Is Bitcoin the Trojan horse to help push the move to a world government?

[iamnotback]

It will be considered a basic human right that Internet money and access be without borders/barriers. The globalists want this. I believe the elite created Bitcoin as a Trojan horse against nation-state and banking interests selfishness. They are using us to force a wedge between nation-states and banks, and the global village reality of the Internet

I don't really get this theory (conspiracy theory that is) about how Bitcoin is a trojan horse by the so called elite. Why would the elite deploy a software that is open source, and allows people to hide money from the government or anyone else but you and the other party?

Because the nation-states and banks are powerless to stop the lurch to crypto-currency and the global ledger. They simply don't have globalized jurisdiction. This creates a demand for a world government system, so that regulations can be placed on all countries at once. In this way, crypto-currency can be regulated later after the world government takes form. Until then, the nation-states will find themselves powerless to stop crypto-currency unless they shut off the Internet, which they can't do. Even China will succumb (the people already know how to use VPNs to subvert the Great Firewall of China).

I mean people that work for bitcoin, if they never cash out and buy with bitcoin... the circle is closed, government can't never tax any of that,

This is why the nation-states will need to support the creation of a world government. Bitcoin is the Trojan horse that forces them to.

... they will never know how much bitcoin a person that got bitcoin within bitcoin ecosystem be it by mining or by working in exchange of bitcoin has... so what's the point?

Well Bitcoin is traceable if you have the resources of the NSA, but other countries don't have those resources. And more anonymous coins are underway, so yes ultimately governments can't track it if they can't regulate it globally to force a government viewkey to be attached to every transaction. Again crypto-currency breaks the authority of nation-states and renders banks irrelevant. It thus drives the need for a world government and a world bank.

If I was the elite, I would be hating bitcoin and having nightmares about it. I don't see how the elites benefit from bitcoin.

Grasshopper you don't think in sophisticated logic, and that is one reason why you could not ever be a member of the global elite.

Bitcoin is working perfectly as they designed it to do.

Ask yourself this. Does Bitcoin eliminate the need for people to borrow money and will Bitcoin prevent fractional reserve lending? The answer to both is no. And so the business of the global elite is still intact, while they destroy all their competitors with the Bitcoin Trojan horse.

I think bitcoin was simply the work of crypto anarchists/hackers. They saw that the future is digital, and that governments will deploy closed source currencies where they have total control. They saw this coming, and released bitcoin as a way to fight against that. Therefore I don't buy the conspiracy theory of bitcoin being a trojan horse, since I fail to see how the elite benefits in any way from it.

That is of course what they knew you would think. Masterful their plan. They know very well, you could not possible conceive of them making Bitcoin and instead you want to believe that Satoshi Nakamoto is a real person. Lol. Larry Summers has a bellyache from laughing too much.

[Holliday]

So, any tool that provides freedom to the individual instead of control for the state, is a Trojan horse that the state can use to justify increased control?

Does that mean the war is lost and we should simply give up?

[Shiroslullaby]

If anything Zcash is the Trojan horse.
I won't feel sorry for any darknet vendors who accept this coin as payment, when the police show up at their door, and were able to somehow find their identity,,,

[MarketMagic]

I think only when bitcoin is perfected and ALL anomalies bugs etc are dealt with conclusively will it then be regulated.All FREE things start like wild west with many bad seeds/weeds thrown in among the good/bad and the ugly like melting pot of chaotic innovation giving off impression of open and free however once regulation and other tyranny settle in step by step like boiling frog it will not be noticed but "maverick brand" and whatever cool buzzword still remain like designed form of freedom that is in reality opposite but this could be conspiracy theory off course and maybe be too paranoid but remember just because they are paranoid it does not mean the MAN is not watching you but does anyone really care when we are all sheople?

[freshman777]

And this guy calls other people tinfoil hats, LOL

You tinfoil hats are so funny.

[cjmoles]

First, what is a "one world government," and second, are we assuming a "one world government" is a bad thing?  The fact of the matter is that we are on "one world" and we all have a specific responsibility to protect the one world we are on.  One nation, one religion, one ideology.....etc....shouldn't have the power to make all the decisions regarding how the world's resources are shared and distributed.  Bitcoin removes the necessity of requiring third parties to keep track of personal transactions, which reduces the control of centralized governing authorities.  A decentralized process of distributing wealth (goods, services, usury, torts...etc) also distributes responsibility in a more homogeneous manner which has the ability to negate centralized corruption. So, how might the elite benefit by creating a technology that allows the people to make their own decisions regarding the distribution of wealth?

[MarketMagic]

First, what is a "one world government," and second, are we assuming a "one world government" is a bad thing?  The fact of the matter is that we are on "one world" and we all have a specific responsibility to protect the one world we are on.  One nation, one religion, one ideology.....etc....shouldn't have the power to make all the decisions regarding how the world's resources are shared and distributed.  Bitcoin removes the necessity of requiring third parties to keep track of personal transactions, which reduces the control of centralized governing authorities.  A decentralized process of distributing wealth (goods, services, usury, torts...etc) also distributes responsibility in a more homogeneous manner which has the ability to negate centralized corruption. So, how might the elite benefit by creating a technology that allows the people to make their own decisions regarding the distribution of wealth?

