Roger Ver and Jon Matonis pushed aside now that Bitcoin is becoming mainstream

[majamalu]

As a latter-day advocate you need someone that is likable in the eyes of the masses, doesn't make them think too much, doesn't say anything too politically incorrect (or idealistic), wears a suit and tie and

The good journalists will find Matonis anyway, and the bad journalists will keep saying the usual BS, despite the likability of your spokesman.

[Luke-Jr]

Wanna know what sells Bitcoin to those in my life that come to me wanting to know about it? They can hide their money from banks and governments. That's what will sell Bitcoin to people, not the fluffy bullshit about "yes sir! so happy to be regulated" and "tax me, please!".

This is exactly the problem. If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.
If all you care about is tax evasion, you are part of the problem.

[Matthew N. Wright]

Wanna know what sells Bitcoin to those in my life that come to me wanting to know about it? They can hide their money from banks and governments. That's what will sell Bitcoin to people, not the fluffy bullshit about "yes sir! so happy to be regulated" and "tax me, please!".

This is exactly the problem. If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.
If all you care about is tax evasion, you are part of the problem.

Well, not necessarily encouraging to pay taxes, but discouraging raving fanatics who have no concern for their fellow man and just want to watch the world burn because they hate some dudes at the top. There may be a country someplace where you would actively *disagree* with paying taxes too, like North Korea for example. For the USA though? Probably better to not say "don't pay taxes" and rather just "don't do anything stupid and don't be a loud mouthed anarchist who puts everyone around them in danger".

Afterall, don't like the US? Move. I did. Staying there and not following the law because "freedom" and all that is kind of dumb. Go kill some officials and overthrow the government, or spend your life changing the laws from the inside out, but just ignoring the laws that everyone else in your country agreed to put into place is just stupid. Go someplace where those laws that make you uncomfortable don't exist, change your citizenship like so many are doing, and get it over with. Why fight something you don't want to be a part of anyway, while selfishly living off of it's rewards at the same time?

(Not talking about you Luke, actually agreeing with you)

[Severian]

[This is exactly the problem. If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.

Why? Bitcoin will succeed with or without people paying taxes.

If all you care about is tax evasion, you are part of the problem.

Bitcoin was created as a weapon and a balance against the power of banks and governments. You can use it however you like. I'll use it for its intended purpose.

Imagine a roomful of 100 people that know nothing about Bitcoin. I'll tell 50 people people why Bitcoin was created and what they can do with it. You tell 50 people they can use Bitcoin but only if they pay their taxes.

If I know humans, and I do, I'd be willing to bet some bitcoins who'd be able to sway more people to Bitcoin.

[majamalu]

If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.

Better yet, Let's put Ben Bernanke in charge of Bitcoin.

[Severian]

raving fanatics who have no concern for their fellow man

PM me. I'll invite you to my town for two days and you can post a public apology after your stay.

This is a serious offer. Put up or shut up.

If all you have left is namecalling, you ain't got shit.

Afterall, don't like the US? Move. I did.

I was wondering why the property rates went up.

[Severian]

If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.

Better yet, Let's put Ben Bernanke in charge of Bitcoin.

Fedcoin: A centrally-issued alternative to peer-to-peer currencies

[wumpus]

And Bitcoin probably might not exist but for some of the foundational work put down by Stallman.

Please don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that his work was and isn't still very important. In my opinion it is. In general, someone's work may be very important, for example a scientist may be toiling his entire life finding out some basic principle about the universe, ideas that change technology and infrastructure forever. That doesn't mean that the masses will ever acknowledge that. Stallman isn't exactly out of a job either. There's always idealists to pitch to, too, and in the long run they may be more influential.

My point was that the people that communicate something to the masses are usually not the great thinkers that came up with the idea/implementation themselves, but people that are good at communicating and 'feeling' people. And yes that's fluffy...  But that's MSM and they have a lot of short-term influence. I was just trying to explain why first-day promoters of the principle are being ignored by MSM in favor of new talking heads as popularity increases, as that was the question in the OP.

[majamalu]

If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.

Better yet, Let's put Ben Bernanke in charge of Bitcoin.

Fedcoin: A centrally-issued alternative to peer-to-peer currencies

xD  With your permission, I will translate the text into Spanish for posting it on elbitcoin.org.

[Severian]

My point was that the people that communicate something to the masses are usually not the great thinkers that came up with the idea/implementation themselves, but people that are good at communicating and 'feeling' people.

GNU didn't need the fluffy stuff. Linux didn't need the fluffy stuff. Bitcoin doesn't need the fluffy stuff. People looking to make some money or a name for themselves like to dish out the fluffy stuff. That's all fine and dandy as we're all free to make a living as long as we don't engage in force or fraud.

