Intersango not fraudulent

[kjakman]

Hi,
Just wanted to let you know that I was very worried, reading all about intersango being a fraud, since I had a considerable amount of coins sitting there. After 24 hours, I had no luck getting my coins out, so I got more worried. I managed to track down Amir Taaki (no longer involved) by phone, and then Patrick Strateman (the only one involved.) Patrick helped me and sent me all the coins.
Thanks, Kjetil

[ukbitcoiner]

Hi Intersango employee 

[madc0w]

Intersango is currently blocking a requested EUR transfer of mine for over a week now, no explanation provided.  Here is a transcript of our correspondence so far:

ME:
April 17, 2013, 1:15 p.m.
There is no date on the transfer request in your system, but I believe it's been several days now. This request is still pending. Can you give me some idea when this might start processing?

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 17, 2013, 7:30 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
Please do not open inquiries for transfers set to "requested"
There is no available ETA for transfers in this state.

ME:
April 17, 2013, 7:56 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
I'm sorry... I don't quite understand. Does "requested" mean that the transfer has not yet been initiated? If not, then what is blocking this transfer? Following the bitcion24 fiasco, you must understand that your customers may be a bit nervous.
With your permission, I will post your reply to the relevant forums.
Thank you.

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 17, 2013, 8:02 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
The delays are specifically because we do the things which bitcoin24 did not do that got them in trouble.
I hope you can understand.

ME:
April 17, 2013, 8:16 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
So I am to understand that the delay is deliberate? If so, that's fine, but then the delay is on your side, and so you must have some idea of when the transfer will be initiated. I'm not in a big hurry... but it would be reassuring to see some forward motion.

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 17, 2013, 8:55 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
Of course we cannot divulge specifics of internal controls.
I hope it's enough that I say transfers are actively being sent.

ME:
April 23, 2013, 11:04 a.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
You say that my transfer is "actively being sent", and yet it's now been over a week that my request is pending. I hope you can understand my apprehension.
I have a few questions:
- What is blocking this transfer? Is there some additional information you need? I've tried to think of any possible issue, but I'm coming up blank... save the obvious!
- How much longer can I expect to wait? If you plan on blocking this transfer much longer, I will require some specific explanations.
- Is this delay typical? Is this just an initial check of some sort, or can I expect to wait a very long time for every transfer into this account.
I appreciate that you are probably subject to some regulatory strictures. I hope you can appreciate that I need to know I can trust you. I am losing sleep.


... still waiting for a reply.

Suffice it say, I am not a happy camper.  It's a significant sum of money, and they so far have refused to give it over, or even to explain why they won't.

NOT GOOD!

[madc0w]

update follows....

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 23, 2013, 5:39 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
BZWBK is currently displaying an error when we try to do certain operations necessary for payments.
Unfortunately this has been displayed since Thursday now.
There is a notice about towards the top of all of the support pages.
Your transfer is literally the first in the queue, however it cannot be sent until the banks website is functioning again.

ME:
April 23, 2013, 5:59 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
Thanks for that information. I feel much better knowing that. Please understand that from the "requested" status that has been displayed for some 9 days now, it looks for all the world as if nothing is happening.
Just one more question: BZWBK appears to be a Polish bank. What is their implication with my requested transfer? The bank to which I am requesting this transfer be made is **** [different bank in different country].

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 23, 2013, 7:57 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
BZWBK is where our EUR account is.
So the transfer will originate from them.
Sorry for the delay, unfortunately there isn't much I can do.


BZWBK happens to be the same bank that was being used by bitcoin24... The bank which froze bitcoin24's account.  I interpret this as very bad news indeed.

[madc0w]

ME:
April 23, 2013, 8:46 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
BZWBK happens to be the same bank that was being used by Bitcoin24... The bank which froze Bitcoin24's account.
Is Intersango having the same issues? If so, you might consider getting in touch with Bitcoin24 to pool your resources.

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 23, 2013, 9:52 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
No we're not.
There is a minor technical problem which is unfortunately critical to the way we process transfers.

