Purpose of this forum : creating knowledge resources or spreading bitcoins ?

[Have_good_times]

Why Satoshi has created this forum ?

I agree with spam contents we cannot spread awareness of bitcoins to new people.
But we cannot expect non-native English speakers to participate into higher end discussions.

Just imagine a non-English 20 year old boy joins here and enter the general discussion board, if he finds a topic bitcoin is money or investment, he will try to say something but if he sees ONLY discussions like high technical subjects for example about segwit, he will probably close the tab and will open facebook.

In long run we may lose a possible bitcoin adopter.

If bitcoin is only for native English speaker then we can have higher standards for topics and posts.
(still I doubt they will be ready to talk for tech topics)

Obvious spammers/ copy pasters must deserve their ban. No second opinion on this.

I view this forum is doing similar role of block rewards. Those who got possibilities run mining farm and earn rewards. Those who got interest to write about cryptocurrency, join here and earn bitcoins. But we need to note here that both are just bitcoin adopters without adopters there will be no life for bitcoin system.

But recent changes seems a heavy deviation from motto of this forum.

[ranochigo]

The community doesn't condone spamming and thus the birth of SMAS where some campaign managers adopts. The moderators are fairly quick to ban users who contributes nonsense to the discussion. Topics that encourage spamming are usually moved from Bitcoin discussion to offtopic and most campaigns do not pay there.

It is probably impossible to stop the spam but it is definitely getting better.

[ndnh]

To grow, sustain a community, have a medium for discussions, Q&A.

But we cannot expect non-native English speakers to participate into higher end discussions.

Just imagine a non-English 20 year old boy joins here and enter the general discussion board, if he finds a topic bitcoin is money or investment, he will try to say something but if he sees ONLY discussions like high technical subjects for example about segwit, he will probably close the tab and will open facebook page.

In long run we may loose a possible bitcoin adopter.

If bitcoin is only for native English speaker then we can have higher standards for topics and posts.
(still I doubt they will be ready to talk for tech topics)

Obvious spammers/ copy pasters must deserve their ban. No second opinion on this.

That is why we have Local boards!

[xhomerx10]

It's not fucking loose! IT's lose!! We might fucking lose a possible Bitcoin adopter!!
My OCD is kicking in.

[margon3]

It's not fucking loose! IT's lose!! We might fucking lose a possible Bitcoin adopter!!
My OCD is kicking in.

If he spelled a word wrong you used words like fuck ! now see yourself !

Cunt you make millions of mistakes yourself who the fucking moron are you to correct him ?


**

Actually he is right guys, now a days this forum looks like is just made for signatures and someone who is not educated well enough are not allowed to join this forum. Now you see if you just want high quality and educated people then how would bitcoins spread ? I think people like lutpin and others are doing a good job to overcome scam but their services like SMAS and others are totally brutal and biased.
Frankly guys if the forum continues like this then a day will come when only lutpin and a few others will be here and earning all the potential money with their alts.

Don't tell me lutpin does not have alts, quickseller was lutpin part 1 until he was busted.

So if we catch them fine, but until then they keep earning themselves via alts while denying some innocent people.

I think its totally wrong and just because he is in DT don't support him, remember he is in DT because we support him.

I have nothing personally with him or her but all such people who want to earn with signature camps alone with their alts while denying others by services like SMAS.

[Have_good_times]

It is probably impossible to stop the spam but it is definitely getting better.

Spam is different and low quality topic/post is different.

Moving a topic after 100 pages of discussion into off-topic is completely strange. Suddenly a good discussion becomes off-topic. Moderate posters become spammers.

That is why we have Local boards!

You cannot understand the pain of non-English speakers. I came to know my local board after years.

It's not fucking loose! IT's lose!! We might fucking lose a possible Bitcoin adopter!!
My OCD is kicking in.

Corrected. One good example how non-English people SPAM HERE. Still you understood what I tried to say there. 

[Lauda]

But we cannot expect non-native English speakers to participate into higher end discussions.

Simple: 1) Either you can contribute, thus you participate. OR 2) You can't contribute, thus remain in read-only mode. There's no need to justify shit-posting.

But we need to note here that both are just bitcoin adopters without adopters there will be no life for bitcoin system.

This forum does not even represent 10% of the Bitcoin user base.

I think people like lutpin and others are doing a good job to overcome scam but their services like SMAS and others are totally brutal and biased.

So that is what this is about? Do you have some alts blacklisted? Notify me when a verifiable person, with genuine concern regarding post quality complains about some initiatives like SMAS or recent signature campaign guidelines.

Don't tell me lutpin does not have alts, quickseller was lutpin part 1 until he was busted.

Until you have any kind of proof whatsoever, these are baseless accusations due to cognitive bias.

[Lutpin]

Don't tell me lutpin does not have alts, quickseller was lutpin part 1 until he was busted.

That's good. I almost spilled my morning coffee.

I think people like lutpin and others are doing a good job to overcome scam but their services like SMAS and others are totally brutal and biased.

