Bitcoin Forum
November 21, 2017, 12:35:02 PM *
News: Latest stable version of Bitcoin Core: 0.15.1  [Torrent].
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2  All
  Print  
Author Topic: This is what some of you actually believe.  (Read 3964 times)
ElectricMucus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1568


Drama Junkie


View Profile
April 03, 2013, 07:26:24 AM
 #1



If you know transhumanism is bullshit you should be able to draw your conclusions from there. IF not welcome to the south sea.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
1511267702
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1511267702

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1511267702
Reply with quote  #2

1511267702
Report to moderator
1511267702
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1511267702

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1511267702
Reply with quote  #2

1511267702
Report to moderator
1511267702
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1511267702

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1511267702
Reply with quote  #2

1511267702
Report to moderator
Join ICO Now A blockchain platform for effective freelancing
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
1511267702
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1511267702

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1511267702
Reply with quote  #2

1511267702
Report to moderator
1511267702
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1511267702

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1511267702
Reply with quote  #2

1511267702
Report to moderator
ManBearPig
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 350


"Don't go in the trollbox, trollbox, trollbox"


View Profile WWW
April 03, 2013, 10:54:46 AM
 #2

OK, I'll bite.

Turn it upside down and the same case applies with just as much fervour.

Market cap of $1T, price of $50K/BTC @ 21M coins mined in a few long years, after the expected ups and downs.

That's nowhere near a singularity Mr Kurzweil Grin

I tweet crypto nonsense: https://twitter.com/DunningKruger_
NamelessOne
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 840



View Profile
April 03, 2013, 10:59:41 AM
 #3

Transhumanism is actually already happening to various degrees. There are all kinds of useful implants and genetic therapies appearing on the market. Doesn't mean a singularity will happen like Kurzweil goes on about. Eventually our computers/smartphones will be thought controlled and probably just seamless implants in our skulls that won't even be visible. Thought controlled computing already exists. Even some crazy brain to brain interfaces for rats let them SHARE brains. It is incredible.

mobodick
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 840



View Profile
April 03, 2013, 11:11:25 AM
 #4



If you know transhumanism is bullshit you should be able to draw your conclusions from there. IF not welcome to the south sea.

What is bullshit about transhumanism?
There is no way of stopping it, imo.
mccorvic
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 518



View Profile
April 03, 2013, 11:12:43 AM
 #5

The following response shalt be considered the end of this thread. OP is free to lock it afterwards:

Cool story, bro. You sound mad.

Offering Video/Audio Editing Services since 2011 - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=77932.0
ElectricMucus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1568


Drama Junkie


View Profile
April 03, 2013, 11:55:26 AM
 #6

The following response shalt be considered the end of this thread. OP is free to lock it afterwards:

Cool story, bro. You sound mad.

I'm not mad, overall I've earned money from this bubble. Not as much as I would like but I am not complaining.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
humanitee
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 728


View Profile
April 03, 2013, 11:57:35 AM
 #7

Oh hey it's Mucus with more bear stuff.

Should have posted this in your other thread that's already full of fail.
ElectricMucus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1568


Drama Junkie


View Profile
April 03, 2013, 11:57:56 AM
 #8



If you know transhumanism is bullshit you should be able to draw your conclusions from there. IF not welcome to the south sea.

What is bullshit about transhumanism?
There is no way of stopping it, imo.


It pinnacles in a construction called Tiplers Omega Point. (Google it if you are interested) That's the realm of religious superstition.
That and hyperbolic development of any kind hasn't been observed to result in anything other than a disaster, historically. Plus technological progress is proven to be subject to exponential curves during the beginning and sigmoid curves overall.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
ElectricMucus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1568


Drama Junkie


View Profile
April 03, 2013, 11:59:09 AM
 #9

Oh hey it's Mucus with more bear stuff.

Should have posted this in your other thread that's already full of fail.

Since everybody is spamming anyway I think I can be excused this incident.  Smiley

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
BTC Books
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 84



View Profile
April 03, 2013, 12:36:59 PM
 #10



If you know transhumanism is bullshit you should be able to draw your conclusions from there. IF not welcome to the south sea.

