[BAKEWELL] Action Proposal - Call for Volunteers

[burnside]

http://www1.datafilehost.com/d/afdd7863
Link to the Bitfunder Asset list for BAKEWELL, strange its 21 shares short (5979 of 6000) and it shows that there was 6000 when he last paid a dividend.

Its a google docs spreadsheet and has % thrown in.

We need Mr./Mrs. 1123/966/730 shares to speak up that's 47% in those 3 people.

Maybe he bought some back for a friend?

[1714805124]

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[Blazr]

This guy ended up being a scammer? Wow, we exchanged PM's about a very sizable loan before, luckily I dodged the bullet.

Wish you guys the best of luck.

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

http://www1.datafilehost.com/d/afdd7863
Link to the Bitfunder Asset list for BAKEWELL, strange its 21 shares short (5979 of 6000) and it shows that there was 6000 when he last paid a dividend.

Its a google docs spreadsheet and has % thrown in.

We need Mr./Mrs. 1123/966/730 shares to speak up that's 47% in those 3 people.

Maybe he bought some back for a friend?

I'd say unclaimed GLBSE shares might have being removed?

[nameface]

http://www1.datafilehost.com/d/afdd7863
We need Mr./Mrs. 1123/966/730 shares to speak up that's 47% in those 3 people.

Could some of those be Ian's shares? He held 2 categories of shares.

[niko]

I am the guy who met Ian in person in September 2012, after seeing his BAKEWELL anouncement. At the time all my funds were tied up, so this meetup was mostly an attempt to make sure he is for real - and yes, he was the person from the images he posted.

Few weeks later I did manage to come up with 30 coins, and decided to buy in.

GLBSE collapsed. Ian kept hashing with the two rigs.

He then abruptly anounced how we should "consider BAKEWELL a loss".  I did not like the sound of it. He also did not respond to my PMs, emails, and telephone contacts. I did not like that either. While I was too apologetic when he finally acknowledged the previous receipt of GLBSE data, I was left with the bad taste which only grew worse over days.

At some point, Ian voted with growth and maintenance shares, and stubbornly defended the idiocy of doing so. That's where I had enough. As a matter of principle, I try not to do business with people I dislike, even if it is or may be profitable. I sold all my shares - at approximately a 50% loss - and quit wasting time on Ian. In retrospect, it was one good decision I made.

As I have no more direct interest in this matter, I am simply writing to share my unqualified opinion about actions of shareholders and lenders whose assets Ian ran away with. There is no company to go after. There is only Ian, and his written (and archived, thanks to Theymos) commitments. What he seems to be doing is an indictable offence in Canada. I agree with repentance here. This is a criminal matter, and should be dealt with accordingly.

Finally, in case Ian reads this - I urge him to carefully reconsider the direction he took. There still is a little bit of time left for a U-turn.

[Deprived]

This needs to be dealt with by going to the police - not by share-holder motions on a company that has no legal existence.

Of the two Avalons, one was paid for by a loan to the company - which still hasn't been discharged in full.  So from ANY perspective the shareholders do not have clear title to that even if it were accepted that the "company" was a legal person.

There's 0% chance Yifu will intervene.  He'd expose himself and his company to risk for no benefit and set a precedent whereby he'd end up inundated with people claiming Avalon X was paid for with their money so should be sent to them.  He refused to intervene in one such dispute over a loan before.

But if you DO go ahead with this, you could also consider sending a letter to BFL (no translation neeed) and see if they'll do anything about the preordered hardware for usagi's company BMF which has still not accounted for for all the hardware it claimed to have before GLBSE closed.  That company also deleted all posts, won't respond (thread is locked), won't provide updated information, refuses to pay out funds to shareholders and has made promises (repaying all NYAN.A investors in full) that the rise in BTC price has made unlikely ever to be fulfilled.

