♠ Bit777.com ♠ WE ACCEPT DOGE! Play with BTC/LTC/NMC/PPC/XPM/FTC/DRK/DOGE!

[Hfleer]

Special Promo:

30% Refund on all deposits between today and Sunday night!

If you win, you keep all the winnings, if you lose, you get 30%!

The max refund amount is 5btc.

All refunds will be processed Monday morning.

Nice, i'll have to try this.

[dooglus]

Special Promo:

30% Refund on all deposits between today and Sunday night!

If you win, you keep all the winnings, if you lose, you get 30% back!

The max refund amount is 5btc.

All refunds will be processed Monday morning.

Can you clarify how that works please?

If I deposit 10 BTC, make bets totalling 50 BTC and while doing so get my balance up to 20 BTC, but end up with a balance of 9 BTC, what do I get?

My guess is that you refund 30% of my net loss, ie. 30% of 1 BTC = 0.30 BTC.  Is that right?

Or do I have to lose my whole deposit to qualify for the 30% back?

[bit777]

30% of possible net loss yes. Only deposits between today and Sunday night count. If you already have a balance with us, that balance wouldn't count.

[scalar33]

This one seems shady, would like to see provably fair.

[bit777]

This one seems shady, would like to see provably fair.

We are working on that but it isn't as simple or fast as it sounds. We are preparing a major upgrade that will include provably fair and a few other important options. In the meantime, we welcome the idea of an expert from the forum to review our software, so we can put the "shady" assumption aside.

[dooglus]

We are working on that but it isn't as simple or fast as it sounds. We are preparing a major upgrade that will include provably fair and a few other important options. In the meantime, we welcome the idea of an expert from the forum to review our software, so we can put the "shady" assumption aside.

I logged in today, and was very impressed with the new (to me) video you have embedded on your site.  I don't know what kind of a review can be done by looking at the cllent-side software.  The shadiness (if there is any) won't be happening in the client.  The random numbers are generated server-side, and that's (presumably) unavailable for review.

Really the only way of proving there's no foul play going on is to arrange for there to be some way that you can prove that you can't possibly be picking the outcome after the player has told you what they're betting on.  Even better is if there's some way the player can also affect the outcome in an unpredictable way, so that the house itself doesn't know what each spin will be.  See https://bitzino.com/about/fair for a good description of how this is possible, and https://techblog.bitzino.com/2012-06-30-provably-fair-shuffling-through-cryptography.html for more in-depth coverage of the same concepts.

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

So how do I get the refund? My account is gladoscc. Address is in my sig.

Q: Why do only non provably fair casinos offer bonus supposedly >EV?
A: Because they're probably rigged.

[bit777]

Dooglus, yes we are aware of the concept. The issue is that we have 50 games and each has to get both its flash and server modified to submit and exchange extra values (the seeds and hashes). We have already arranged it, but it is a time consuming process that will take its toll. Truth be told, we came from the real money gambling world, and noone has ever heard of provably fair over there, so we came unprepared. In order to become competitive with the other establishments we WILL implement it, we will not have it any other way.

TradeFortress you will get your refund Monday morning. To address your mini QA session. Any casino, both online and land-based offers bonuses, go to Vegas and you will get $75 to play on slots, go to the Borgata in AC and you will get $25 for Blackjack. Same is for online casinos. Go to any online casino and you will see bonuses up to 2-300%. A good example would be: http://www.32red.com/ They are a publicly traded company on the London Stock Exchange and are highly regulated (and not rigged). They offer 32GBP deposit bonus on 10GBP, meaning 320%. So how is that non -EV for them? They look at the long-term play. Bonuses are only means to attract players. Every player has its cost or as it is called CPA (cost per acquisition). In 32red's case a player costs them 145GBP after all the bonuses and the affiliate commissions, and the average Net profit from a player they get is 472GBP. So they have close to 300% return on their acquisition investment for each player they bring. This varies on a per country basis, and the marketing channels used so it is not exact science. I am giving an example of how a negative EV for the casino is actually positive. This is the common practice in the gambling industry.

So in reality the question should be not why we are giving a bonus, but why no other bitcoin casino does it. 

In the meantime, if anyone has any doubts of the integrity of the software, you can contact our software provider, or we can arrange it together, and review the software. They literally showcase it on a daily basis.