What is bullshit about transhumanism?
There is no way of stopping it, imo.


It pinnacles in a construction called Tiplers Omega Point. (Google it if you are interested) That's the realm of religious superstition.
That and hyperbolic development of any kind hasn't been observed to result in anything other than a disaster, historically. Plus technological progress is proven to be subject to exponential curves during the beginning and sigmoid curves overall.

Tipler is interesting - The Physics of Immortality especially:  a book worth reading, and one I consider to be on an intellectual plane with Jaynes' Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind.

After that I'll grant you he fell pretty much all the way down your "religious superstition" rabbit hole.  Still, whatever one might believe, worth reading.

Dankedan: price seems low, time to sell I think...
mobodick
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 840



View Profile
April 03, 2013, 01:10:18 PM
 #11



If you know transhumanism is bullshit you should be able to draw your conclusions from there. IF not welcome to the south sea.

What is bullshit about transhumanism?
There is no way of stopping it, imo.


It pinnacles in a construction called Tiplers Omega Point. (Google it if you are interested) That's the realm of religious superstition.
That and hyperbolic development of any kind hasn't been observed to result in anything other than a disaster, historically. Plus technological progress is proven to be subject to exponential curves during the beginning and sigmoid curves overall.

None of that mumbo jumbo is required for transhumanism.
This Tripler person seriously thinks that entropy of the universe will in the end decrease to zero.
My guess is he hasn't kept up with physics for the past 50 or so years.

mobodick
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 840



View Profile
April 03, 2013, 01:11:19 PM
 #12



If you know transhumanism is bullshit you should be able to draw your conclusions from there. IF not welcome to the south sea.

What is bullshit about transhumanism?
There is no way of stopping it, imo.


It pinnacles in a construction called Tiplers Omega Point. (Google it if you are interested) That's the realm of religious superstition.
That and hyperbolic development of any kind hasn't been observed to result in anything other than a disaster, historically. Plus technological progress is proven to be subject to exponential curves during the beginning and sigmoid curves overall.

Tipler is interesting - The Physics of Immortality especially:  a book worth reading, and one I consider to be on an intellectual plane with Jaynes' Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind.

After that I'll grant you he fell pretty much all the way down your "religious superstition" rabbit hole.  Still, whatever one might believe, worth reading.

Tripler is an idiot that doesn't understand basic mechanisms like entropy and speed of light.
ElectricMucus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1568


Drama Junkie


View Profile
April 06, 2013, 06:27:46 PM
 #13

Tipler is just the most delusional transhumanist.  It is right that other concepts aren't that far fetched but they are still irrational.

This can be demonstrated on the graphic I posted in OP which basically comes from the book on transhumanism. It discards the limitation on resources, the Hubbard peak and the tendency for laws of accelerated change to topple out at some point. Kurzweil may not be as delusional as Tipler but he still is an Idiot on my book.
The next requirement, so called self-aware machines are an impossible transformation in a cybernetic sense. I am not saying that it is impossible to enable mechanical life but it would case to be machines at this point, since a machine is by definition a lifeless object. So that leaves us with the conclusion that machines inventing new machines isn't possible either.

Mind you the floor is high, we could reach a tremendous level of technological sophistication but it will not be subject to hyperbolic growth, at optimistically exponential, realistically sigmoid and pessimistically bell-shaped. (Yes we could actually die out too)

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
befuddled
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 74


View Profile
April 06, 2013, 10:23:39 PM
 #14

Well, I think the Kurzweillean singularity is a plausible scenario. He's a bit selective in some of his statistics, and has made some predictions that have been plainly wrong (e.g. the solar singularity which isn't progressing on his schedule). But the basic insight is sound I expect (Unless the peak-economiclally-recoverable-energy limit is hit like some people expect). I don't think he's an idiot.

But you don't need to believe any of that to anticipate BTC to be a commodity more valuable than it presently is.  Yes, we know the risks. There's a good chance it will be a zero eventually. But there's also a good chance it could ultimately be regarded as a co-equal asset class with gold. By which I mean it's market valuation could equal that of gold. All gold in the world is roughly $10T US. In order for bitcoin to have that same valuation, it would be $1M/bitcoin (using 10M BTC, or half that value at 20M BTC).
mobodick
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 840



View Profile
April 06, 2013, 11:08:03 PM
 #15

Tipler is just the most delusional transhumanist.  It is right that other concepts aren't that far fetched but they are still irrational.