Rather than attemtion-whoring here with dodgy proposals (you're asking Yifu to break a contract made with Ian Bakewell - without a court order he CAN'T legally confiscate the Avalons), usagi would be better served spending the time finally sorting out the finances of his own companies which have languished without attention since January.  Yes - we GET that you want to list them so you can buy the shares back for cheap by forcing investors into submission by never doing anything, failing to update accounts and withholding their money.  Whining about Bakewell not paying his investors/honouring his promises is the ultimate in hypocrisy as you're doing precisely the same to your own ones.  Or is there somewhere a schedule of how/when you'll meet your promise to refund NYAN.A investors in full?

[Puppet]

This needs to be dealt with by going to the police - not by share-holder motions on a company that has no legal existence.

Of the two Avalons, one was paid for by a loan to the company - which still hasn't been discharged in full.  So from ANY perspective the shareholders do not have clear title to that even if it were accepted that the "company" was a legal person.

There's 0% chance Yifu will intervene.  He'd expose himself and his company to risk for no benefit and set a precedent whereby he'd end up inundated with people claiming Avalon X was paid for with their money so should be sent to them.  He refused to intervene in one such dispute over a loan before.

But if you DO go ahead with this, you could also consider sending a letter to BFL (no translation neeed) and see if they'll do anything about the preordered hardware for usagi's company BMF which has still not accounted for for all the hardware it claimed to have before GLBSE closed.  That company also deleted all posts, won't respond (thread is locked), won't provide updated information, refuses to pay out funds to shareholders and has made promises (repaying all NYAN.A investors in full) that the rise in BTC price has made unlikely ever to be fulfilled.

Rather than attemtion-whoring here with dodgy proposals (you're asking Yifu to break a contract made with Ian Bakewell - without a court order he CAN'T legally confiscate the Avalons), usagi would be better served spending the time finally sorting out the finances of his own companies which have languished without attention since January.  Yes - we GET that you want to list them so you can buy the shares back for cheap by forcing investors into submission by never doing anything, failing to update accounts and withholding their money.  Whining about Bakewell not paying his investors/honouring his promises is the ultimate in hypocrisy as you're doing precisely the same to your own ones.  Or is there somewhere a schedule of how/when you'll meet your promise to refund NYAN.A investors in full?

The voice of reason. +10.

[wisard]

I own 1123 shares. I back this.

I don't mind either TradeFortress or Dalkore heading this.

I would prefer mining over selling. But I will go with whatever the decision made by them is.

I will also gift a few of my shares as incentive if Avalon orders does get transferred (this could be used to pay off the outstanding loan that was taken for the 2nd Avalon - if we know who the loan giver is. This could also be used to cover transportation costs that arise if anyone is willing to travel.)

[strello]

Great stuff everyone!

I'm really proud of the almost exclusively positive rational discussion developing in this thread. It's a pity about the one suggestion of violence so far, but I can understand the genuine anger behind his outburst. As most will agree, we don't need violence here.

I realise that any kind of recovery at all a very long shot, but I feel there's a real opportunity to score some great publicity here as it's such an open scam.

Bakewell has posted far too much personal info to run away anonymously, so we can use his online personality to create a media Bitcoin Bogeyman. The potential for positive Bitcoin coverage- something is being done about the scammers at last- as well as a good human interest news story is far to good an opportunity to let slip. Great propaganda value here. I'm gently working on trying to get the story out as widely and creatively as I can, in breaks from being really sick just now.

This is becoming a fine example of how, with some cool heads and a handful of passion, the immensely diverse Bitcoin community can pull together and make a real positive change in the world. Real democratic non-violent self policing by mutual agreement.

Great to see new thinking coming in too, thanks for the suggestion of giving him a last chance, MikeMark.

And finally, as usual, Deprived is absolutely correct in his analysis. This must be officially reported to the Canadian authorities as soon as possible.

Good luck all!

strello

[Deprived]

Just some advice on reporting it to the police.

DON'T wander into your local Police station with nothing planned or prepared then proceed to totally confuse whoever you speak to.
DO prepare a full written summary of what happened first - referencing either evidence or where evidence could be obtained from.

