the situation does not resolve itself (aka, before July the BTC should be above 35$), new mining projects should be put on hold.

Some of us could do with some equipment like that, let us know when you are NOT around, have you added in the cost of potentially having your kit stolen.

Have you thought about using biodiesel from USED Veg oil ( Carbon Neutral )  and a diesel generator, many restaurants will gove you this free since they have to pay to have it disposed of.
Not sure of the numbers but anyone running a serious mining operation might want to look into using waste veg oil and a ( preferably whisper quiet ) Generator.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOFbsaNeZps
I intend to have automated surveillance and a stand-by guard near-by (he already checks the property daily anyway, I could raise his allowance to include the project too). So no, you won't know where the installation will be located, and you won't be able to loot it. And even if you do, you will get 2000-3000$ worth of equipment.

Used vegetable oil is not Bullshit Neutral, I already explained some of the issues:
- diesel generators using petrol would cost 10x the grid cost, not really efficient
- diesel generators using non-designed fuels either decay their engines or require more cleaning and maintenance
- vegetable oil is made from vegetables which besides making these rich carbohydrates count up for a large amount of their mass also produce fiber and cellulose that can't be used and use some of the energy for growth, reproduction and dead tissue, you get less than 10-15% of a plant's mass in oil.
- best vegetables have solar > body mass conversion rates for the photosynthesis process of 2-3%
- solar panels have efficiencies of up to 20-30% compared to vegetables for the same surface
- vegetable oil requires processing costs, transportation and storage

In conclusion, vegetable oil is terribly inefficient (less than 0.2%)  compared to directly sucking the sun rays into a GPU with efficiencies of over 10%.

Sounds like a great idea. List it on the GLBSE! I would invest in this.
Not sure if want...

I'll add it to the list of ideas, in case I start a separate project website for this.

Also, is anyone selling Chinese made monocrystaline solar cells for bitcoins? Should be cheap to send to Romania. Do note you have to beat these prices: http://www.okazii.ro/cautare/monocristaline+solare.html (1$/W inc shipping).
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June 19, 2011, 08:58:53 AM
 #48

I've been looking at solar power for my home recently, and have found its often much cheaper to lease solar systems rather than to buy them. This could help reduce your start up costs. Most solar companies don't collect their systems after the lease ends, instead they either let you keep it or let you buy it for very very cheap. After the lease period (typically 10-25 years) the solar panels are too obsolete/warn for them to re-lease anyway.

Another thought is that the slow discharge batteries used for solar systems tend to have a useful life span of only 5 years. Is this project off the grid by choice or is there a lack of access at the location? It could be cheaper and more sustainable for you to remain hooked to the grid for use at night. If your system is large enough to fully charge a battery bank, it should be large enough offset your nightly power usage so your energy costs remain zero. You might even get some subsidized incentives, in the USA having solar attached to the grid earns you renewable energy credits which can be sold to energy providers (energy companies are required to invest a certain amount of money in renewable energy or they are fined). I don't know if there is anything like this in Romania.

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June 19, 2011, 02:08:46 PM
 #49

Have you considered the use of a gassifier? You can take any waste plant matter and convert it to combustible gas to power a generator.

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June 19, 2011, 04:09:03 PM
 #50

Used Veg oil is Free,.
Also, if it were so inneficient, farmers wouldn't be able to grow it and sell it for less than diesel, I know it costs the same now but that's only because the petrochems and govt hiked the price of veg oil up shortly after the Jeremy clrckson experiment.
Prior to that I was buying veg oii at 52p per liter, regular diesel was 100p oer liter, this is impossible according to your argument because it eats more energy than it gives out.
It may well be that photosynthesisis oil molecules is inneficient,  but mother nature is doing the work, not the farmer, and as used veg oil is Free, it's efficiency skyrockets.
I used to use veg oil in my car regularly and know many people who use used veg oil.

In fact, just like Bitcoin, using used Veg oil as fuel is a booming industry, maybe BitCoin and Biodiesl should meet up, I'm not knocking solar, it's a faboulous technology but Biodiesel is 100% carbon neutral, the CO2 released by burning the oil is only that which was absorbed by the plant while it was growing, there is no NET CO2 gain to the atmospherre.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=veg+oil+biodiesel&btnG=Google+Search&aq=o&aqi=&aql=&oq=

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June 19, 2011, 08:56:28 PM
 #51

I've been looking at solar power for my home recently, and have found its often much cheaper to lease solar systems rather than to buy them.
Not an option. Also I will be getting the solar systems cheaper by using my own work hours for assembly, paying only for things I can't do myself (such as pull a single 2m silicone monocrystal, slice it, coat it with rare minerals and protection layers).