First off, SMAS is not a service, we're not "selling" SMAS, we're not actively offering SMAS to others (although they are free to adapt to our lists).
SMAS is an initiative, and in no way brutal. Cutting off your earning options when you are shit-posting is what you should expect.
SMAS doesn't prohibit you from posting/participating/being a part of the bitcoin community, it only removes your financial incentive to spam, as you have shown previously you can't handle it.

Frankly guys if the forum continues like this then a day will come when only lutpin and a few others will be here and earning all the potential money with their alts.

Neither I, nor my alt account, are currently enrolled in any signature campaign. my alt never was, and I only recently joined ACE (when I was a hero member), before I wasn't ever paid for my signature either.
Stop the baseless accusations, if you got no leg to stand on.

So if we catch them fine, but until then they keep earning themselves via alts while denying some innocent people.

Blablabla, conspiracy, blablabla, calumny, blablabla.

I think its totally wrong and just because he is in DT don't support him, remember he is in DT because we support him.

Nope. I'm in DT because of Blazed (and partly due to Shorena), and only because of that. Your support has nothing to do with that.

I have nothing personally with him or her but all such people who want to earn with signature camps alone with their alts while denying others by services like SMAS.

You have nothing against me, but you're prune to calumny, gossip and making assumptions that reflect badly on me without having one iota of proof for it.
Sounds reasonable.

[Have_good_times]

Simple: 1) Either you can contribute, thus you participate. OR 2) You can't contribute, thus remain in read-only mode. There's no need to justify shit-posting.

Is there any history of non-bitcoiner turned a full node running volunteer ? Your read-only mode suggestion may kill the adoption rate of bitcoin. If you disagree, that may mean this forum is not contributing in convincing new people to adopt bitcoins.

There's no need to justify shit-posting.

What is your standard for shit-posting.
For example, I do see when a newbie asks what wallet he starts using. You simply lock that thread and move to thrash. But I prefer giving him exact answers so that he will be encouraged. I believe, for that encouragement only we are here.

See, government knows alcohol is injurious to health still they permits factories for that. Low quality posts are just part of this forum. Because worldwide people are not speaking one single language and you can not expect new people talks about higher end topics always.

If you do not agree this, you can make entire "Beginners&Help" section read-only  . Almost every doubts were covered. Just a search function will be more than enough there 

This forum does not even represent 10% of the Bitcoin user base.

From where you got the exact user-base of bitcoin ecosystem ?
Even a newbie of this forum has more than 10 bitcoin addresses (obviously with some satohis from faucets) in their blockchain.info wallet.

[Lauda]

From where you got the exact user-base of bitcoin ecosystem ?
Even a newbie of this forum has more than 10 bitcoin addresses (obviously with some satohis from faucets) in their blockchain.info wallet.

You can't calculate the exact user-base due to the nature of the system, but you can use estimates in combination with the member database here to draw to some conclusions. Depending on what sources you prefer, let's start:
Coinbase: >5 000 000 Users.
Blockchain.info: > 10 000 000 Wallets.
Zebpay: > 200 000 Users.
There are many more though.
Let's take a look at the forum. Total number of users: 912 341. Total number of users with 0 posts = ~670 000. Now add people that are permanently banned, known scammers and whatnot to this number and subtract from the original total. This likely leaves us with < 200k active members. This is less than what Zebpay (India) claims to have alone.

New members are being trolled / harassed by default trust maniacs and signature spammers.

Please provide me with exact cases of said harassment. If you can't, then don't flood the thread with nonsense.

[hilariousandco]

Why Satoshi has created this forum ?

To talk about bitcoin, hence the name bitcointalk.

But we cannot expect non-native English speakers to participate into higher end discussions.

Why not? Many non-English speakers participate in substantial discussions.

Just imagine a non-English 20 year old boy joins here and enter the general discussion board, if he finds a topic bitcoin is money or investment, he will try to say something but if he sees ONLY discussions like high technical subjects for example about segwit, he will probably close the tab and will open facebook page.

Well maybe he is better wasting his time on Facebook then. This forum doesn't exist just so non-English speaking members can easily earn money by saying "yes bitcoin is money" rather than actually having to put any thought or meaning into their posts.

In long run we may lose a possible bitcoin adopter.

No, we wont. We'll lose a forum poster. One that wont be missed. This forum is not the entire bitcoin ecosystem; it's a tiny part of it.

If bitcoin is only for native English speaker then we can have higher standards for topics and posts.
(still I doubt they will be ready to talk for tech topics)

Bitcoin isn't just for native English speakers, but this forum is an English-only speaking one (with the exception of the local boards (which is where you should stick to if you have trouble with English)).

But recent changes seems a heavy deviation from motto of this forum.

Translation: My alt(s?) was kicked off a campaign and I'm upset about it? How many more threads are we going to get by butthurt sig spammers who are annoyed that they can't easily earn money any more by posting unsubstantial rubbish? It's letting people get away with having ten alt accounts posting the same illiterate nonsense account after account that has lead to the decline in quality of the forum in the first place. It shouldn't and can't continue and that's why certain people are trying to do something about it. The only other option is to ban campaigns entirely from the forum, but if they were you would be screwed anyway, but why should those people who don't spam be punished because of the others?