We have the best software, the most games, the largest experience in the field, the best bonuses, and the best CS. Once we have the provably fair so all you guys can sleep safe...why would anyone play anywhere else? 

[grue]

Special Promo:

30% Refund on all deposits between today and Sunday night!

If you win, you keep all the winnings, if you lose, you get 30% back!

The max refund amount is 5btc.

I'm still confused by this.

If I deposit 10 BTC, and the following happens:

bet 5 BTC, won 10 BTC (NET +5)
bet 5 BTC, lost 5 BTC (NET -5)

my end balance would still be 10 BTC, a net loss of 0 BTC. Do I get 0 BTC back (because the refund only applies to net loss during the entire period), or do I get 1.5 BTC back (because 30% refund is applied on every game that is lost).

[bit777]

Total Deposits minus (Account Balance + Total Withdrawals)

This accounts for the period of Thursday morning to Sunday 11.59pm. We will refund 30% of whatever net loss you might have during that period if you have any.

I hope that explains it.

[dooglus]

Can you clarify how that works please?

If I deposit 10 BTC, make bets totalling 50 BTC and while doing so get my balance up to 20 BTC, but end up with a balance of 9 BTC, what do I get?

My guess is that you refund 30% of my net loss, ie. 30% of 1 BTC = 0.30 BTC.  Is that right?

Or do I have to lose my whole deposit to qualify for the 30% back?

So just to make it perfectly clear, when I deposit 10 BTC, win and get up to 20 BTC then lose and go down to 9 BTC, all within the promotional period, do you give me back 0.3 BTC, because my deposit was inside the period, and my overall loss in the period was 1 BTC?

A simple "yes" will satisfy me. 

This accounts for the period of Thursday morning to Sunday 11.59pm

I guess specifying a timezone might be helpful too...

[bit777]

Yes, dooglus.

Time: Thursday 9am EST - Sunday 11:59pm EST

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

Dooglus, yes we are aware of the concept. The issue is that we have 50 games and each has to get both its flash and server modified to submit and exchange extra values (the seeds and hashes). We have already arranged it, but it is a time consuming process that will take its toll. Truth be told, we came from the real money gambling world, and noone has ever heard of provably fair over there, so we came unprepared. In order to become competitive with the other establishments we WILL implement it, we will not have it any other way.

TradeFortress you will get your refund Monday morning. To address your mini QA session. Any casino, both online and land-based offers bonuses, go to Vegas and you will get $75 to play on slots, go to the Borgata in AC and you will get $25 for Blackjack. Same is for online casinos. Go to any online casino and you will see bonuses up to 2-300%. A good example would be: http://www.32red.com/ They are a publicly traded company on the London Stock Exchange and are highly regulated (and not rigged). They offer 32GBP deposit bonus on 10GBP, meaning 320%. So how is that non -EV for them? They look at the long-term play. Bonuses are only means to attract players. Every player has its cost or as it is called CPA (cost per acquisition). In 32red's case a player costs them 145GBP after all the bonuses and the affiliate commissions, and the average Net profit from a player they get is 472GBP. So they have close to 300% return on their acquisition investment for each player they bring. This varies on a per country basis, and the marketing channels used so it is not exact science. I am giving an example of how a negative EV for the casino is actually positive. This is the common practice in the gambling industry.

So in reality the question should be not why we are giving a bonus, but why no other bitcoin casino does it. 

In the meantime, if anyone has any doubts of the integrity of the software, you can contact our software provider, or we can arrange it together, and review the software. They literally showcase it on a daily basis.

We have the best software, the most games, the largest experience in the field, the best bonuses, and the best CS. Once we have the provably fair so all you guys can sleep safe...why would anyone play anywhere else? 

They have play through requirements, which I believe makes it still -EV. You're offering a significant +EV bonus.

[bit777]

I don't see how you calculate it, but if that is the case, then you should seriously consider taking advantage of it.   

