Dash Sucks Dicks Dash Is Instamine

[Ayers]

Naah, just kidding...

Dash team answered about instamine:

https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/OC/Dash+Instamine+Issue+Clarification

what about the coin that were swapped from darkcoin? if they were swapped 1:1 that is like instamining, because when dash was rleased the dev instamined a shit load of coin like 1 million but i could be wrong here

[generalizethis]

Naah, just kidding...

Dash team answered about instamine:

https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/OC/Dash+Instamine+Issue+Clarification

what about the coin that were swapped from darkcoin? if they were swapped 1:1 that is like instamining, because when dash was rleased the dev instamined a shit load of coin like 1 million but i could be wrong here

Yeah, they just changed the name for xcoin to darkcoin to dash. The crappy parts remain unchanged.

[Spoetnik]

Of course. What do you think a successful store of value is supposed to do ?

So is Dash just meant to be a store of value and nothing else?

LOL this guy.

I wonder which one he is taking his.. puppet account out for a stroll.
WOWeee you are sooo clevers.
I caen see Monero'z soo'z great'z n0w!!11ONE

Everyone can see these Monero idiots are crying their eyes out and are foaming at the mouth.
Because Dash is over $50 and Monero is dropping like a rock at $12.

Seems to me the market has Spoeken huh MoneroTard's.

Fuck you.
Enjoy your FUD and your low coin prices.
Maybe quit crying or get on the Dash train before it's too late MoneroTard's ?

[bitwolf]

Spoetnik joined the dash team and of course as proud dasher doubled the fud against monero.

[irukandji]

I'm not disputing the price of a single DASH....I'm disputing the "market cap" of DASH.

I realise that.

Unfortunately your home-cooked arbitrary definitions of "marketcap" don't count.

Why do we "classify" crypto by market cap ?  Because we somehow think this is a gross measure of the "value pool" of the thing ; in other words, if new economic entities were to "take over" the entire thing, that's more or less what they would pay for it.  So that's "what it is worth".

If you "takeover a company"then you have many options. You can break up the business. You can interact with the rest of the economy, as a business.
You can change the business in may ways.
None of this is possible with a block chain.

Is Dash purely POS?
If so you could try to take it over, but only because with a purely POS coin you would control the future emission of coins, if you owned all the coins.  But then what would be the point?  You would own all the coins. ??

Blockchains were designed as decentralised systems. They aren't companies.

Also companies do issue more shares, but only if they get something back. Cash, or performance. So the market cap model makes sense.
Blockchains constantly issue more coins with nothing new being added into that system. So the equity model is inappropriate.

[iCEBREAKER]

Naah, just kidding...

Dash team answered about instamine:

https://dashpay.atlassian.net/wiki/display/OC/Dash+Instamine+Issue+Clarification

what about the coin that were swapped from darkcoin? if they were swapped 1:1 that is like instamining, because when dash was rleased the dev instamined a shit load of coin like 1 million but i could be wrong here

Yeah, they just changed the name for xcoin to darkcoin to dash. The crappy parts remain unchanged.

Fly by night mining companies do the same thing.  Evan Scamfield is running a pink sheet boiler room operation in Bitcoin space.

Mining companies burn through capital and goodwill by diluting the stock to nothing, then they change names and do a reverse split before repeating the process.

Gold miner = A Liar Standing Next to a Hole in the Ground

Dash shill = A Liar Standing Next to an Instamined Blockchain

[iamnotback]

Currencies do not necessarily have to have a total order (you don't like that, do you) or hierarchy.  

Bingo!

National currencies were/are the citizen's unit-of-account because it is very costly store your cash flow in a unit-of-account which is not the predominant unit-of-exchange.

Now that we are transitioning to B2C and P2P (C2C) globalized commerce, we need in some areas (especially intangible Internet commerce) a globalized unit-of-account and exchange.

Read that second sentence again and understand the profound implications. The coming moat is no longer national boundaries but tangible versus intangible (Industrial Age versus Knowledge Age) commerce. Also make sure you read my essay in the Economic Devastation thread.

[toknormal]

Now that we are transitioning to B2C and P2P (C2C) globalized commerce, we need in some areas (especially intangible Internet commerce) a globalized unit-of-account and exchange.

It doesn't matter what the "unit-of-account and exchange" is, or whether it's globalized or not.

The trade value of a collateralising asset is independent of how it is measured.

Prior to 2009 there were no electronically manifested collateralising assets. That is because such an asset needs to be capable of reconciling two key properties in a single trade:

 • ownership
 • possession

Subsequent to 2009, this was possible and the value will accrue accordingly.

The currency units that are used to measure that value are irrelevant.

