SegWit yay or nay? come vote here.

[Lauda]

OP you do realize that running a poll, where random people with zero knowledge can vote and vote brigading can occur is really pointless? It won't provide you with any kind of valid results, not even for this small community of BTCT.

I totally agree with SegWit since it offers advantage for many of us, but we must make sure there won't be any blockchain split and make sure all nodes/miners ready for SegWit.

You can't split a blockchain with a successful and backwards compatible soft fork. It will only activate when 95% of the miners are signaling for a certain period of time.

Also, someone needs to explain about SegWit for regular users to prevent misunderstanding.

If fully adopted by the network and wallet providers, it won't make any visible difference to the average user. If the user does not know about thing like CSV, CLTV and similar, they don't need to concren themselves with the technical details of Segwit.

[1714747533]

1714747533

[franky1]

Also, someone needs to explain about SegWit for regular users to prevent misunderstanding.

If fully adopted by the network and wallet providers, it won't make any visible difference to the average user. If the user does not know about thing like CSV, CLTV and similar, they don't need to concren themselves with the technical details of Segwit.

standard sweep it under the carpet statement...
(facepalm)

[TooDumbForBitcoin]

 It will only activate when 95% of the miners are signaling for a certain period of time.

Not accurate.  It activates when 95% of the last 2016 blocks include a SEGWIT support signal.  This does not require 95% miner support.  It requires support from the miners who mined those 1916 blocks.  This could be considerably fewer than 95% of all miners, and could be significantly less than 95% of all hashrate.  There is luck involved in finding blocks.

[Gimpeline]

gmaxwell is part of the new world order and he controll the internett..
franky1's conspiracy theories incomming in 3..2...1 

[franky1]

gmaxwell is part of the new world order and he controll the internett..
franky1's conspiracy theories incomming in 3..2...1  

exaggerating what i have said to such an extent that you make yourself look silly instead of showing proof that gmaxwell isnt actually trying to change things.

how about try reading things rationally and logically.
oh and please dont throw in the "gigabyte by midnight" rhetoric as thats more scripted exaggerations of r/bitcoin.. the real conspiracy makers

[Lauda]

standard sweep it under the carpet statement...
(facepalm)

You shouldn't burder the average Joe with in depth technicalities. It will not bring benefit of any sorts.

Not accurate.  It activates when 95% of the last 2016 blocks include a SEGWIT support signal.  This does not require 95% miner support.  It requires support from the miners who mined those 1916 blocks.  This could be considerably fewer than 95% of all miners, and could be significantly less than 95% of all hashrate.  There is luck involved in finding blocks.

'Considerably fewer'? I'm certain that the 'luck factor' isn't that great to a specific miner or subset of miners in such a big period of time.

[Gimpeline]

gmaxwell is part of the new world order and he controll the internett..
franky1's conspiracy theories incomming in 3..2...1  

exaggerating what i have said to such an extent that you make yourself look silly instead of showing proof that gmaxwell isnt actually trying to change things.

how about try reading things rationally and logically.
oh and please dont throw in the "gigabyte by midnight" rhetoric as thats more scripted exaggerations of r/bitcoin.. the real conspiracy makers

And there it is. Please include the Rothschilds  

[doc12]

gmaxwell is part of the new world order and he controll the internett..
franky1's conspiracy theories incomming in 3..2...1  

exaggerating what i have said to such an extent that you make yourself look silly instead of showing proof that gmaxwell isnt actually trying to change things.

how about try reading things rationally and logically.
oh and please dont throw in the "gigabyte by midnight" rhetoric as thats more scripted exaggerations of r/bitcoin.. the real conspiracy makers

And there it is. Please include the Rothschilds  

Im missing blockstream ... its the genesisblock of all evil  

Rule Nr1 for r/btc consiratists, somehow mention blockstream in a bad context. Logic is not necessary.

[franky1]

standard sweep it under the carpet statement...
(facepalm)

You shouldn't burder the average Joe with in depth technicalities. It will not bring benefit of any sorts.

lol those running full nodes are wanting the information about the network .. and they deserve to know.

yea a couple million litenode/webwallet average joe users dont need to know because they have no intention to secure the network. but that does not mean sweeping things under the carpet and hiding the truth with wishy washy meaningless buzzwords to confuse people.