This excellent retort and many good points made.Of course there are also many possibilities for anyone to take majority share of a decentralised structure either by buyout or monopoly production process and henceforth distribution affects decentralisation?

There are also other factors to consider such as the moving beyond the actual amount currency in control of hierarchial structures as being relevant when such structures already control and regulate all within full global economic and finally political ecosystem where the monetary aspect is concentrated on control of ledger/transaction processes as the regulatory and controlling authority while political aspect is security and resource distribution process allocation.

True control is not how wealthy one is.It is having legislative control and ability to know all things.Monetary wealth however a great advantage in the stepping stone process to access such priveledges through education/connections/collaborations etc etc less emphasis on collaborations as world moves towards knowledge based data economics where artifical intelligence is key player through neural based infrastructures and machine learning function abilities.

The real power players are already embedded but us minions must earn our place in the new order.Unless we all move to desert wilderness and live on the locusts and wild berries/honey this is the future.

[iamnotback]

Bitcoin removes the necessity of requiring third parties to keep track of personal transactions

Incorrect if you mean to imply that Bitcoin is not centralized:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1690725.msg16991114#msg16991114

The distinction is that the centralized entities are global. The nation-states can't regulate the miners. But the miners are centralized and will become ever more so. It is a winner-take-all economic paradigm. Why wouldn't the global elite love that?

Decentralized is not the same as distributed!

[iamnotback]

So, any tool that provides freedom to the individual instead of control for the state, is a Trojan horse that the state can use to justify increased control?

Does that mean the war is lost and we should simply give up?

As we ratchet up the entropy levels, we attain greater degrees-of-freedom in society:

So perhaps I beg to differ with your assertion that there are no solutions. Even CoinCube had written that we are moving to higher and higher entropy levels because of technology:

https://gist.github.com/shelby3/67111f328822a36beb4cad1a5220eb33
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=355212.msg16982844#msg16982844

Copy of private msg sent to CoinCube:

I read this:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=355212.msg16982844#msg16982844

Excellent. Seems congruent with what I wrote and shared with you yesterday.

Not able to defect should ultimately equal not needing to defect. Degrees-of-freedom should be unbounded and Coasian costs drop to zero. But as you say we will never get there, just ratchet up to higher and higher levels of entropy.

Please feel free to write this connection publicly for me if you are so inclined. I can't do it now. Feel free to cite the portion of the white paper I shared with you as that is a public url.

[mrnswtcy]

ok Im learning a lot more. Bitcoiners are also very paranoid.

[btvGainer]

If anything Zcash is the Trojan horse.
I won't feel sorry for any darknet vendors who accept this coin as payment, when the police show up at their door, and were able to somehow find their identity,,,

Why even give Zcash a bad name.Any currency is not bad but the use we put it to is either bad or good.You can make donations with bitcoin or zcash or buy marijuana.It is entirely upto you

[shield132]

At first bitcoin is currency which has highest privacy protect nowdays.
Secondly, when you say that banks are powerless to stop lurch to cryptocurrency, you lie from this first proposal. Ask me in this question, who offers you bitcoin to usd exchange? Banks of course, who are mining companies? People who wants to take control on it and than manipulate price.
Also bitcoin is mostly used for money laundering and it's also good for both side ( for bankers and govermant ).

[Snorek]

Again, the mystery of bitcoin's beginning and unknown identity of Satoshi Nakamoto is here to haunt us.
Do you think this discussion presenting bitcoin as something created by some government agency would take place if we knew who Satoshi is?

[iamnotback]

Secondly, when you say that banks are powerless to stop lurch to cryptocurrency, you lie from this first proposal. Ask me in this question, who offers you bitcoin to usd exchange? Banks of course, who are mining companies? People who wants to take control on it and than manipulate price.

You didn't state anything that refuted the premise, "banks are powerless to stop lurch to cryptocurrency".

I didn't say that some banks wouldn't find some profit in Bitcoin. Nevertheless, as cryptocurrency becomes the currency of virtual commerce (and the lurch to the Knowledge Age which will overtake everything), the national fiats the banks control, will become an ever smaller portion of the economic pie.

Also onboarding without going through fiat is now coming into reality.

Also bitcoin is mostly used for money laundering and it's also good for both side ( for bankers and govermant ).

For the individuals in banking and government, but not for the nation-state jurisdiction scoped institutions.

I have an essay which I wrote for you to read about genius:

http://unheresy.com/Essence%20of%20Genius.html

Genius is able to distill the essence from the irrelevant.