[iamnotback]

Now that we are transitioning to B2C and P2P (C2C) globalized commerce, we need in some areas (especially intangible Internet commerce) a globalized unit-of-account and exchange.

It doesn't matter what the "unit-of-account and exchange" is, or whether it's globalized or not.

The trade value of an asset is independent of how it is measured.

I am ignoring you...

...because it is very costly store your cash flow in a unit-of-account which is not the predominant unit-of-exchange.

You go learn why. Learn about the cost of volatility. Learn why Germany's industry wanted the Euro to eliminate exchange rate risk for their European markets (and how that enslaved the PIIGS who borrowed in Euros but couldn't pay it back in devalued currency).

Please stop conflating investment with cash flow and running a business or your personal income and expenses.

The currency units that are used to measure that value are irrelevant.

Volatility is relevant. Those who have a unit-of-account which is the same as their unit-of-exchange, have 0 volatility exposure.

The higher the volatility, the greater the cost to hedge it.

There will be only one currency.

[toknormal]

You go learn why. Learn about the cost of volatility.

"Volatility" (and whether it's favourable or adverse to investors) is a relative thing.

If I'm holding bitcoin as a store of value and it protects me against the collapse of a fiat currency, than that qualifies as "volatility", but I'm on the right side of that volatility by having identified the appropriate monetary priority according to my needs.

If, on the other hand, I'm a motor car manufacturer and have a 6 month time to market, then I need to be on the other side of that "volatility" equation in order to make sure that my revenues are measured in the same units as my budget and I am able to escape the equation with a positive margin.

This is the conflict I was explaining earlier between a currency and a store of value and why if you try to be both you'll end up with a "crap crypto".

Conclusion: Currencies (unit of measure) and Stores of Value are not in conflict as long as you decouple them. They are complimentary. One is needed for commercial operations so the projects don't go bust (due to adverse effects of volatility), the other is needed for storing value BETWEEN commercial operations (accrued from beneficial effects of volatility).

Learn why Germany's industry wanted the Euro to eliminate exchange rate risk for their European markets (and how that enslaved the PIIGS who borrowed in Euros but couldn't pay it back in devalued currency)

Actually, the Euro was as much an initiative of France as any. Valery Giscard D'Estang proposed it to Germany in 1964 precisely because France was suffering from the adverse "coupling" that I've been describing between stores of value and units of measure.

At that time the post war Western world was operating under the Bretton woods system where currencies were tied to Gold regardless of whether any country had a trade surplus or deficit. This meant that national currencies were conflicted between operating as a unit of measure and store of value and had to go begging the IMF to demand that a neighbouring central bank should purchase more or less of their "currency" just so their population could make ends meet.

You say that Germany wanted to "eliminate exchange rate risk for their European markets". While that may have been a handy bonus for Germany, it wasn't the agenda that created the Euro. That was simply one of globalism - where the US wanted to consolidate Europe into a firewall against the USSR and picked Germany as the seed since it was the primary subject of the post war "carve up".

Anyway, that's all politics.

The monetary lessons are: Don't integrate a store of value with a currency and don't integrate a payments system with either of the other two

[iamnotback]

Learn why Germany's industry wanted the Euro to eliminate exchange rate risk for their European markets (and how that enslaved the PIIGS who borrowed in Euros but couldn't pay it back in devalued currency)

Actually, the Euro was as much an initiative of France as any.

Agreed Charles de Gaulle was the fundamental leader of the creation of the 5th republic and his thesis was France (Europe) should be a super power on par with the USA, and not a slave to the USA. So he played right into the trap of Germany's mercantilism.

You may be correct there were other global political players and incentives. I haven't studied it extensively, just an hour or so of googling and reading.

As I have stated before, when the Euro was being planned, the commission in charge attended our World Economic Conference in London. I warned them that the Euro would fail unless the plan consolidated all the debts of member states. They said they understood the problem, but that the European people would never vote for that plan and so they wanted to get the currency through first and deal with the debt later.

That Phase II never came and as a result, as the euro then rallied from 80 cents to the dollar to about $1.60, all PREVIOUS debt of  member states DOUBLED in real cost. Joining the euro effectively destroyed Southern Europe and the politicians still cannot figure this out. It is as simple as you borrowed a foreign currency to buy your house and then that currency double in price. You now owed twice the amount in your home currency.