Another thought is that the slow discharge batteries used for solar systems tend to have a useful life span of only 5 years. Is this project off the grid by choice or is there a lack of access at the location? It could be cheaper and more sustainable for you to remain hooked to the grid for use at night. If your system is large enough to fully charge a battery bank, it should be large enough offset your nightly power usage so your energy costs remain zero. You might even get some subsidized incentives, in the USA having solar attached to the grid earns you renewable energy credits which can be sold to energy providers (energy companies are required to invest a certain amount of money in renewable energy or they are fined). I don't know if there is anything like this in Romania.
Batteries have a low life span, it's considered, you are being too kind with 5 years actually. Some days the power generators will produce extra power, some days they will not. Either way, I can't benefit from it by selling it to the grid, it's not an option here. I can only benefit if I store it myself (0.3$/Wh for batteries that suck up whatever my 1$/W solar cells and wind turbines produce, not bad).

Have you considered the use of a gassifier? You can take any waste plant matter and convert it to combustible gas to power a generator.
If it requires manual handling and extra maintenance, I can't. Also I would need to procure fuel for it, and I won't be on the premises most of the time, I guess it's not an option. Could be interesting to use animal waste and useless agricultural residues that can't be turned into moonshine. This might be an option for other people.

Used Veg oil is Free,.
It is not, I explained above. Solar energy is not free either, it costs 1$/W for 20 years for example.

It may well be that photosynthesisis oil molecules is inneficient,  but mother nature is doing the work, not the farmer, and as used veg oil is Free, it's efficiency skyrockets.
I used to use veg oil in my car regularly and know many people who use used veg oil.
Again, it's not an option for me, I would have to actually carry it for many miles, store it and burn it. Due to the fact that I need to burn it, and explaining that diesel is basically 10 times more expensive than solar, and considering your previous calculation, oil would be 5 times more expensive, I will briefly explain why:
- Solar rays hit the solar panel and convert E=mc2 energy with a 20% efficiency, for 12 hours a day (45 degrees N latitude), summer and winter, with no maintenance, requiring a 20m2 surface for 1000W.
- Solar rays hit the leaves of an oil-rich seed plant, during 4-6 months of a year, with a small surface efficiency (most of the rays go onto the ground), for 14 hours a day (summer), with some maintenance and extra costs, requiring a large surface, land taxes, land work, seed purchasing... etc

It's not an option for me, as I would have larger costs this way, and I think that it's a waste of a crop land to just burn the produce after taking care of it for a year. Solar is more efficient per time, per surface, per costs, per everything. It is an option for some people that could collect the vegetable oil and burn it themselves where solar energy would be costly or unavailable.
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June 19, 2011, 11:16:12 PM
 #52

How expensive it is to build your own little molten salt Solar plant?

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June 20, 2011, 12:39:53 AM
 #53

How expensive it is to build your own little molten salt Solar plant?
Well you could build one with just a little bit under $400M, it could serve 100.000 houses with a surface of 200ha. I guess one could reduce the design to a 1/10.000 ratio (40.000 USD, 5kW, 200sqm). Because it requires cooling water 5L/kWh, which would have to use energy to pump, it is not applicable due to the average precipitation levels in the area and the limited access to water reserves in the area. The advantage is overnight production from an efficient energy accumulator. The disadvantage is increased costs and lower efficiency compared to static silicon panels.
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June 22, 2011, 01:55:54 PM
 #54

Check out the Rossi Catalyzer

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June 22, 2011, 02:45:14 PM
 #55

Check out the Rossi Catalyzer
In this thread we abide to the Laws of Thermodynamics. Sorry Smiley

On a serious note, uneducated people have a hard time figuring out what parts of an energy reactor are the actual reactor and which are the actual fuel. Examples include: Bedinni magnets, carbon-iron alloy cast hidrogen car engine, atomic nuclei...
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June 27, 2011, 12:31:18 PM
 #56

Check out the Rossi Catalyzer
In this thread we abide to the Laws of Thermodynamics. Sorry Smiley

On a serious note, uneducated people have a hard time figuring out what parts of an energy reactor are the actual reactor and which are the actual fuel. Examples include: Bedinni magnets, carbon-iron alloy cast hidrogen car engine, atomic nuclei...

Funny how one comes on to a technology oriented forum involving a discussion about alternative energy, and even then, is instantly personally attacked for merely making a suggestion to review a technology. I don't know if you have looked out a window since you opened up your high-school text books, but things are changing pretty fast. History always welcomes technological breakthrough's with open arms right? If it was real you'd have seen it on TV by now...