[Note that this "minor technical problem" has been ongoing for two weeks now.]

ME:
April 25, 2013, 7:30 a.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
Are you able to process transfers in GBP? What bank are you using for GBP?
Since this technical issues seems to be still unresolved, I am thinking to cancel this EUR transfer, buy the BTC back, sell them in GBP, and then transfer these funds to a friend's account in the UK. He will then convert to EUR and transfer to my account. All these operations will result in a lot of banking fees for me, but since the BZWBK issue doesn't seem to be moving forward, this might be the only way.

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 25, 2013, 10:59 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
GBP transfers are sent using an identical process.

ME:
April 26, 2013, 3:06 a.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
I'm sure you've been in touch with BZWBK about this. Do you have any information at all about what is causing this "minor technical problem" and when we might hope to see it resolved?

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 26, 2013, 8 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
They have not given us an ETA so we cannot give you one.

ME:
April 26, 2013, 8:07 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
ETA or not... you must have had some contact with them regarding this. Can you please transmit whatever the content of this interaction might me? A little transparency would go a long way to soothing nerves.
This situation is dragging on far too long to be a simple technical issue. A simple transfer request should not remain pending for two weeks.
You'll have to forgive me if I am under the impression that you are not being entirely forthcoming with information. Please, what is going on?

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 26, 2013, 8:23 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
We have policies and procedures in place to detect and correct errors.
These procedures cannot be carried out due to the issue with their website.
There is nothing more to be said as the procedure is necessarily secret.
Please stop requesting an update for an issue which is out of our control entirely.


So much for transparency.  I suppose the only way to get information is to contact this Polish bank directly... and that seems like a long shot at best.

lesson learned:
DO NOT TRANSFER FUNDS TO INTERSANGO... YOU MAY NEVER SEE THEM AGAIN.

[kjakman]

Hi,
What I can say is this: I'm a computer programmer myself (and do not work for Intersango, and I do not know them.) I'm not a rich man, but invested some money (significant to me) in 2012. The very day Bitcoin hit 266, somebody asked me "do you trust Intersango". On that day, my BTC with Intersango was suddenly about enough to pay for a year at Stanford, so I got worried. I tried to withdraw a few bit cents, and then a rather lot more than that. A few hours later I had the cents, but a day later, no Stanford tuition kind of money. I've already lost about 100BTC due to theft (BitLc.net), and after Googling "Intersango Scam", I got really worried.

With surprisingly little effort (a bit of google, youtube, etc), I found Amir Taaki's number (well, his old number.). Somebody picked up the phone and gave me Amir's new number. Amir picked up the phone and was friendly, not defensive (and I tried my best not to unfriendly or offensive.). He told me that Patrick Strateman now lives in my old hometown, and is a decent guy. I found him with ease in the phonebook, half expecting to have to resort to my very convincing lawyer friends in that city.

Instead, I first called him at home, late at night. His wife picked up the phone, and I apologized for the inconvenience. I then got Patrick on the phone, who never for one second tried to dodge his role or responsibility. Instead, he spent more than half an hour on the phone with me, explaining the following things, all very believable:
1) my withdrawal request was *way* more than what they keep in their hot wallet (sensible)
2) he's the sole remaining guy "working for" Intersango. (They're basically defunct, taking no new customers. Try opening an account on their site.)
3) Everybody's coins and deposit are safe.
4) (Crucial): They stopped because it ended up being tons of people work, no real money. I totally believe this. In the end, they made (dollar) cents on me, and I made a lot (if Bitcoin doesn't crash.)

I'm very grateful for their effort, honesty, and service. I offered to give them 5% which I never did (and he never asked.) But I stand by it. What I don't want to do, is publish their numbers so 100s of people will call/write to get their cents back. I can imagine that withdrawing real currency is a nightmare for them, especially small amounts internationally, given the fees and scrutiny from government.

My advice would be to use your balance to buy Bitcoins and then withdraw your Bitcoins. In a few days, you'll have them. If not, contact me, and then we'll talk.