Further explanation which also addresses the unit-of-account = unit-of-exchange point:

QUESTION:  Hello, I do not understand what Martin say about the fact that the Greek debt doubled when it changed into euro. Indeed, if the currency is twice the value of the old one then all your debt will double as Martin said. However all your assets will double in value too. So it is the same situation as before. I may miss something, could you please explain me what I am missing ?
Best regards,

ANSWER: Yes, private assets rose in value in Southern Europe as the euro rose from 80 cents to $1.60. However, this tended to produce deflation, not inflation as prices rose eliminating competition for tourism etc. reducing sales. The point about the public debt doubling was the fact that this was previous debt, not current, and government has no real performing assets. To service the debt that doubled, they also then began to raise taxes more aggressively and this then was much like strip-mining the economy. Servicing the previous debt increased dramatically reducing the ability to continue spending on various sectors as previous debt servicing was increased.

Germany benefited from the Euro because they were manufacturing products and selling them into Europe and did not have to worry about currency fluctuations. I helped the Japanese to sell their products globally by showing them that they had to price their products in the local currency and then take the FX risk home to manage. They beat the Germans who were pricing their cars always in Deutsche-marks so a Porsche doubled in value in dollar terms between 1970 and 1980 just due to currency – not inflation. The movement of creating a euro was to eliminate currency risk so the German manufacturers could sell their products throughout Europe.

Greece’s top three main industries are tourism, shipping, and industrial products. By joining the Euro, Greece lost the attraction of a cheap holiday for tourists and shipping prices rose. Greece is nowhere near attaining those manufacturing characteristics, and is often one of the smallest in this regard compared to Germany, Japan, and China. However, the Greek-owned fleet of ships remains where it has been for a very long time, at the TOP of the global ranking of shipowning nations. Joining the Eurozone has hurt Greek shipping increasing its cost and opening the door to competition. China is moving upwards rapidly in shipping, and potentially could overtake both Greece and Japan (the second largest) to become number one shipowner within a decade. Greece has not benefited from joining the

Eurozone and this has been the greatest myth which has hurt the Greek people tremendously.

European tourism began to move outside the Eurozone for vacations because it was cheaper. Greece has an economy with a public sector accounting for about 40% of GDP and with per capita GDP about two-thirds that of the leading Eurozone economies, this has contributed greatly to its debt crisis. Tourism provides 18% of GDP, so joining the Euro was a complete disaster for tourism and when the government is 40% of GDP and produces nothing to export, the debt crisis simply escalates. The likelihood of Greece have to exit the Eurozone is growing tremendously by the day.

[toknormal]

Further explanation which also addresses the unit-of-account = unit-of-exchange point:

Armstrong article

Thanks. Will read with interest.

[dinofelis]

Currencies do not necessarily have to have a total order (you don't like that, do you) or hierarchy.  

Bingo!

National currencies were/are the citizen's unit-of-account because it is very costly store your cash flow in a unit-of-account which is not the predominant unit-of-exchange.

Now that we are transitioning to B2C and P2P (C2C) globalized commerce, we need in some areas (especially intangible Internet commerce) a globalized unit-of-account and exchange.

Read that second sentence again and understand the profound implications. The coming moat is no longer national boundaries but tangible versus intangible (Industrial Age versus Knowledge Age) commerce. Also make sure you read my essay in the Economic Devastation thread.

I fully agree that commercially-knit-together communities do not need necessarily to be *geographically* close (even though for most of commerce, that is still the case: the plumber, the groceries, the bread, the car repair, the doctor, the dentist, the leisure.... much commerce remains local).  But usually these communities are not very big even if spread out.  Maybe I trade international post stamps, but the exchanging of post stamps is not related to the community of violins trading internationally.

I very rarely buy stuff abroad directly.  It happens.  Most of the time, I use products that have of course partly foreign origin, and most of the time when I buy "foreign made" stuff, I use a local retailer.  I very rarely buy my oranges directly in South Africa.  I buy oranges in a local grocery shop, who got them there from Morocco or South Africa.  But that's not my problem.  I pay the grocery shop holder in the local currency.   He probably needs to exchange money to buy the oranges.  It is his business.

[Spoetnik]

Spoetnik joined the dash team and of course as proud dasher doubled the fud against monero.

I bet my let nut i know who you are.. and no that is not a good thing.
And yeah i do enjoy tasting the Monero Tard's tears.  

Since i have never nor will i buy any "anon" coins the price is of little significance to me.
And i say that knowing Ryan at Bittrex etc will know if i am bullshitting looking at my trade history.
I have about $25 worth of LTC and i'd just as soon give them away.
I follow crypto hoping to see a turning point where things will get better.

Unlike 90% of you that couldn't care less and are here to buy garbage with REAL MONEY

..fer teh ROI'z

OR ? Like Mr. Wolf here who is a hired gun who will do *ANYTHING* code wise.. to get paid.
Because as he said.. "He needs to get paid"
For what ? doesn't matter.. he *NEEDS* to get paid.

