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Author Topic: unbearable blockchain size  (Read 1902 times)
fred21
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January 19, 2017, 10:39:29 AM
 #1

Hello,

As you can see here : https://blockchain.info/charts/blocks-size?timespan=all, blockchain size is growing exponentially.

Is it likely, that in few decade or centuries, blockchain size will be to big to be kept in any hardware node?

thanks

UPDATE ON YOUR REPLIES

1- BTC blockchain is not growing exponentially but linearly (but is still growing) This still can be discussed as blocksize increases by time.
2- BTC blockchain size shouldn't be an issue as storage capacity are high and will become even higher in future
3- The main issue is block size which if it become bigger and bigger, will not be able to be downloaded quickly enough by all nodes if the connection speed of those nodes is not high enough 
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January 19, 2017, 10:44:10 AM
 #2

Hello,

As you can see here : https://blockchain.info/charts/blocks-size?timespan=all, blockchain size is growing exponentially.

Is it likely, that in few decade or centuries, blockchain size will be to big to be kept in any hardware node?

thanks

The current block size is 1Mb, so theoretically, the blockchain size could potentially grow up to 144Mb/day.
The reason why the graph looks like it's growing exponentially is because in the past, the blocks weren't filled completely.

If the block size would be increased to, let's say, 2 Mb, The graph would indicate that the size could theoretically grow 288Mb/day, but with a fixed blocksize, it would never grow exponentially. This size increase used to be a big discussion topic, altough nowadays, it seems like it's cooled down a bit. There are also initiatives like the lightning network to reduce the pressure created by the fact that the blocks are full most of the time and lots of transactions remain unconfirmed in the mempool.

It is possible the blockchain will become to big for a standard Hard disk, but don't forget, the size of the available harddisk also increases as time goes on... So, in all probability, there won't be a problem Smiley

At the moment, the size is ~100Gb, if the blocksize remains the same and all blocks are filled from now on, we can expect a blockchain size of ~625Gb in 10 Years... Current desktop PC's either have smaller SSD's, or larger but slower SATA disks... In my country, it seems like the SATA disk size of most new PC's is already 1 or 2 Tb, so this disk should be sufficient even in 10 years.

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January 19, 2017, 11:19:14 AM
 #3

Is it likely, that in few decade or centuries, blockchain size will be to big to be kept in any hardware node?
Blockchain size is only around 100 gb right now and in most of the countries internet speed have been increased  over the last few years and i am quite sure within next few years it may not take more than 1 minute to download 100 gb (5G technology) so downloading blockchain to run node may not be big problem also cost of hard disk have dropped significantly and even a small pendrive can store more than 100 gb this days.

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January 19, 2017, 11:53:58 AM
 #4

It is not a problem that we should we be concerned of. In the future new technology will be used to cater the expanding blockchain size. Technology is moving fast and such problem in the blockchain will be considered peanuts later. Sometime ago the main problem was the speed but now many advancement is made t solve the issue on slow bitcoin transaction.

franky1
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January 19, 2017, 12:35:57 PM
 #5

ill keep this short



the red line is the OP's view of the future.

the blue area is the reality of past present and future

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January 19, 2017, 12:37:29 PM
 #6

Hello,

As you can see here : https://blockchain.info/charts/blocks-size?timespan=all, blockchain size is growing exponentially.

Is it likely, that in few decade or centuries, blockchain size will be to big to be kept in any hardware node?

thanks

it is not exponentially it is linearly, and there is a big difference.

and the size, although is scary at first look, is not a very big issue. it is not the year 2000 Smiley
nowadays you can get a very huge amount of disk space in a very small device, and HDDs are becoming cheaper and bigger. I am sure franky1 is going to come here and give you the picture of that disk on a finger tip, which you can find yourself and it is cheap.

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January 19, 2017, 12:57:32 PM
 #7

ill keep this short



the red line is the OP's view of the future.

the blue area is the reality of past present and future
Blocks will always be full. When we raise it to 2mb, blocks will quickly fill up. Etc. There is no ending in the block size being full. But that is good news, just means the network is being used, if they weren't full that would be a problem. If we want to have a big amount of free blocks, it would mean the blocksize would need to be too big to keep the network decentralized.