[Have_good_times]

To talk about bitcoin, hence the name bitcointalk.

Just to time pass ? To talk for what ?

No, we wont. We'll lose a forum poster. One that wont be missed. This forum is not the entire bitcoin ecosystem; it's a tiny part of it.

Yes bitcoin may not. But this forum may lose.
The rise of other forums and their success may get triggered with your aggressiveness.

The only other option is to ban campaigns entirely from the forum

This must be a right solution and permanent too if I agree with you. But I wonder after that whom you are going to moderate ?

One simple example : Nokia was too successful just 5 to 8 years back. Due to their ignorance to listen to the demand of changes, they faced their fate.

[Lauda]

But I wonder after that whom you are going to moderate ?

There is plenty of things to do than moderate obvious sig. spammers.

One simple example : Nokia was too successful just 5 to 8 years back. Due to their ignorance to listen to the demand of changes, they faced their fate.

False analogy fallacy.

[KenR]

Just to time pass ? To talk for what ?

Depends how you take it.No one posts 100 line long comments for passing time if not for actually contributing to the forum.

Yes bitcoin may not. But this forum may lose.
The rise of other forums and their success may get triggered with your aggressiveness.

Name one forum which has even 10% of the bitcoin related traffic compared to bitcointalk ?

[Have_good_times]

One simple example : Nokia was too successful just 5 to 8 years back. Due to their ignorance to listen to the demand of changes, they faced their fate.

False analogy fallacy.

Seems you didn't get.

Name one forum which has even 10% of the bitcoin related traffic compared to bitcointalk ?

Yet to born. You argue not at all possible ?

[hilariousandco]

To talk about bitcoin, hence the name bitcointalk.

Just to time pass ? To talk for what ?

Why does anyone post on a forum? Usually because they're interested in the subject matter. Why did you join up to bitcointalk? To get paid to post? I think that's the problem here. People that can't really speak English very well sign up in droves solely because they heard you can easily get paid to post. They often have zero interest in bitcoin other than being able to make some easy money out of it and this leads them to being greedy and making poor, barely intelligible posts as quickly as they can on multiple accounts. This can't be acceptable to do.

No, we wont. We'll lose a forum poster. One that wont be missed. This forum is not the entire bitcoin ecosystem; it's a tiny part of it.

Yes bitcoin may not. But this forum may lose.
The rise of other forums and their success may get triggered with your aggressiveness.

They won't, but this isn't something I would be worried about nor do I doubt theymos is. On the other hand, maybe other forums will rise up and grow if staff do nothing about signature campaigns and we continue to let people from developing nations get away with writing the most basic of crap everywhere as they get tired and leave for somewhere that doesn't allow them. I'd say the forum is only going to be bettered due to any 'aggressiveness' we may have in punishing spammers or preventing them from spamming in the first place.

The only other option is to ban campaigns entirely from the forum

This must be a right solution and permanent too if I agree with you. But I wonder after that whom you are going to moderate ?

One simple example : Nokia was too successful just 5 to 8 years back. Due to their ignorance to listen to the demand of changes, they faced their fate.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Can you just tell us what you really want? We should just ban signature campaigns or let people who can barely speak English do whatever they want? Or is this a If I can't earn then nobody else should be able to thing?

[KenR]

Yet to born. You argue not at all possible ?

It is possible,I never denied that.Imagine,took months for bitcointalk to reach where it is.It didn't get traffic of over million users on the first month of it's launch.Only after the content posted and active contribution by the community members it grew.Do you think a random dude launching a new forum would have the potential to take over bitcoin talk just because the mods here are intolerent towards signature spammers ?

[Have_good_times]

Can you just tell us what you really want?

I am not the right person to suggest any changes here.
But I just started this topic just to ensure whether we are traveling in a right path as per founder's wish. Please listen to consensus (especially for treating non-English speakers and non-technical people accordingly)

[Lutpin]

Please listen to consensus (especially for treating non-English speakers and non-technical people accordingly)

That would mean just because there are more shitposters and sig-spammers than users who want to fight that problem, we would not be allowed to do anything about it.

But I just started this topic just to ensure whether we are traveling in a right path as per founder's wish.

theymos as head admin is on the helm of this, and while there are a few things one could criticize about their actions, this recent (and upcoming) initiative against (signature) spam is none of it.
Bitcointalk wasn't created so that people who don't give a single fuck about bitcoin itself can make their income from posting bullshit.

[xhomerx10]

It's not fucking loose! IT's lose!! We might fucking lose a possible Bitcoin adopter!!
My OCD is kicking in.

If he spelled a word wrong you used words like fuck ! now see yourself !

Cunt you make millions of mistakes yourself who the fucking moron are you to correct him ?


**

...[redacted for brevity]

  We've all seen this post: Everyone looses in the long run bumped a couple of thousand times.   In my case, the word loose enrages simply enrages me now.  It was humour.  Sorry it was loost on you.  Did you get that one?