This can be demonstrated on the graphic I posted in OP which basically comes from the book on transhumanism. It discards the limitation on resources, the Hubbard peak and the tendency for laws of accelerated change to topple out at some point. Kurzweil may not be as delusional as Tipler but he still is an Idiot on my book.
The next requirement, so called self-aware machines are an impossible transformation in a cybernetic sense. I am not saying that it is impossible to enable mechanical life but it would case to be machines at this point, since a machine is by definition a lifeless object. So that leaves us with the conclusion that machines inventing new machines isn't possible either.

Mind you the floor is high, we could reach a tremendous level of technological sophistication but it will not be subject to hyperbolic growth, at optimistically exponential, realistically sigmoid and pessimistically bell-shaped. (Yes we could actually die out too)

I don't think that self-aware machines require anything we call life in the biological sense.

And i think that our technological advancement is limited by the bandwidth of applied brain power.
There are only so many humans working on any particular problem while the amount of things to find out only increases.
I think that any shape of this growth will depend on how humanity will develop. I mean, in 50 years we could be colonizing the solar system, which gives us room to breed and produce more scientists.
On the other hand the increase in technological knowledge allows us to extend our own capabilities which is considerably speeding up the process.
But i think a real singularity is out of  the question. We will just have to deal with the occasional paradigm shift, if we can deal with it.
I think we are riding a linear surfboard on a log scale so to us it always looks as if the future is impossibly steep, untill we get there.

In the end i think that we can achieve synthetic conciousness. But i don't want to speculate about the properties of such a conciousness. It depends on a lot of factors and not all can be predicted if it's anything like an emergent phenomenon, which i think it may be.

I'm not sure why you think self aware machines are an impossible transformation per se. I find that a process like evolution takes any chance it can get. Whatever works, works.
Life itself is not much more than machines building more machines.
And if life can make a brain then you can make a brain with a machine.

ManBearPig
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 350


"Don't go in the trollbox, trollbox, trollbox"


View Profile WWW
April 08, 2013, 11:04:08 AM
 #16

But seriously, Kurzweil's singularity will simply never happen - there is ALWAYS a bottleneck somewhere inside or outside of the system.

I do like the idea of living your life at the speed of light though, essentially immortal until you log out.

Will money matter if we see the singularity?

I tweet crypto nonsense: https://twitter.com/DunningKruger_
ruski
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 196


View Profile
April 08, 2013, 11:10:44 AM
 #17

And this has something to do with speculation... because?

 Huh
NamelessOne
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 840



View Profile
April 08, 2013, 11:10:59 AM
 #18

But seriously, Kurzweil's singularity will simply never happen - there is ALWAYS a bottleneck somewhere inside or outside of the system.

I do like the idea of living your life at the speed of light though, essentially immortal until you log out.

Will money matter if we see the singularity?

Money won't mean the same thing. If we all became machines the only thing that would matter would really be raw matter and the ability to control it so we can use it for processing power. A post scarcity economy would probably be prevented because of this. But it essentially would be damn near post scarcity because if everyone are machines or at least enhanced, extreme education, communication, merged consciousness all come to the table and completely change the human experience.
wopwop
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 252



View Profile
April 08, 2013, 11:14:00 AM
 #19

are you saying I cant believe?
ElectricMucus
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1568


Drama Junkie


View Profile
April 08, 2013, 11:16:41 AM
 #20

But seriously, Kurzweil's singularity will simply never happen - there is ALWAYS a bottleneck somewhere inside or outside of the system.

I do like the idea of living your life at the speed of light though, essentially immortal until you log out.

Will money matter if we see the singularity?

Um, seriously, Unicorns riding bicycles will never happen
But what about cucumbers should there be unicorns?

And this has something to do with speculation... because?

 Huh

Look around there are actually people who call this bubble the "bitcoin sigularity" "financial singularity", etc...

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
Pages: [1] 2  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!