But let's not labor under the untrue notion that Bitcoin "needs" a PR department.

[Severian]

xD  With your permission, I will translate the text into Spanish for posting it on elbitcoin.org.

I'd be honored! Thank you.

I can assume you're the one that translated the "Bubble" article earlier? Please feel free to take anything from the site that would be of use.

[wyager]

Wanna know what sells Bitcoin to those in my life that come to me wanting to know about it? They can hide their money from banks and governments. That's what will sell Bitcoin to people, not the fluffy bullshit about "yes sir! so happy to be regulated" and "tax me, please!".

This is exactly the problem. If you want Bitcoin to succeed, you should be encouraging people to pay their taxes.
If all you care about is tax evasion, you are part of the problem.

I have to agree, being known as a way to do tax evasion will not allow legal companies to do legal business.

What, you mean like cash and Tide laundry detergent?

[Severian]

I have to agree, being known as a way to do tax evasion will not allow legal companies to do legal business.

Is that why there's no more cash?

[wumpus]

People looking to make some money or a name for themselves like to dish out the fluffy stuff. That's all fine and dandy as we're all free to make a living as long as we don't engage in force or fraud.

But let's not labor under the untrue notion that Bitcoin "needs" a PR department.

Agreed.

[Matthew N. Wright]

raving fanatics who have no concern for their fellow man

PM me. I'll invite you to my town for two days and you can post a public apology after your stay.

This is a serious offer. Put up or shut up.

If all you have left is namecalling, you ain't got shit.

Afterall, don't like the US? Move. I did.

I was wondering why the property rates went up.

Having concern for your fellow man is a lot deeper than being able to borrow sugar. Telling everyone they should fight against paying taxes will end badly for everyone involved. If your belief is that Bitcoin is a way of doing that without even talking, why don't you just do it then without even talking?

It's like saying "drugs shouldn't be illegal!" so you go shoot up in front of a police station because "drugs were designed to make you free and everyone who will do drugs will love them for that reason". Yea, but why would you want to sit in front of the police station and invite violence, when you could just get the fuck out there, or better yet, join the police force and let people go on a regular basis who do it? You're not very clever or passionate about changing things if you think change is going to happen in your lifetime by just pissing governments off. History backs me up on this one. Bitcoin isn't going to cripple governments. Bullets in their brains might, or 200 more years of evolution.

You can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar. Let the politicians know why bitcoin is good for them. Let the businesses know why it's good for them. Evolve society, then post your public apology when everything sorts itself out and you realize people like you were the reason it didn't happen sooner. </end rant>

[Severian]

You can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar.

You have exactly zero room to say anything on the topics of honey and vinegar, Matthew.

Since no apology is forthcoming from you for your descent, or maybe ascent for you, into namecalling, I guess I have nothing left to say.

[Matthew N. Wright]

You can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar.

You have exactly zero room to say anything on the topics of honey and vinegar, Matthew.

Since no apology is forthcoming from you for your descent, or maybe ascent for you, into namecalling, I guess I have nothing left to say.

I'm not here to be pleasant to you Severian, I can't hold your hand during this discussion, you need to find the points and respond to them or ignore them completely.  You're presenting unpleasant cultism into this discussion, recommending that people endanger themselves for your ideals. What is unpleasant to me is being branded as a terrorist because I use Tor, just because some other dirtbag decided to use it for illegal purposes and then brag about it. This is why we can't have nice things. Stop dragging emotion into it, it's absolutely a logical argument. You're sitting beside a pack of wolves who doesn't notice you, you're claiming we should all shout out "HEY WOLVES, WE AREN'T AFRAID OF YOU" just because "bitcoin". Why not just kill them in their sleep and keep our mouths shut? Why not just walk around the pack completely and let them starve? Why advertise?

[Severian]

Just remember it is hard to get USD into bitcoins thru exchanges, if we are known for as a tax evasions tool, it would be so much harder. Then more people will give up at that part of bitcoin.

Banks are already making it difficult. Bitfloor was the shot across the bow. Bitcoin is seen as a threat to the central banks because its continued existence undermines their reputation. There's no PR department in the world that can counter the storm of BS that's coming.

[Matthew N. Wright]

Bitfloor was the shot across the bow.

What happened to Bitfloor? I thought they were *hacked*. What does that have to do with banksters and our evil reptilian government overlords?

[blockgenesis]

Also why do you have a google group, why not create a thread on the forum for this. I hate when people need secret meeting places to discuss bitcoins, this goes against an open community.

Bitcointalk to manage a team? Seriously. This group has been announced on bitcointalk before the group was actually created.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=156364.0