BREAKING-LEAK:Identities+emails of rich hiding cash offshore $32trillion's worth

[tvbcof]

What do these tax cheats have to do with Assange or Wikileaks? How exactly is it saving the world to expose the tax cheats? It helps the IRS and the police but it's not gonna save the world.

It has to do with transparency (the primary goal of Wikileaks) and the corrosive effects of money in politics which thrives in darkness.  To me.  I don't believe that a sustainable society will be able to support a high number of super-rich while providing the rest with a tolerable quality of life as the population increases and natural resources become harder to extract.  And the super-rich cause all kinds of mischief by subverting our democracy with money.  So our best hope is to amputate the gangrenous limb before it kills the entire body.  I'd like to see the entire 32T or whatever thrown into a fire pit and burnt...minus half a T or so going into Bitcoin

[rpietila]

What do these tax cheats have to do with Assange or Wikileaks? How exactly is it saving the world to expose the tax cheats? It helps the IRS and the police but it's not gonna save the world.

It has to do with transparency (the primary goal of Wikileaks) and the corrosive effects of money in politics which thrives in darkness.  To me.  I don't believe that a sustainable society will be able to support a high number of super-rich while providing the rest with a tolerable quality of life as the population increases and natural resources become harder to extract.  And the super-rich cause all kinds of mischief by subverting our democracy with money.  So our best hope is to amputate the gangrenous limb before it kills the entire body.  I'd like to see the entire 32T or whatever thrown into a fire pit and burnt...minus half a T or so going into Bitcoin

I kind of expect that this supposed "wealth" will be just erased in our lifetime. Just.. it never existed in real world anyway. It never was gold, or anything tangible. All positive entries in anyone's bank balances are negative in somebody else's. In the "liabilities" column it is called "bad debt". It is not repayable. Cyprus shows us that the balances can just vanish, without anyone even trying to extract payment from the debtors of the bank.

It is a great charade. Big boys can make you suffer, no matter if you are long or short fiat. They are the moneymasters. They may or may not control bitcoin, but everyone knows that they do control the dollar, euro, gold and to a great extent silver. If some of them hold some of the $32,000,000,000,000 out there, they know it is not wealth. "Whenever destroyers appear among men, they start by destroying money, for money is men's protection and the base of a moral existence. Destroyers seize gold and leave to its owners a counterfeit pile of paper. This kills all objective standards and delivers men into the arbitrary power of an arbitrary setter of values. Gold was an objective value, an equivalent of wealth produced. Paper is a mortgage on wealth that does not exist, backed by a gun aimed at those who are expected to produce it. Paper is a check drawn by legal looters upon an account which is not theirs -- upon the virtue of the victims. Watch for the day when it bounces, marked: "Account overdrawn"." (- Rand) The rest of the $32T is held by public, no less gullible than the ones who take mortgages to buy overvalued houses and expect to get away without punishment.

The ones who have the gold, make the rules. Or silver. Or bitcoin. Buy these. Forget about hoarding fiat balances, and don't play with debt.

Ugh.

[Hyena]

If fractional reserve banking is possible even with bitcoin then the root of evil won't get eliminated by this new currency, am I right?

[tvbcof]

If fractional reserve banking is possible even with bitcoin then the root of evil won't get eliminated by this new currency, am I right?

I don't see a particularly big problem with fractional reserve banking.  Works fine as long as it's well managed.  If I had a mind to loan my money to a bank I'm sure I'd choose one which did fractional reserve because they will be much more competitive then those who are not.

But I'd want a functional legal system to ensure that I had good visibility and such.  We don't have that these days (for my non-wealthy class of citizens) and that is one of the reasons why I don't loan my money to banks or anyone else.  That is, no mutual funds, stocks, bonds, IRA, pension, paper-gold, etc.  Basically no instruments which have counter-party risk.  I've made that a habit since the early 2000's...and never regretted it!

[Hyena]

But if fractional reserve banking creates "bitcoins" that do not exist then how can you pay back your dept? Sooner or later some people won't be able to pay back the dept so that these virtually created bitcoins would have to be deleted from the system. But what if these virtual coins were already lent out in turn? Then we would need to know which exact virtual bitcoins to destroy if the original borrower defaulted?

This is really a problem in my opinion.

[mobodick]

What do these tax cheats have to do with Assange or Wikileaks? How exactly is it saving the world to expose the tax cheats? It helps the IRS and the police but it's not gonna save the world.

It has to do with transparency (the primary goal of Wikileaks) and the corrosive effects of money in politics which thrives in darkness.  To me.  I don't believe that a sustainable society will be able to support a high number of super-rich while providing the rest with a tolerable quality of life as the population increases and natural resources become harder to extract.  And the super-rich cause all kinds of mischief by subverting our democracy with money.  So our best hope is to amputate the gangrenous limb before it kills the entire body.  I'd like to see the entire 32T or whatever thrown into a fire pit and burnt...minus half a T or so going into Bitcoin

I kind of expect that this supposed "wealth" will be just erased in our lifetime. Just.. it never existed in real world anyway. It never was gold, or anything tangible. All positive entries in anyone's bank balances are negative in somebody else's. In the "liabilities" column it is called "bad debt". It is not repayable. Cyprus shows us that the balances can just vanish, without anyone even trying to extract payment from the debtors of the bank.