I would not take the jobs working on shitcoins for bucks.. because i have integrity.

[iamnotback]

@dinofelis how many social networking apps and accounts do you actively use? Have you used WeChat extensively?

https://steemit.com/life/@sweetsssj/steemit-or-livestreaming-i-choose-steemit-steemit-steemit
https://steemit.com/life/@sweetsssj/wechat-china-s-all-in-one-version-of-whatsapp-whatsapp <--- pay attention to why the West requires a decentralized WeChat!
https://steemit.com/life/@sweetsssj/the-insiders-story-on-china-s-newest-occupation-purchasing-agents

I think you are out-of-touch with what most Millennials do with their time. Many now earn an income online such as for example getting paid for English tutoring on cam, being tipped for doing something outlandish on cam, etc..

For example, in app purchases are a big deal, such as game upgrades (buy a special power to reach the next level, etc).

Google "gamification Farmville" and learn a new field.

That is why I don't think you understand why Bitcoin already had great utility. It enabled me to pay my bills (from funds I had received from people all over the world and had stored in Poloniex or localbitcoins or even a Blockchain.info wallet) without leaving my computer (because I hate to lose hours out in the traffic of SE Asia). If I could, I would purchase everything (even groceries) from my computer.

Here in the Philippines there is so much C2C going on with people buying products from China via dhgate.com, aliexpress.com (and other similar sites) and then reselling it on Facebook, taking COD, bank deposit, and padala (e.g. Western Union) payments. But crypto would be much better for them.

Does the dino in your name mean dinosaur.

[dinofelis]

@dinofelis how many social networking apps and accounts do you actively use? Have you used WeChat extensively?

No, I don't use centralized social networking things, apart from discussion forums.  I don't even use facebook or twitter. 

I think you are out-of-touch with what most Millennials do with their time. Many now earn an income online such as for example getting paid for English tutoring on cam, being tipped for doing something outlandish on cam, etc..

For example, in app purchases are a big deal, such as game upgrades (buy a special power to reach the next level, etc).

Google "gamification Farmville" and learn a new field.

Sure.  Soccer too is a big business.  Who cares.
But that doesn't contradict what I aim at.  You can have "millennials-gamer-coin" if you want to.  They can exchange it for "your-town-grocery-coin" if they need groceries.

That is why I don't think you understand why Bitcoin already had great utility. It enabled me to pay my bills (from funds I had received from people all over the world and had stored in Poloniex or localbitcoins or even a Blockchain.info wallet) without leaving my computer (because I hate to lose hours out in the traffic of SE Asia). If I could, I would purchase everything (even groceries) from my computer.

Of course, but that is a local economy.

Does the dino in your name mean dinosaur.

A dinofelis was a sabertooth tiger.  Yes, he's dead now, if that's what you mean

[iamnotback]

But that doesn't contradict what I aim at.  You can have "millennials-gamer-coin" if you want to.  They can exchange it for "your-town-grocery-coin" if they need groceries.

It doesn't work that way due to the costs of foreign unit-of-accounts, only one will win.

If the NWO fiat debt usury industrial age coin wins, you die in a totalitarian dark age.

Any way, you have bigger problems to worry about:

Drug resistant fungis : https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2017/03/10/deadly-fungal-infection-that-doctors-have-been-fearing-now-reported-in-u-s/?utm_term=.1156dd9e7f5b

The next pandemic (2019ish) will be super-bug multi-drug resistant pathogens.

The one you reported has the key attributes (kills 60%, survives for months on skin and weeks on bed posts). OMG!  

[iamnotback]

@toknormal this is sort of related to what we've been discussing:

Defeating Gresham's Law

Gresham's law seems to imply that transactions would driven away from the deflationary currency to an inflationary (debased) currency, yet this would in theory drive the exchange value of the deflationary currency downwards (given demand to sell and the loss of utility of the currency which loses its crucial unit-of-exchange and concomitant public confidence attribute) which would thus counteract Gresham's law while also decreasing the rate of reduction of money supply (due to lower transaction rate, i.e. velocity of money) and drive transaction demand back to the deflationary currency. So there appears to be a dynamic equilibrium wherein the deflationary currency remains the choice for transactions. Also there is the technical issue that I don't think it is possible to design a decentralized consensus blockchain without burning transaction fees. Thus there would be no inflationary currency which is decentralized as an alternative. Even if consumers decide they don't mind using a centralized vehicle for transacting and retain the decentralized blockchain only for settlement, the problem is they then can't get decentralized publishing and smart contracts without using the decentralized currency. Gresham's law defeated. Lightning Networks defeated. Tada.