The Lunacy of BTU Supporters

[FiendCoin]

BTU supporters refuse to acknowledge China mining centralization and that a few elite Chinese control majority of BTU hash. They seem to think this is what Satoshi wanted, Chinese centralized mining and control over Bitcoin. When did decentralization become centralized? They also have a fanatical belief in Core/Blockstream conspiracy theories such as forcing people to use LN. As if no other company can create a side-chain for off-chain transactions. They also believe ALL Core contributors; more than 100 people are all conspiring with Blockstream to centralize Bitcoin and usurp control for themselves, while ignoring the centralization already taking place in China. The Chinese already control most of the mining equipment production, the actual mining of Bitcoin and now possibly via BTU the development and direction of Bitcoin. BUT, BTU supporters don’t see a problem there, no conspiracy, just the conspiracy with Blockstream…

The conclusions I have drawn from these lunatics is that they would rather see Bitcoin burn than admit the flaws with BTU. Their hate for Core is such that they would rather give Bitcoin over to the Chinese and see it destroyed than find an equitable solution elsewhere. Their mentality is BTU or bust, as if no other solution to scaling can exist. The truth is, Bitcoin is probably doomed. With a few “elite” miners making the decisions for the majority. I thought Bitcoin was supposed to be different? Sounds a lot like every other system we have.

The scaling debate reminds me of how Trump and every republican gets elected in the US. Poor uneducated white voters vote them into office believing the lies told by these wealthy people with wealthier friends, “We know what’s best, trust us, we have your best interests at heart.” The same white voters have been told for decades by republicans that “liberal” “left” “Democrat” are bad words and nothing good comes from them. These same dumb white voters didn’t know that “Obamacare” was a demonizing term created by republicans to fool them about the ACA. They didn’t understand that Obamacare was the ACA and providing them free or low cost healthcare, which they liked. Now they are horrified the republicans they voted into office want to get rid of their healthcare.

The sheeple have been manipulated since the dawn of time by the elite to support ideas that goes against their own self-interests because of irrational hatred the elite create in the sheeple’s minds. Keep voting republicans into office, keep believing in the wealthy elite. They will make America (and Bitcoin) great again and your lives will improve, except it never does. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results - Albert Einstein

Same kind of situation with the scaling debate, minus the voting (the little guy doesn’t have a voice in Bitcoin). You can whisper, you can talk, you SCREAM at the top of your lungs but only the elite miners have a say in what happens, as designed apparently by Satoshi or at least that’s what BTU supporters will have you believe.

Mental illness is no joke. You cannot have a rational discussion with irrational people. Arguing is pointless. For further proof, visit /r/btc if you dare!

Note: Maybe not ALL BTU supporters are lunatics, some are paid shills and others maybe lacking basic reasoning skills?

[1714508376]

1714508376

[quake313]

Not sure if this is an essay or rant 

Now do one on Blockstream supporters lol

[davis196]

So this BTU thing causes the bitcoin price to decrease.
I`ve never been vary familiar with all this block size,scaling,LN,blocktream shit,but it`s obvious that some people want to profit from destroying bitcoin and replacing it with some fake altcoin pretending to be btc.

[Xester]

BTU supporters refuse to acknowledge China mining centralization and that a few elite Chinese control majority of BTU hash. They seem to think this is what Satoshi wanted, Chinese centralized mining and control over Bitcoin. When did decentralization become centralized? They also have a fanatical belief in Core/Blockstream conspiracy theories such as forcing people to use LN. As if no other company can create a side-chain for off-chain transactions. They also believe ALL Core contributors; more than 100 people are all conspiring with Blockstream to centralize Bitcoin and usurp control for themselves, while ignoring the centralization already taking place in China. The Chinese already control most of the mining equipment production, the actual mining of Bitcoin and now possibly via BTU the development and direction of Bitcoin. BUT, BTU supporters don’t see a problem there, no conspiracy, just the conspiracy with Blockstream…

The conclusions I have drawn from these lunatics is that they would rather see Bitcoin burn than admit the flaws with BTU. Their hate for Core is such that they would rather give Bitcoin over to the Chinese and see it destroyed than find an equitable solution elsewhere. Their mentality is BTU or bust, as if no other solution to scaling can exist. The truth is, Bitcoin is probably doomed. With a few “elite” miners making the decisions for the majority. I thought Bitcoin was supposed to be different? Sounds a lot like every other system we have.