It is a great charade. Big boys can make you suffer, no matter if you are long or short fiat. They are the moneymasters. They may or may not control bitcoin, but everyone knows that they do control the dollar, euro, gold and to a great extent silver. If some of them hold some of the $32,000,000,000,000 out there, they know it is not wealth. "Whenever destroyers appear among men, they start by destroying money, for money is men's protection and the base of a moral existence. Destroyers seize gold and leave to its owners a counterfeit pile of paper. This kills all objective standards and delivers men into the arbitrary power of an arbitrary setter of values. Gold was an objective value, an equivalent of wealth produced. Paper is a mortgage on wealth that does not exist, backed by a gun aimed at those who are expected to produce it. Paper is a check drawn by legal looters upon an account which is not theirs -- upon the virtue of the victims. Watch for the day when it bounces, marked: "Account overdrawn"." (- Rand) The rest of the $32T is held by public, no less gullible than the ones who take mortgages to buy overvalued houses and expect to get away without punishment.

The ones who have the gold, make the rules. Or silver. Or bitcoin. Buy these. Forget about hoarding fiat balances, and don't play with debt.

Ugh.

Ayn Rand must have fallen pretty hard on her head as a child because she just doesn't see the whole picture altho she keeps claiming she does.
She keeps her eyes consistently shut for the fact that it was the people in her government that created an overarching structure of stability that allowed trade to fourish on scales never before possible.
It's like a child telling their parents that she hates them and whished she never was born at all.
Gold was an objectve value? LOL.

Also, she sounds realy butthurt.

[mobodick]

If fractional reserve banking is possible even with bitcoin then the root of evil won't get eliminated by this new currency, am I right?

I don't see a particularly big problem with fractional reserve banking.  Works fine as long as it's well managed.  If I had a mind to loan my money to a bank I'm sure I'd choose one which did fractional reserve because they will be much more competitive then those who are not.

But I'd want a functional legal system to ensure that I had good visibility and such.  We don't have that these days (for my non-wealthy class of citizens) and that is one of the reasons why I don't loan my money to banks or anyone else.  That is, no mutual funds, stocks, bonds, IRA, pension, paper-gold, etc.  Basically no instruments which have counter-party risk.  I've made that a habit since the early 2000's...and never regretted it!

I think you're right about the legals system. It is being abused and stretched to its limits.

[Jobe7]

Right, 32 trillion (like, ouch), 'hidden' and such, now revealed.

How much do you imagine the Rothschilds and their ilk have hidden away

But ye, fuqya, the bastichs printing/creating massive inflation, then hiding the money all away. Reasons like THIS is why the planet is fubard atm.

[Jobe7]

1. Bank gives tons of money to criminals/fraudsters/drug cartels/corrupt politicians/corrupt officials/etc
2. These people with the money hide the majority of it away
3. Banks say to their respective governments (or the IMF/Rothschilds Bank) "Ohh, we need more cash, time to print more!"
4. Governments (being in their pockets) happily agree whilst saying "remember to give me some of that newly printed cash, nice and quiet like, you can use my British Virgin Island account, nudge/wink."
5. Banks print lots of money, more inflation.
6. Governments also raise taxes and give this money to the banks (and lets be honest, some to themselves).
7. Go to point 1.

[dyseac]

exposing for the first time the identities of thousands of holders of anonymous wealth from around the world

Soo.. if its anonymous... how exactly do we substantiate it ?

I get at least 1 email a week from some Nigerian / Swedish banker telling me a close relative has left me $1Mil and all I need to do is send them some details.
If I added up all of these emails over the pas 10 years, there is suddenly $100Mil of wealth anonymously hidden.. somewhere?? 

[Jobe7]

Question;

What happens if the extremely rich people who have now been identified decide to do a bank run of their own cash to buy gold/silver/bitcoins. Will the IMF/etc limit their withdrawal like they did with the Cypriots?

And if they tried.. what would happen?

[tvbcof]

Question;

What happens if the extremely rich people who have now been identified decide to do a bank run of their own cash to buy gold/silver/bitcoins. Will the IMF/etc limit their withdrawal like they did with the Cypriots?

And if they tried.. what would happen?

They'd clog up the exits just like us plebs at the ATM.  It would/will be one big dick measuring contest to find out who _really_ has wealth...and where the losers join the rest of us down here.

[eric345]

Here's how they do it.

The Tax Free Tour
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4o13isDdfY&feature=youtu.be

[zedicus]

Its not how they do it that is the issue! Its that people and companys with huge footprints in our respective society are in kahoots and they have passed on generation to generation that this is what we do kids!! <---- its ok because we are the elite and !everyone else is our *****!

Thats not youre bank account, thats not your land, thats not youre pension...its ours!!!  

Thats what they are thinking! At all times!


all your base..

[Qoheleth]

But if fractional reserve banking creates "bitcoins" that do not exist then how can you pay back your dept? Sooner or later some people won't be able to pay back the dept so that these virtually created bitcoins would have to be deleted from the system. But what if these virtual coins were already lent out in turn? Then we would need to know which exact virtual bitcoins to destroy if the original borrower defaulted?

This is really a problem in my opinion.

I'm not sure what you mean here. There's no such thing as a "virtual" bitcoin; if you deposit your BTC in a bank, it is your BTC that is then lent. Of course, on the bank's ledger is the amount they owe you, and assuming no bank runs and sane risk management, you can be reasonably sure they'll have enough hard BTC on hand (maybe not the same input you sent them, but any BTC of the right amound) to let you make your everyday withdrawls.

Of course, if they're irresponsible they'll squander your deposit and default. But that's the case of any irresponsible bank, in any unmanufactuable currency.

[batcoin]

Here's how they do it.

The Tax Free Tour
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4o13isDdfY&feature=youtu.be

TL;DR version: If you are smart enough to find a tax loophole, you are an asshole and the scum of the earth for utilizing it. You should really pay the highest possible tax rate even if not legally required to do so, and the idea that anyone would ever think otherwise is absolutely unimaginable.