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aarturka
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January 19, 2017, 01:08:25 PM
 #8

Satoshi put limit in 1 mb not just for fun. He was a wise man. We must not increase this value. SegWit and Lightning is only possible way to evolve. Fuck this dough head Roger Ver
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January 19, 2017, 01:08:44 PM
 #9

I dont think there is any thing to worry about the size of blockchain beacuse right now the the whole blockchain can be stored on this

so its safe to say that in future even if blockchain reaches the size of 1TB we would have no problem about storage.

franky1
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January 19, 2017, 01:09:29 PM
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Blocks will always be full. When we raise it to 2mb, blocks will quickly fill up. Etc. There is no ending in the block size being full. But that is good news, just means the network is being used, if they weren't full that would be a problem. If we want to have a big amount of free blocks, it would mean the blocksize would need to be too big to keep the network decentralized.

not quite.

when the consensus is reached to go to say 2mb block buffer (acceptable limit of nodes)
pools will then say the maximum they will ever make is 2mb.. but
here is the kicker
pools will dip thir toe in the water by making a block that is just a tad bit more than 1mb. say 1.001mb just to see the orphan risks and also to see if any bugs pop up.. such as the 500kb bug Sipa introduced in 2013..

if the orphan rate is not noticeable and no drama is caused, the pools will test a little more.

this is the safe rational and natural path to do.

but dont worry about bottlenecking. they wont take 8 years to get to the 2mb 'full' limit. the progress to 2mb will be sooner.

eg if they stepped up by an extra 10kb per block. they could get to 2mb 'full' in just 3 days, safely evaluating the orphan bug risks
or if actual transaction demand per block was only 1.2mb to get everyone in.. it can have blocks have the 2mb limit but blocks only with 1.2mb due to demand only needing 1.2mb and slowly grow as demand grows.

its not a straight near vertical line like the op thinks.. its a curve

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franky1
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January 19, 2017, 01:10:45 PM
 #11

Satoshi put limit in 1 mb not just for fun. He was a wise man. We must not increase this value. SegWit and Lightning is only possible way to evolve. Fuck this dough head Roger Ver

you have cabin fever. your reading prepared scripts from a group of people that want centralisation and commercial services to own bitcoin.

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Don't take any information given on this forum on face value. Please do your own due diligence & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. If you wish to seek legal FACTUAL advice, then seek the guidance of a LEGAL specialist.
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January 19, 2017, 01:12:08 PM
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so its safe to say that in future even if blockchain reaches the size of 1TB we would have no problem about storage.
If blockchain reaches huge size. We lost decentralization. Only few people would run full node and control blockchain. This is what unlimited is supposed to do.
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January 19, 2017, 01:14:35 PM
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you have cabin fever. your reading prepared scripts from a group of people that want centralisation and commercial services to own bitcoin.
You think you're smarter than Satoshi? Well go create your alt with unlimited block size and we will see  Grin...
franky1
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January 19, 2017, 01:25:37 PM
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you have cabin fever. your reading prepared scripts from a group of people that want centralisation and commercial services to own bitcoin.
You think you're smarter than Satoshi? Well go create your alt with unlimited block size and we will see  Grin...

think rationally..
natural scaled and copable growth has been halted using fears of "gigabyte blocks by midnight" fake scare doomsday propaganda.

the simple fact is. if a node cant cope with a larger size they wont set their dynamic setting above what they can cope with. and if the majority of nodes cant cope it wont change. and pools that try to force it will just get their attempt orphaned.

learn consensus, it will help you.

even core have publicly said 8mb is safe but they prefer 4mb.. to be ultra safe.. so no actual reason to hold the base block at 1mb

getting to 2mb or 4mb or 8mb is not going to be an overnight thing. its going to be a risk averting curve that naturally progresses over time.

stop reading the fake doomsdays of 1gb blocks by midnight. as an excuse to stop rational smaller growth over natural and rational time.