The scaling debate reminds me of how Trump and every republican gets elected in the US. Poor uneducated white voters vote them into office believing the lies told by these wealthy people with wealthier friends, “We know what’s best, trust us, we have your best interests at heart.” The same white voters have been told for decades by republicans that “liberal” “left” “Democrat” are bad words and nothing good comes from them. These same dumb white voters didn’t know that “Obamacare” was a demonizing term created by republicans to fool them about the ACA. They didn’t understand that Obamacare was the ACA and providing them free or low cost healthcare, which they liked. Now they are horrified the republicans they voted into office want to get rid of their healthcare.

The sheeple have been manipulated since the dawn of time by the elite to support ideas that goes against their own self-interests because of irrational hatred the elite create in the sheeple’s minds. Keep voting republicans into office, keep believing in the wealthy elite. They will make America (and Bitcoin) great again and your lives will improve, except it never does. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results - Albert Einstein

Same kind of situation with the scaling debate, minus the voting (the little guy doesn’t have a voice in Bitcoin). You can whisper, you can talk, you SCREAM at the top of your lungs but only the elite miners have a say in what happens, as designed apparently by Satoshi or at least that’s what BTU supporters will have you believe.

Mental illness is no joke. You cannot have a rational discussion with irrational people. Arguing is pointless. For further proof, visit /r/btc if you dare!

Note: Maybe not ALL BTU supporters are lunatics, some are paid shills and others maybe lacking basic reasoning skills?

Your whole write-up is good but there are just things that I would like to comment. The flaw that I have seen was the relation of BTU and core developers to the voters of America. That is quite a troublesome analogy, cryptocurrency is not politics thus its better if we stick to the current bitcoin issue than comparing it to the election mentality of the people. You have made a good point on taking up the bad side of Bitcoin Unlimited but the people behind it are not dumb and they are not the only ones who are trying to make bitcoin centralized but also the core developers. Both parties are doing it and thus nobody is going to let go of their pride and adopt a solution.

[ebliever]

I do agree that it is rather bizarre that BU supporters talk a lot about decentralization, but they are centralizing a great deal of power in the hands of a few mining pool operators and major miners, and putting miners in control of protocol options like blocksize rather than the dev community with inputs from everyone. That's a mistake. Miners are not a neutral party in the bitcoin ecosystem, and putting them in charge disempowers everyone else.

[FiendCoin]

Your whole write-up is good but there are just things that I would like to comment. The flaw that I have seen was the relation of BTU and core developers to the voters of America. That is quite a troublesome analogy, cryptocurrency is not politics thus its better if we stick to the current bitcoin issue than comparing it to the election mentality of the people. You have made a good point on taking up the bad side of Bitcoin Unlimited but the people behind it are not dumb and they are not the only ones who are trying to make bitcoin centralized but also the core developers. Both parties are doing it and thus nobody is going to let go of their pride and adopt a solution.

The problem is politics have crept into Bitcoin and so has power centralizing in the hands of an elite few. I'm not advocating core but if I had to chose between them I would pick core over BTU any day. Personally, I'd rather see another solution everyone could get behind and the lead Devs not be affiliated with a company that could cause conflicts of interest.

[FiendCoin]

I do agree that it is rather bizarre that BU supporters talk a lot about decentralization, but they are centralizing a great deal of power in the hands of a few mining pool operators and major miners, and putting miners in control of protocol options like blocksize rather than the dev community with inputs from everyone. That's a mistake. Miners are not a neutral party in the bitcoin ecosystem, and putting them in charge disempowers everyone else.

Miners will never back a proposal that could cost them revenue in the future, nor should they as a for profit business. This is exactly why they should NOT determine what innovations make it into Bitcoin.