BITCOINTALK STAFF SELECTIVELY ENFORCE THE RULES IN AN ATTEMPT TO CREATE A CHILL EFFECT AND PERMANENTLY REMOVE ME AND OTHERS FROM THIS FORUM AS RETALIATION FOR SPEAKING OUT ABOUT THEIR ABUSIVE BEHAVIOR, AND THAT OF THEIR PERSONAL CLIQUES.
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June 27, 2011, 12:52:47 PM
 #57

sounds great and all but i think you'd be better of investing all that infrastructure capital in more mining equipment and using a spare room.

then offsetting your pollution through your electricity company if it has that option, or just planting a food garden/trees on your land instead.


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June 27, 2011, 02:28:33 PM
 #58

Check out the Rossi Catalyzer
In this thread we abide to the Laws of Thermodynamics. Sorry Smiley

On a serious note, uneducated people have a hard time figuring out what parts of an energy reactor are the actual reactor and which are the actual fuel. Examples include: Bedinni magnets, carbon-iron alloy cast hidrogen car engine, atomic nuclei...

Funny how one comes on to a technology oriented forum involving a discussion about alternative energy, and even then, is instantly personally attacked for merely making a suggestion to review a technology. I don't know if you have looked out a window since you opened up your high-school text books, but things are changing pretty fast. History always welcomes technological breakthrough's with open arms right? If it was real you'd have seen it on TV by now...
Please excuse my skepticism. As I have seen bullshit and fakes for 10 years of my life, with people claiming to have (re)invented the water engine, free energy, free bullshit, etc... I don't shun you or your offers, but please understand that it's easy to get carried away by the hope of extraordinary claims. Not only have I explained why some people (sometimes) promote things they don't understand thinking they are doing a good deed when instead they promote stupidity, but I explained why, and a simple process to use to verify the extraordinary claims.

If you can explain what you understood from the "Rossi Catalyzer" other than "hurr durr it produces free energy by unknown means", then you should continue promoting it. If you can't explain anything more, you should check your position on the issue, the feeling of being right is not necessarily something that arises from logic or reality, it can be a purely subjective result.

sounds great and all but i think you'd be better of investing all that infrastructure capital in more mining equipment and using a spare room.

then offsetting your pollution through your electricity company if it has that option, or just planting a food garden/trees on your land instead.
The greenery of the orchid, surrounding trees and wild plants is quite overwhelming at this time of the year. I just visited the place and basically I couldn't find enough land area to plan the solar arrays. Some of the power can be used to pump water from the ground (especially during the summer days when using the extra sun is impossible, batteries are charged, heat prevents extra compute or capacity already full), so gardening is possible.

I need to look into more info on how to put solar arrays high up on poles, otherwise they won't get full exposure all day.
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June 28, 2011, 07:55:13 PM
 #59

For me, electricity takes up about 10% or more of our profits. One of my friend's dad in our collective mining operation (a whopping 1Ghash) is currently working on getting a wind turbine up and running. The original goal of the turbine was to power his beer chiller in his barn. It might eventually power our rigs. He recently added a gear ratio to get the generator up to the proper RPM. But unfortunately, the mounting was not strong enough and severely damaged all three of the blades. (when he was testing it, he was using blades a company lent his to try them out. $200 right there. ouch.)

He works at a local telecommunications company and when they upgraded their old telephone system, they let him take their 24v battery array off their hands - for free. Each of these batteries weigh in around 300 lbs and there are twelve of them. They have a 20-25 year lifespan and are only about 5 years old. I've tried to get him to understand that his battery bank is way larger than most people use for his setup.

*reading up on Rossi Catalyzer*
The idea looks good. Definitely much better than previous low-energy nuclear reactions. If they could demonstrate a device using this method that would power itself as well as other devices, then they could legitimize themselves a bit more. As far as the scope of the this thread is concerned, this technology is out of reach for home/DIY use. If they ever did make a reasonably priced, self-contained power and hot water generator, I'd buy it.

I'm an ex-miner. I still love bitcoins, but I've decided it's too expensive to mine for me. Lowered the difficulty a bit for the rest of you Wink

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June 28, 2011, 11:58:13 PM
 #60

Why not just rent space at a local power generator (hydro)?  The owner/operator would eagerly rent you space and sell you very very cheap electricity...

This is especially true for countries outside of U.S. where everyone is looking for extra income.

The other option is to produce your own electricity and sell back to the grid.  Then, your per Kw cost could be 0.  The only problem with this option is how much is the capital expense?  If we had solar technology that was much more efficient than it is today, this would work nicely.

Rossi's stuff, if real, would disrupt the whole world as we know it!

A huge part of me wishes he's for real.  A small part of me tells me, if it's too good to be true it probably is.

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