My recommendation would be that the initial report be from someone who gave him a simple loan.  That's far easier to explain than trying to explain what being a Bakewell shareholder means.  The key of the initial report is to get an investigation opened - then all the other loans/shorts/shares etc can get added in.

To get an investigation opened the main thing you need to convince them of is that there' a reasonable prospect of a conviction at the end of it.  That definitely IS the case here - but it's easy to fail to make that clear if you don't plan in advance and end up waffling on about irreleavnt things rather than hammering home that the evidence does exist/is recoverable and that there's no doubt over the identity of the perpetrator.

Don't delay giving 2nd chances / last chances etc.  Some evidence only has a limited life-span (e.g. ISP logs of allocated IP addresses) and you really want the Police involved BEFORE the Avalons arrive - so that they can be seized by the Police on arrival then disposed of appropriately at the end of their investigation.  It may be that Ian's lawyer (he'd have one by then) may advise him to turn the Avalon over to someone continuing to operate Bakewell.  Remember failing to repay the loans isn't necessarily criminal, stealing the investors' computers definitely is - and once Police involvement forces him to get a lawyer he'll have that explained to him.

[usagi]

And finally, as usual, Deprived is absolutely correct in his analysis. This must be officially reported to the Canadian authorities as soon as possible.

Don't listen to Deprived/Puppet or Repentance because they are being paid by MPOE-PR to try and turn this into an issue about me and BMF/etc.

Back to business, while we may need to end up going to the police that is not the path I am proposing here, and unfortunately for Puppet/Deprived/etc. they will lose this round. We have shareholder support now to put TradeFortress in and try to reclaim the Avalons. That is step one. We may fail, that's fine, but I think we should try. We also have Niko on board with us now, so the next thing (step two) is to try to contact Ian and ask him if he won't come back and try to work things out. Not going to the police, which should be a last resort IMO. The last thing you want to do is to go to the police without giving Ian a chance. If you go to the police the hardware will get confiscated and you will likely never see any money or hardware returned. We need to contact Ian and talk some sense into him.

[Deprived]

And finally, as usual, Deprived is absolutely correct in his analysis. This must be officially reported to the Canadian authorities as soon as possible.

Don't listen to Deprived/Puppet or Repentance because they are being paid by MPOE-PR to try and turn this into an issue about me and BMF/etc.

Back to business, while we may need to end up going to the police that is not the path I am proposing here, and unfortunately for Puppet/Deprived/etc. they will lose this round. We have shareholder support now to put TradeFortress in and try to reclaim the Avalons. That is step one. We may fail, that's fine, but I think we should try. We also have Niko on board with us now, so the next thing (step two) is to try to contact Ian and ask him if he won't come back and try to work things out. Not going to the police, which should be a last resort IMO. The last thing you want to do is to go to the police without giving Ian a chance. If you go to the police the hardware will get confiscated and you will likely never see any money or hardware returned. We need to contact Ian and talk some sense into him.

Certainly no harm in contacting Ian - just don't let him stall you for too long.  Would have thought contacting him would have been done before even making forum threads tbh (you phoned him up before after all).  If you want to waste your time contacting Avalon then knock yourself out - just don't be surprised when the answer ie either "No", "I need a court order" or "Please provide me contact details for a Police Officer who can confirm these were purchased with stolen funds".

If you go to the police then yes, all hardware would be seized.  But if Ian isn't cooperating then it's better for the hardware to be with the police than with Ian - as the Police won't sell if off for cheap before you can get a court order or reach agreement for possession of it.

I'm not being paid by anyone to say anything btw.  I ONCE received an unsolicited payment from MPOE-PR (last year I think) that wasn't tied to any specific post I'd made and had no strings attached.  Disagree with my agenda by all means - but at least accept it's my OWN agenda not someone else's.  And I'd keep all mention of BMF etc to their own thread - except you always either delete or lock threads about your own companies.