[kiklo]

I do agree that it is rather bizarre that BU supporters talk a lot about decentralization, but they are centralizing a great deal of power in the hands of a few mining pool operators and major miners, and putting miners in control of protocol options like blocksize rather than the dev community with inputs from everyone. That's a mistake. Miners are not a neutral party in the bitcoin ecosystem, and putting them in charge disempowers everyone else.

Funny,  

That none of you seem to realize,
that ALL PoW coins are SUBJECT to 51% Control by its miners,
Guess none of you ever bothered to read Satochi's WhitePaper on BTC.  

Also interesting that you are all so stupid that you don't realize that segwit & LN gives Blockstream complete control of BTC
by allowing them the Power to LOCK every single BTC in place onchain where no onchain transactions could take place for those coins and deny the transactions fee to the miners, ergo forcing them out of business. (Which is a stated Goal of keeping all transactions offline, if you read the LN Whitepaper.)

But hell , as long as you make a few bucks who cares if you sell the Future generations down the river, by letting blockstream and the bankers control BTC.
I guess that is why they say , YOU CAN"T FIX STUPID!


 

FYI:
The above is why the miners will never activate segwit.
Segwit=> DeadWIT

[Hazir]

That none of you seem to realize,
that ALL PoW coins are SUBJECT to 51% Control by its miners,
Guess none of you ever bothered to read Satochi's WhitePaper on BTC.  

And you think that PoS coins are amazing and flawless? What about "nothing at stake attack"? PoS is essentially flawed by this.
I guess that community/miners might start to regret now, that they ditched SegWit, we could have easy and safe upgrade.
Because of FUD caused by hard fork drama price of bitcoin is crumbling.

[kiklo]

That none of you seem to realize,
that ALL PoW coins are SUBJECT to 51% Control by its miners,
Guess none of you ever bothered to read Satochi's WhitePaper on BTC.  

And you think that PoS coins are amazing and flawless? What about "nothing at stake attack"? PoS is essentially flawed by this.
I guess that community/miners might start to regret now, that they ditched SegWit, we could have easy and safe upgrade.
Because of FUD caused by hard fork drama price of bitcoin is crumbling.

PoS nothing at stake is just another lie made up by G.Maxwell to fool the stupid. (He is very good at tricking the below 115 IQs.)
I cover why it is a lie and a non issue for PoS coins
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1709776.msg17135430#msg17135430
and
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1709776.msg17136990#msg17136990


You can whine at me all day , and every community member can run a segwit node,
and guess what it won't matter because the miners are the only one with the 51% control to make the changes.
Maybe you should read Satochi & LN whitepapers so you won't be so stupid.  


 

FYI:
Segwit /DeadWit needs 95% to activate.
BTU has 30% of mining support. (Segwit has less support than BTU now.)
100-30 = 70%  
Segwit has failed , and can never be activated. That is not FUD, That is MATH!!


FYI2:
BTC price was less than $500 in May of 2016, I guess you can't recognize a price bubble either.
BTU would fix BTC transactions capacity problem and lower those ever growing transactions fee, as of now it is pricing itself out of the markets.
IE:  What others are saying.

let me chime in my 2cents.

the beef is with hitting some BTC bench mark, right?

forget about it.

trade LTC, Doge, and UNO (if we ever come back online).

All 3 are due for a swing up.  BTC is looking south.

BTC markets cost too much to trade.

[DomainMagnate]

I am of the opinion that BTU will die a natural death very soon.Why would someone trust a centralized crypto as it defeat the very purpose of having a independent currency.
Fall in btc price is not due to BTU as some people like to believe.It is nothing new to bitcoin.

[Videodrome]

I am of the opinion that BTU will die a natural death very soon.Why would someone trust a centralized crypto as it defeat the very purpose of having a independent currency.
Fall in btc price is not due to BTU as some people like to believe.It is nothing new to bitcoin.

BTU is another coin so were is the problem?

in only one move we can fuck off all the chinese miner, is a good news guys.

[amacar2]

Fall in btc price is not due to BTU as some people like to believe.It is nothing new to bitcoin.

Current dump on price seems to be a panic reaction due to FUD about bitcoin going to have hard fork created by bitcoin unlimited. BTU is just another alt and it may get listed in few trading platform as an alt but not as an bitcoin.