[bit777]

Since we haven't implemented a public payout history yet (which we will do as we see you guys are going crazy about these statistics), here are the payouts to players we did for the past week:

Unique Id   Event Date                    Type        Amount   Status
1753   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 11:00 PM   BitCoin   8.00   Completed
1749   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 06:17 PM   BitCoin   5.00   Completed
1748   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 05:37 PM   BitCoin   5.00   Completed
1747   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 05:07 PM   BitCoin   40.00   Completed
1745   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 02:02 PM   BitCoin   61.00   Completed
1742   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 09:45 AM   BitCoin   30.00   Completed
1737   Fri, May 24, 2013 at 01:11 AM   BitCoin   114.00   Completed
1733   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 11:27 PM   BitCoin   338.20   Completed
1729   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 10:31 PM   BitCoin   2.00   Completed
1723   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 06:54 PM   BitCoin   56.00   Completed
1719   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 06:18 PM   BitCoin   54.00   Completed
1715   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 03:44 PM   BitCoin   1.00   Completed
1709   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 02:42 PM   BitCoin   3.00   Completed
1707   Thu, May 23, 2013 at 02:27 PM   BitCoin   60.00   Completed
1703   Wed, May 22, 2013 at 10:54 PM   BitCoin   6.00   Completed
1443   Wed, May 22, 2013 at 06:11 AM   BitCoin   100.00   Completed
1442   Wed, May 22, 2013 at 06:10 AM   BitCoin   18.00   Completed
882   Mon, May 20, 2013 at 03:00 PM   BitCoin   4.00   Completed
879   Mon, May 20, 2013 at 12:33 PM   BitCoin   1.00   Completed
877   Mon, May 20, 2013 at 06:25 AM   BitCoin   2.00   Completed
864   Sun, May 19, 2013 at 06:55 PM   BitCoin   50.00   Completed
858   Sun, May 19, 2013 at 12:50 PM   BitCoin   30.00   Completed
844   Sun, May 19, 2013 at 12:39 AM   BitCoin   15.00   Completed
842   Sun, May 19, 2013 at 12:06 AM   BitCoin   2.00   Completed
841   Sun, May 19, 2013 at 12:05 AM   BitCoin   26.00   Completed
838   Sat, May 18, 2013 at 10:21 PM   BitCoin   11.00   Completed
833   Sat, May 18, 2013 at 03:12 PM   BitCoin   1.00   Completed
823   Fri, May 17, 2013 at 08:18 PM   BitCoin   4.00   Completed
814   Fri, May 17, 2013 at 01:27 AM   BitCoin   11.00   Completed

Total: 1058.20 (10.5820 BTC)

Total payouts since opening (24th April): 3068.20 (30.6820BTC)

We can't thank you enough for trusting us with your play!  

[dooglus]

They have play through requirements, which I believe makes it still -EV. You're offering a significant +EV bonus.

You can often find signup bonuses that are +EV even after taking the play through requirements into account.  But then it's often hard to actually get your winnings out.  They start asking for proof of ID, recent utility bills, etc. and drag their feet.  Probably enough players can't be bothered fighting to get their money that it ends up +EV for the casino.

With Bitcoin the whole withdrawal process is generally pretty frictionless, so that trick doesn't work for the casino.

Another difference is that since Bitcoin casinos don't generally require proof of ID, it's possible to open as many accounts as you like.  Then you can exploit a +EV signup bonus over and over.  That's harder to do with the traditional casinos, since you'd need a different ID document for each account.

And I agree that the bit777 offer seems to be +EV.  Deposit 16.66 BTC, bet it all on red on the no-zero roulette table (if the maximum allows it, of course).

50% of the time you'll win, and be up 16.66 BTC.
50% of the time you'll lose, and get 30% of the 16.66 BTC back, so you're only down 11.666 BTC.

Expected profit = 0.5 * 16.666 - 0.5 * 11.666 = 2.5 BTC.

[bit777]

We have some security measures in place that track and match duplicate accounts. But yes, I see your point and it is probably doable if you are motivated enough. Consider it a marketing stunt for us .

We are planning to keep running different promos for the years to come, something that really separates us from some of our competitors.

Remember, gambling should be done for entertainment and fun. 

[bit777]

Last day of the promo, use it before it ends! 

[bit777]

6 and a half more hours. Last chance to take advantage!

[KingOfSports]

If the 30% rebate would be .5 of a credit, would you round up? I assume the credits will be added to our accounts. I deposited a small amount twice and played the minimum for blackjack and war. I was not too amused by the level of bad beats. Out of the 5 games I played of war I lost all 5 including once or twice having a King, dealer got an Ace. Blackjack I won one hand out of 5 I believe. That session was a couple weeks back but the bad beats of those 5 or so hands were pretty bad, I do remember that. Not saying its rigged by any means but I'm looking forward to provably fair being implemented before I try luck again here haha.