[Capradina]

Again, the mystery of bitcoin's beginning and unknown identity of Satoshi Nakamoto is here to haunt us.
Do you think this discussion presenting bitcoin as something created by some government agency would take place if we knew who Satoshi is?

I don't know for sure what will happen in the future about the growth of the bitcoin. However there are a few things you might want to do in this discussion, because without discussion then something will happen is a misunderstanding. so I better see all of what they say and looking for something that is right. Although satoshi never comes then I will believe the bitcoin will remain visible for

[MingLee]

Bitcoin is far from being some trojan horse; if it was there would either be less push-back against it or more subtle acceptation of it globally, and we're not seeing that. Governments treat it like a threat, and the population is equally wary of it. Something being a trojan horse would be more accepted rather than rejected.

Also, for those suggesting a world government is a good thing; not on the banker's terms, and not before the rest of the world catches up to "first-world" status. The labor imbalances and new labor markets opening up for super cheap, along with societies further back in technology, are a net negative. Plus national culture is lost, among other things. Not a benefit.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Eh, could be, but I highly doubt it.  With Satoshi's identity being unknown, it is pretty interesting to speculate about how and why bitcoin was conceived.  And of course, who aside from "Satoshi" was behind it.  Could be a malignant government presence, could be just a computer geek.

If this is some evil government trojan horse, it's not taking like they thought it would, is it?

[iamnotback]

Bitcoin is far from being some trojan horse; if it was there would either be less push-back against it or more subtle acceptation of it globally, and we're not seeing that.

Dude, you didn't understand the OP.

The entire point is that it is a Trojan horse against (nation-state) governments. Of course they are fighting it, and that is consistent with it being a Trojan horse against them.

Governments treat it like a threat, and the population is equally wary of it. Something being a trojan horse would be more accepted rather than rejected.

The population is going to accept it with open arms, once someone solves the onboarding and security problems. Both of which I've conceptually solved. Implementation follows.

Also, for those suggesting a world government is a good thing; not on the banker's terms, and not before the rest of the world catches up to "first-world" status. The labor imbalances and new labor markets opening up for super cheap, along with societies further back in technology, are a net negative. Plus national culture is lost, among other things. Not a benefit.

Malthusians are always correct.  

(they never are, never)

They always see a larger pie as impossible.

[Milkduds]

I hate being this way but I need to go grab my tinfoil hat for this discussion...


The things that got me concern are flying right a long at the same time as bitcoin and fall into the grasp for global domination but a elite group.
We have governments being over turned and trade deals going sour with a protectionist lean becoming the apparent new in thing.
The trick is making people believe that the changes they want are their own and not some concept dreamed up to strip the average citizen down into a drone.

These things happen over generations and look at the current deal with cell phones,everyone has one and they rely on them day to day like zombies.
You take away the internet and people would not know how to adjust and would need some one to guide them along,its a very easy path to see if you take your head out from where ever you have it tucked. It may not happen but it is quite easy to see happening.

Hell I am still scratching my head over gender categories for some new dating site,37 different sexes!!! I mean I can count 6 maybe by listing off the LGBTQ and adding hetro to the end.

So if you look at bitcoin...(Like I proved anything,more of a psychotic rant) you can see all the little aspects that have been shut down like negative interest rates and how a government sponsered coin could achieve these goals. Problems with the peons,strip their coins away in one sweep and have them beg for it back. Give it back but take away a little human right as you go.
If you find this hard to swallow think about the rights that went bye bye after 9/11.

As much as I like bitcoin I can see the perversion of it coming in quickly.

[cjmoles]

Bitcoin removes the necessity of requiring third parties to keep track of personal transactions

Incorrect if you mean to imply that Bitcoin is not centralized:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1690725.msg16991114#msg16991114

The distinction is that the centralized entities are global. The nation-states can't regulate the miners. But the miners are centralized and will become ever more so. It is a winner-take-all economic paradigm. Why wouldn't the global elite love that?

Decentralized is not the same as distributed!

When I say that it is decentralized....I mean that no single entity has control over the contents of the ledger.  It is too cost prohibitive to roll back the entire ledger in order to change it's contents every time a change is required to be manifested....While there might be issues with a concentration of hashing power which has the effect of  disenfranchising smaller operations....that aspect of the technology is self mitigating in the long run.  But, my question is: how will the global elite (whoever they are) take advantage of being able to regulate the miners?  If we have the individual freedom to engage in transactions without the burden of having to trust a third party to manipulate the tally sheet, then how would that be oppressive to us?  If we view bitcoin as a means to exchange goods and services, as opposed to a means to "create wealth" out of thin air, then it's future is not so divisive.  

Right now when we put our money into the bank, the banks are taking that money and giving it to somebody else to turn a profit by manipulating their centralized ledgers to reflect that there is more money then there actually is in circulation....That form of currency is not backed by actual goods and services; in fact, it dilutes the value of our accumulated store of goods and services at an exponential rate....I just don't see how that devaluation could be coerced while we maintain an immutable ledger.