[Tyrantt]

Whoa, whoa I've been seeing a lot of BTU around and I have no clue what is it and what does it mean. From the OPs post, bitcoin is becoming centralized in China and the whole bitcoin is falling apart due to the elite controlling the bitcoin mining? Can someone explain it shortly? Thanks.

But damn, don't be so salty that Hillary/Bernie lost.

[Tigggger]

I am of the opinion that BTU will die a natural death very soon.

I concur, I think stalemate or a completely new proposal will win as I don't think either side is currently ready to compromise, and neither have the support currently to force through their version. It's impossible for segwit/ln to get 95% as it only takes one of the top ten pools to block. I suppose BU has an outside chance, but I don't see them doing anything until at least 75% are in favour that seems extremely unlikely and probably not even then.

Why would someone trust a centralized crypto as it defeat the very purpose of having a independent currency.

It's already centralised, sorry to break it to you.

[naughty1]

This is a very hot topic and is worth discussing at the present time. We need to give our own ideas, and learn the information. We need the right decision to develop bitcoin, I do not consider bitcoin core or bitcoin unlimit, what I need is its development. It has reached its peak and it needs to go up further, BTU appears to have a great influence on the BTC, the current value of the BTC severely reduced, it is difficult to imagine what will happen next. So I want to hear from you guys.

[jonald_fyookball]

That none of you seem to realize,
that ALL PoW coins are SUBJECT to 51% Control by its miners,
Guess none of you ever bothered to read Satochi's WhitePaper on BTC.  

And you think that PoS coins are amazing and flawless? What about "nothing at stake attack"? PoS is essentially flawed by this.
I guess that community/miners might start to regret now, that they ditched SegWit, we could have easy and safe upgrade.
Because of FUD caused by hard fork drama price of bitcoin is crumbling.

PoS nothing at stake is just another lie made up by G.Maxwell to fool the stupid. (He is very good at tricking the below 115 IQs.)
I cover why it is a lie and a non issue for PoS coins
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1709776.msg17135430#msg17135430
and
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1709776.msg17136990#msg17136990


You can whine at me all day , and every community member can run a segwit node,
and guess what it won't matter because the miners are the only one with the 51% control to make the changes.
Maybe you should read Satochi & LN whitepapers so you won't be so stupid.  


 

FYI:
Segwit /DeadWit needs 95% to activate.
BTU has 30% of mining support. (Segwit has less support than BTU now.)
100-30 = 70%  
Segwit has failed , and can never be activated. That is not FUD, That is MATH!!


FYI2:
BTC price was less than $500 in May of 2016, I guess you can't recognize a price bubble either.
BTU would fix BTC transactions capacity problem and lower those ever growing transactions fee, as of now it is pricing itself out of the markets.
IE:  What others are saying.

let me chime in my 2cents.

the beef is with hitting some BTC bench mark, right?

forget about it.

trade LTC, Doge, and UNO (if we ever come back online).

All 3 are due for a swing up.  BTC is looking south.

BTC markets cost too much to trade.

I've researched this extensively.  Nothing at Stake issue is real and a huge problem for any PoS to scale big imo. 

[becoin]

Certainly, I don't mind if someone decides to give me BUcoins for free. Whatever their price may be after the fork I'll sell them and increase my BTC stash.

[franky1]

Certainly, I don't mind if someone decides to give me BUcoins for free. Whatever their price may be after the fork I'll sell them and increase my BTC stash.

knowing any dynamic proposition isnt going to activate unless majority..

leaving core to even become dynamic too or be the ones banning nodes to keep their minority alive.. your statement should also read as

"Certainly, I don't mind if someone decides to give me SWcoins for free. Whatever their price may be after the fork I'll sell them and increase my BTC stash."

[Kprawn]

This is not about Bitcoin Core or BU anymore... This is turning into a pissing contest to see who will be right. This whole thing started way before

BU were on the scene. All the craziness started with supposed censorship on /r/Bitcoin when XT were still the issue and it turned into something

more sinister. Even if Core came up with the perfect solution.... they will not get support from these people. This is being blown out of proportion

by some people paying shills to bad mouth Core.