Not accurate.  It activates when 95% of the last 2016 blocks include a SEGWIT support signal.  This does not require 95% miner support.  It requires support from the miners who mined those 1916 blocks.  This could be considerably fewer than 95% of all miners, and could be significantly less than 95% of all hashrate.  There is luck involved in finding blocks.

'Considerably fewer'? I'm certain that the 'luck factor' isn't that great to a specific miner or subset of miners in such a big period of time.

oh lauda.. havnt you seen the other plan.. intentionally blacklist known block producers to make sgwit nodes only see blocks from sgwit supporters to get the 95% trigger.

If there is some reason when the users of Bitcoin would rather have it activate at 90%  ... then even with the 95% rule the network could choose to activate it at 90% just by orphaning the blocks of the non-supporters until 95%+ of the remaining blocks signaled activation.

EG ban connections from old implementations to only get 2016 blocks from pools with new implementations and trigger the grace period as soon as it hits 1916 blocks.

in short cause an intentional split to get the soft fork activated..


separate subject. after activation when the real segwit fully functional implementation (p2wpkh wallet generation active) how many old nodes will you white list as your downstreamer? 1% 10% 0% or will you not be picky and allow any connection to connect..

be honest i have seen on other topics you have a keen interest in your node ban lists. so we both know you understand the concept

[doc12]

Franky1 must be the BU spokesman, who supplies you with #AlternativeFacts™  

Ah yeah, meanwhile SW-node count growing  

[franky1]

Franky1 must be the BU spokesman, who supplys you with alternative Facts™  

independant research, go try it. its mind and eye opening. you will ses passed all the scripts and actually see whats really happening.

please research
consensus
the code

then run some scenario's of how things will actually play out.
actually have an open mind and dont just play follow the leader.

[franky1]

/Satoshi:0.13.1/   1512 (26.84%)
/Satoshi:0.13.2/   1165 (20.68%)
/Satoshi:0.13.99/   116 (2%)

/Satoshi:0.13.1/   1528 (26.84%)
/Satoshi:0.13.2/   1183 (20.78%)
/Satoshi:0.13.99/   117 (2%)

and minutes later

/Satoshi:0.13.1/   1524 (26.74%)
/Satoshi:0.13.2/   1183 (20.75%)
/Satoshi:0.13.99/   117 (2%)

wow it moves under 1% in a day.. and wow it goes up and down...
how about calm down and look at the long scale changes.. instead of celebrating at the 0.1% increases.. it make you look silly.

[saturnalia]

gmaxwell is part of the new world order and he controll the internett..
franky1's conspiracy theories incomming in 3..2...1  

exaggerating what i have said to such an extent that you make yourself look silly instead of showing proof that gmaxwell isnt actually trying to change things.

how about try reading things rationally and logically.
oh and please dont throw in the "gigabyte by midnight" rhetoric as thats more scripted exaggerations of r/bitcoin.. the real conspiracy makers

Blah blah blah blah Greg Maxwell is a bad, scary man blah blah blah something something Blockstream blah blah blah we need 5000 GB blocks immediately blah blah blah .

[franky1]

shame so many people get soo emotional just because i mentioned a name, so much so that they ignore the code and logic and context of the enitre conversation and just defend someones name.. lol.

[doc12]

/Satoshi:0.13.1/   1512 (26.84%)
/Satoshi:0.13.2/   1165 (20.68%)
/Satoshi:0.13.99/   116 (2%)

/Satoshi:0.13.1/   1528 (26.84%)
/Satoshi:0.13.2/   1183 (20.78%)
/Satoshi:0.13.99/   117 (2%)

and minutes later

/Satoshi:0.13.1/   1524 (26.74%)
/Satoshi:0.13.2/   1183 (20.75%)
/Satoshi:0.13.99/   117 (2%)

wow it moves under 1% in a day.. and wow it goes up and down...
how about calm down and look at the long scale changes.. instead of celebrating at the 0.1% increases.. it make you look silly.

Let it be 0,5% per day on avarage, thats 15% in a month... pretty awesome imho !  

Now lets look at BU ... ok never mind.
Ah and dont forget (sorry I have to use your words, but this explains it pretty good): ~7% are BU supporting whether they realise it or not.. yep 7% implicitly, but an unknown number below 7% explicitly.
the difference between implicit and explicit terms is that some people upgrade just because they see something new and shiny but dont understand whats 'under the hood'. so its not ~7% full knowledge explicit desire. it's less...