they are scaring you with wild numbers, because they dont want you knowing that rational and natural numbers can work. they want to halt natural and rational growth to force you into commercialised LN Hubs so they can repay their $90m debt from investors.
they care less about bitcoin and only care about their investment contract,

just look beyond the doomsday rhetoric told to you by the guys devoted to blockstream and look for the truth behind their propaganda
.. but i guess like all the other blockstream sheep. you wont research it. you will just "trust" them on face value.

here is the blockstream rhetoric simplified.
"dont think about the blue line or choose the blue line because we want to scare you with a fake red line to push people into a new network that has commercialised hubs"

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Don't take any information given on this forum on face value. Please do your own due diligence & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. If you wish to seek legal FACTUAL advice, then seek the guidance of a LEGAL specialist.
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January 19, 2017, 01:28:00 PM
 #15

Hello,

As you can see here : https://blockchain.info/charts/blocks-size?timespan=all, blockchain size is growing exponentially.

Is it likely, that in few decade or centuries, blockchain size will be to big to be kept in any hardware node?

thanks

These are the same sorts of arguments that have been made for decades about the internet! usually by people who just cant see past the present reality.  like seriously are do you actually believe we will need to worry about blockchain size in a few decades?  and i doubt in centuries the concept of money will even be challenged..... Roll Eyes
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January 19, 2017, 01:32:22 PM
 #16

...
it is not exponentially it is linearly, and there is a big difference.
...

How is it linear?

Linear growth means that it grows by the same amount in each time step.

Try to compare blockchain size at the end of each calendar year and let us know what you found.
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January 19, 2017, 01:39:55 PM
 #17

bla bla bla ...
No, today they increase block size, tomorrow they increase total amount of bitcoins, actually they've already promised Angry. We must stop these sneaks and not allow to increase block size by any means necessary.
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January 19, 2017, 01:52:35 PM
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bla bla bla ...
No, today they increase block size, tomorrow they increase total amount of bitcoins, actually they've already promised Angry. We must stop these sneaks and not allow to increase block size by any means necessary.

lol
actually its the blockstream crew that want to increase the units of measure.. as part of their LN strategy of millisatoshi's.
look beyond what has been spoonfed to you and research

but back to the blocksize..
blockstream want to halt tx counts. at 1mb.. but bloat the DATA TRANSMITTED beyond 1mb.
they as a fake gesture suggest their new 'weight' buzzword as part of segwit allows 2.1x transactions. but as fast as people switch to segwit keypairs blockstream are bloating up transactions with CLTV bytes of data and CSV bytes of data and confidential commitment kilobytes of data.

so a one time hope of 2500tx/block->4500tx/block.. soon goes back down to 2500tx/block once they add the features.. but the DATA TRANSMITTED goes up to 4mb/block

EG 2500tx:1mb      to    4500tx:2.1mb   <-blockstream (2017)
EG 4500tx:2.1mb   to    2500tx:4mb   <-blockstream (2019)

EG 2500tx:1mb    to      5000tx:2mb   <-community desire (2017)
EG 5000tx:2mb    to     10000tx:4mb   <-community desire (2019)

I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
Don't take any information given on this forum on face value. Please do your own due diligence & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. If you wish to seek legal FACTUAL advice, then seek the guidance of a LEGAL specialist.
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January 19, 2017, 01:56:29 PM
 #19

Blockchain size right now is 6073 MB, and will be much larger on the next year because of the bitcoin population is growing larger and larger every day. Expect that in the next year, blockchain would be larger than it's size right now since the bitcoin population is rapidly growing each day that passed by because bitcoin really helps people in many ways.

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January 19, 2017, 01:57:53 PM
 #20

Blockchain size right now is 6073 MB, and will be much larger on the next year because of the bitcoin population is growing larger and larger every day. Expect that in the next year, blockchain would be larger than it's size right now since the bitcoin population is rapidly growing each day that passed by because bitcoin really helps people in many ways.

du -sh ~/.bitcoin/
117G    /home/[snip]/.bitcoin/

Where did you get the number 6073 Mb if i might ask? Maybe you've got a pruned blockchain?

Btw: the size of the blockchain has nothing to do with how many people use bitcoin, and everything to do with the size and number of transactions.
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