twelph (OP)
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April 17, 2013, 04:31:47 PM |
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With the advent of Feathercoins, people seem to be thinking that faster is better. What would be the benefits of having a cryto-currency that is 4x slower than Bitcoins, taking 40 minutes for the first confirmation, 5.25 million total released during the lifetime, and 4x smaller payout size for each block. Smaller blockchains in the long run would be an obvious benefit but would there be anything else?
This is just purely out of curiosity after seeing Feathercoins released recently, I know that having to wait 40 minutes for a single confirmation would probably drive people crazy.
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Trustworthy Buyers: TTBit
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"There should not be any signed int. If you've found a signed int
somewhere, please tell me (within the next 25 years please) and I'll
change it to unsigned int." -- Satoshi
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temor
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April 17, 2013, 04:34:57 PM |
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If I understand things correctly slower chains means more security, faster chains means faster confirmations.
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twelph (OP)
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April 17, 2013, 04:43:12 PM |
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If I understand things correctly slower chains means more security, faster chains means faster confirmations.
So does that mean that a single confirmation on BTC is as secure as 4 confirmations on LTC? |
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Tomatocage
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brb keeping up with the Kardashians
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April 17, 2013, 04:45:02 PM |
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Confirmation speed is to crypto-currencies as megapixels are to digital cameras.
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twelph (OP)
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April 17, 2013, 04:50:53 PM |
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Confirmation speed is to crypto-currencies as megapixels are to digital cameras.
I understand that companies are able to make cameras with much better quality pictures using lower megapixels, does this mean that the hype around confirmation speed is complete bogus? Leaving the only benefit that LTC has is scrypt? So when asics are made for LTC, it's only benefit is gone? |
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Tomatocage
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brb keeping up with the Kardashians
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April 17, 2013, 04:55:55 PM |
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I understand that companies are able to make cameras with much better quality pictures using lower megapixels, does this mean that the hype around confirmation speed is complete bogus? Leaving the only benefit that LTC has is scrypt? So when asics are made for LTC, it's only benefit is gone? It's not completely bogus, but it's not the end-all/be-all aspect that defines a chain as some people hype it up to be. |
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twelph (OP)
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April 17, 2013, 04:59:35 PM |
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I understand that companies are able to make cameras with much better quality pictures using lower megapixels, does this mean that the hype around confirmation speed is complete bogus? Leaving the only benefit that LTC has is scrypt? So when asics are made for LTC, it's only benefit is gone? It's not completely bogus, but it's not the end-all/be-all aspect that defines a chain as some people hype it up to be. I don't know if this is quantifiable in the terms I am laying out, but is there a specific ratio for how much less secure LTC is to BTC? Are four LTC confirmations as secure as a single BTC confirmation? |
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kokjo
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You are WRONG!
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April 17, 2013, 05:05:39 PM |
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you people are assuming that stuff is linear. stuff are not linear.
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves and wiser people so full of doubts." -Bertrand Russell
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crazy_rabbit
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RUM AND CARROTS: A PIRATE LIFE FOR ME
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April 17, 2013, 05:07:22 PM |
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I would be interested in a coin that confirmed every second, and maybe had a reward of .25 coins per block. Or 1 coin per block. Could we handle it?
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more or less retired.
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twelph (OP)
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April 17, 2013, 05:14:54 PM |
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you people are assuming that stuff is linear. stuff are not linear.
We are dealing with a lot of math here. If BTC and LTC had the same network size, wouldn't the difference in security obtained through a single confirmation actually be linear? Is there a way to calculate it so we can at least have a basic understanding about how secure 1 LTC confirmation is compared to 1 BTC confirmation? |
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w1R903
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April 17, 2013, 05:23:15 PM |
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I don't know if this is quantifiable in the terms I am laying out, but is there a specific ratio for how much less secure LTC is to BTC? Are four LTC confirmations as secure as a single BTC confirmation?
I've not done the specific calculations (and yes, it can be calculated), but if you look at some of the exchanges that accept Bitcoin and Litecoin (like Vircurex or btc-e, can't recall which), they require 6 confirmations for Litecoin as opposed to only 3 confirmations for Bitcoin. I think the ratio is actually probably a little higher in Bitcoins ratio than 2:1. But I don't know exactly. And the reason exchanges require so many confirmations is that they are dealing with large sums, and irreversible transactions. If you're selling something inexpensive, or a subscription that you can revoke, than 1 confirmation is probably plenty. In fact, some merchants credit your account as soon as it hits the network. I'm sure you're aware of this, but I mention it for the sake of newer people here. |
4096R/F5EA0017
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BubbleBoy
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April 17, 2013, 05:43:09 PM |
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You don't get more security with longer confirmation periods, you just get... slower confirmation. It still takes 50%+1 of the network hashrate to forcibly build a 6 confirmation chain fork, regardless of the time interval dedicated to it. The downside is that chain reorganizations and races are much more frequent at fast speeds and the network is unstable and prone to splits. A broadcasted block needs a few seconds to reach all mining nodes and during high load a very fast block discovery rate would trash the network completely.
A few minutes is probably an acceptable compromise.
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romerun
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Bitcoin is new, makes sense to hodl.
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April 17, 2013, 05:46:44 PM |
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The faster the better.
It's up to the merchant to decide how many he may need for his service and clients. Less confirmation means merchant is less able to maximize speed/risk.
I swore wtf a few times when the first confirmation came so late in BTC, whereas LTC always give me a piece of mind in this respect.
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Walter Rothbard
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April 17, 2013, 05:47:30 PM |
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If I understand things correctly slower chains means more security, faster chains means faster confirmations.
So does that mean that a single confirmation on BTC is as secure as 4 confirmations on LTC? I have yet to see a real mathematical analysis of the security per confirmation for the altcoins. A lot of times people seem to assume that if blocks are twice as fast, then 6 confirmations will come twice as fast, and you're good. But they seem to leave out the fact that in order to make those confirmations twice as fast, the difficulty had to be dropped a lot. |
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BubbleBoy
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April 17, 2013, 06:02:39 PM |
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The difficulty has dropped for everyone. So while it may be easier to mine a single block double spend block, so it is for the other miners to extend the real block. The exponential disadvantage an attacker accumulates each block is still in force, as explained in the original Satoshi paper; it does not depend on wall clock.
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