[Lauda]

lol those running full nodes are wanting the information about the network .. and they deserve to know.

I was not talking about those people.

yea a couple million litenode/webwallet average joe users dont need to know because they have no intention to secure the network. but that does not mean sweeping things under the carpet and hiding the truth with wishy washy meaningless buzzwords to confuse people.

I was never stating that the truth should be hidden nor should thing be swept under the carpet. All I said that the average joe doesn't need to be burdened with the technical details. This doesn't mean that information should be withheld by them.

oh lauda.. havnt you seen the other plan.. intentionally blacklist known block producers to make sgwit nodes only see blocks from sgwit supporters to get the 95% trigger.

That still won't really cause a 'split'. It would still have a pretty big majority on one side.

Franky1 must be the BU spokesman, who supplys you with alternative Facts™ 

independant research, go try it. its mind and eye opening. you will ses passed all the scripts and actually see whats really happening.

Some comedy from people attacking each other in here.

[franky1]

oh lauda.. havnt you seen the other plan.. intentionally blacklist known block producers to make sgwit nodes only see blocks from sgwit supporters to get the 95% trigger.

That still won't really cause a 'split'. It would still have a pretty big majority on one side.

the orphan consensus.. vs just rejecting blocks due to who made it. leaves segwit only seeing one chain of blocks and making their own blockheight. where other nodes make another chain of blocks without bias and ultimately having a higher blockheight. because they are not throwing blocks aside

consensus is where the network as a whole end up with just one chain of blocks of the same height

blocks should only be rejected if they have bad data. not because of 'brand bias'.

try running a scenario where gmaxwell mentions purposefully orphaning off opposing blocks..
and see what happens when you start banning certain pools as if they dont exist and then compare the resulting chains segwit see's to the chain the rest of the network see's. it will surprise you.

simply put: if there were this chain of blocks,
ADEBFADBECADEBFADBEC

imagining C is the opposer
legacy sees: ADEBFADBECADEBFADBEC
segwit sees: ADEBFADBE  [halt, unsync from network]

segwit stalls. because the A has a 'previous hash' of C which segwit refuses to recognise. so segwit cant accept A.. or the following blocks after that..

so now segwit pools need to make a block thats has a previous hash of E
and now the chains diverge..

[doc12]

Franky1 must be the BU spokesman, who supplys you with alternative Facts™  

independant research, go try it. its mind and eye opening. you will ses passed all the scripts and actually see whats really happening.

please research
consensus
the code

then run some scenario's of how things will actually play out.
actually have an open mind and dont just play follow the leader.

You know whats your mistake ? You think you discovered the "truth" and all others are wrong. Conspiratist at its best ...
How you can be so sure that you have the "open" mind" ?

Conspiratists are funny people, they are 100% sure they are right and have an open mind n shit, but actually you behave exactly the same like you accuse others to do. Just from another viewpoint.

[franky1]

Franky1 must be the BU spokesman, who supplys you with alternative Facts™  

independant research, go try it. its mind and eye opening. you will ses passed all the scripts and actually see whats really happening.

please research
consensus
the code

then run some scenario's of how things will actually play out.
actually have an open mind and dont just play follow the leader.

You know whats your mistake ? You think you discovered the "truth" and all others are wrong. Conspiratist at its best ...
How you can be so sure that you have the "open" mind" ?

Conspiratists are funny people, they are 100% sure they are right and have an open mind n shit, but actually you behave exactly the same like you accuse others to do. Just from another viewpoint.

spend more time researching bitcoin and understanding it. and less time screaming insults to defend someones name.

[doc12]

Franky1 must be the BU spokesman, who supplys you with alternative Facts™  

independant research, go try it. its mind and eye opening. you will ses passed all the scripts and actually see whats really happening.

please research
consensus
the code

then run some scenario's of how things will actually play out.
actually have an open mind and dont just play follow the leader.

You know whats your mistake ? You think you discovered the "truth" and all others are wrong. Conspiratist at its best ...
How you can be so sure that you have the "open" mind" ?

Conspiratists are funny people, they are 100% sure they are right and have an open mind n shit, but actually you behave exactly the same like you accuse others to do. Just from another viewpoint.

spend more time researching bitcoin and understanding it. and less time screaming insults to defend someones name.

So you hold it absolutly impossible that someone is in favour of the Segwit-solution, if he has done research and so on ? Do I get it right?