[Peter Lambert]

usagi, theft is a criminal matter and the remedies to theft cannot be found in shareholder motions or trying to take control of a pretend company.  Even if you start looking at breaches of contract and torts like conversion, you still have the problem that BAKEWELL is only a pretend company.  In reality, Ian is operating as a sole trader and no amount of shareholder votes can change that or give you the legal authority to seize control of his assets (and they're his assets, not BAKEWELL's, unless BAKEWELL is a separate legal entity).

I was selling off my holdings, I currently hold just 3 shares, so I don't have much at stake here, but here are my thoughts:

I think I agree with Repentance here.

There is no legal jurisdiction that will acknowledge BAKEWELL as a company, If he lives in Canada we will probably have to work under Canadian Law. My suggestion is to try to convince the court that he owes us some amount of Canadian Dollars based on the conversion rate of bitcoins.

[nameface]

I've contacted Ian several times over email and skype in recent weeks to request he pay me back. He hasn't gotten back to me.
I recently let him know an initiative is starting against him, still no reply.

Deprived, Puppet, and Repentance do seem like they may have another agenda posting on this thread, but I still appreciate their input. I too have been scammed out of 1 BTC by usagi re: BMF, but at least we are in communication about it, and I don't see how that pertains to this.

[strello]

Please can we all try to stay on topic and focussed on the Bakewell question. Let's keep inter personal issues out of this thread.

We've miraculously got this ball rolling, and need to keep it going.

I think, according to nameface's post, a good attempt has been made to contact Ian Bakewell. Perhaps TradeFortress should also make an "official" attempt.

I'm sure we need to follow up on the Canadian legal approach.

The shareholder takeover move is off the wall and has a very small chance of any real success, but in my opinion could well be the deal breaker. I think it's the little spark of genius that might get a lot of people on our side.

And we need more publicity. Can anyone do the social media stuff- reddit, twitter, facebook, second life and all those other buzzwords I have no idea about? Can't someone just start posting the word about this anywhere they can?

[nameface]

I think, according to nameface's post, a good attempt has been made to contact Ian Bakewell. Perhaps TradeFortress should also make an "official" attempt.

I wouldn't characterize my recent attempts to make contact as official. They don't pertain to this initiative.
It's just a few correspondences that amount to: "Hey man, what the hell, give me my money".
But I'll definitely provide testimony to the police or other arbiters, and provide the records I have.

[Evolvex]

I have 111 shares, I vote to let you appoint tradefortress as ceo, and my thanks goes out to all who are able and have got the ball rolling.

I think a peaceful and fair solution to everyone should be looked for regardless, and if all else fails, we go to the police and put him in the hot water.

As was pointed out, this could be good media coverage for bitcoin, "bitcoiners deal out bitcoin justice to scammer"....love it.

I'd be happy to sell my shares depending on price, pm me with me offers (I dont get to check here much so may take a while to reply).

Cheers again.

[usagi]

Shareholder update: The following shareholders want a motion run to give the CEO seat to TradeFortress. This is the right of the shareholders.

 294 usagi
 483 tulkos
  97 strello
unk. iCEBREAKER
 300 fourd00rgtz
 300 MikeMark
 252 NameFace
1123 wisard
 111 Evolvex
 730 Razcnah

----
3690 61.5%

The motion would still need to be run to make it official. Haven't heard anything from Ukyo yet. I don't have time to pursue this anymore because I have some extra hours at my job recently so someone else will need to take the mantle. I've done what I set out to do (get the ball rolling) now's the time for the whole 'step up and do your part' thing. Someone needs to contact the relevant people (and police if necessary) and what not. Good luck!

[Dalkore]

Thank you for your consideration.   If TradeFortress does not accept and can not execute these duties, please keep me in mind as a backup candidate.  The offer is also open if you don't want to liquidate the unit but instead put it into a management service and send out income.   

It is good to see you guys organize, be proactive and try and make the best of this bad situation.


-Dalkore

[nameface]

Who has a better relationship with Avalon? Who wants it more? I'll vote with the majority.