Thanks,

  Kjetil
 

[optimystic]

bump

[leanmusclemass]

Thanks for that. Very interesting, and I’m glad you’re being attended to.

I’ve been looking for contact details for Mr Strateman. There’s a company phone number, but it doesn’t answer (surprise surprise). I looked on PIPL, but couldn’t find a home number.

I’ll keep looking, I guess. Meanwhile I’ll just keep on with the winding up order. They’ve got 7 days left now.

[quixotist]

From what I understand, in the UK, payment processors are not allowed to talk about accounts that are currently undergoing anti-money laundering, fraud or sanctions investigations, This is a matter of regulatory compliance.

This sucks but if that's the state of your account/transaction and they do tell you what's going on then they could be fined or have their business shut down by the FSA.

[Theraty]

Intersango is currently blocking a requested EUR transfer of mine for over a week now, no explanation provided.  Here is a transcript of our correspondence so far:

ME:
April 17, 2013, 1:15 p.m.
There is no date on the transfer request in your system, but I believe it's been several days now. This request is still pending. Can you give me some idea when this might start processing?

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 17, 2013, 7:30 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
Please do not open inquiries for transfers set to "requested"
There is no available ETA for transfers in this state.

ME:
April 17, 2013, 7:56 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
I'm sorry... I don't quite understand. Does "requested" mean that the transfer has not yet been initiated? If not, then what is blocking this transfer? Following the bitcion24 fiasco, you must understand that your customers may be a bit nervous.
With your permission, I will post your reply to the relevant forums.
Thank you.

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 17, 2013, 8:02 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
The delays are specifically because we do the things which bitcoin24 did not do that got them in trouble.
I hope you can understand.

ME:
April 17, 2013, 8:16 p.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
So I am to understand that the delay is deliberate? If so, that's fine, but then the delay is on your side, and so you must have some idea of when the transfer will be initiated. I'm not in a big hurry... but it would be reassuring to see some forward motion.

INTERSANGO SUPPORT:
April 17, 2013, 8:55 p.m. Staff needs_staff_action -> resolved
Of course we cannot divulge specifics of internal controls.
I hope it's enough that I say transfers are actively being sent.

ME:
April 23, 2013, 11:04 a.m. resolved -> needs_staff_action
You say that my transfer is "actively being sent", and yet it's now been over a week that my request is pending. I hope you can understand my apprehension.
I have a few questions:
- What is blocking this transfer? Is there some additional information you need? I've tried to think of any possible issue, but I'm coming up blank... save the obvious!
- How much longer can I expect to wait? If you plan on blocking this transfer much longer, I will require some specific explanations.
- Is this delay typical? Is this just an initial check of some sort, or can I expect to wait a very long time for every transfer into this account.
I appreciate that you are probably subject to some regulatory strictures. I hope you can appreciate that I need to know I can trust you. I am losing sleep.


... still waiting for a reply.

Suffice it say, I am not a happy camper.  It's a significant sum of money, and they so far have refused to give it over, or even to explain why they won't.

NOT GOOD!

It took me 2 weeks to get money transfered into intersnago about 2 months ago but they went through in the end. In the past 6 months intersango has gotten way more popular since tv appearance and as a result way slower but still trustworthy exchange in my eyes.

[quixotist]

I don't think that matters, what matters is that the investigation takes place without your explicit knowledge and no money is transfered until it has completed. At least that's my understanding based on a vague memory, I may be wrong.

[icicle]

I can understand a money transfer delay, but I'm having an account login issue. All the time I should be spending caring for a very sick dog http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnfPH6zQbXo is actually being spent researching every last little detail about Intersango - it's directors, previous directors, related lawsuits, history etc..

So did the attempt at liquidation go anywhere? I note there is an undischarged CCJ against Intersango.

I'm busy the next few days collating and forwarding everything to everyone I think needs to know it. Interesting stuff, but the more I find out, the more there is to find. Currently waiting on some documents from the UK. If the money has gone somewhere, I'm finding it.

So who here on this thread got their cash / coins, and who is still waiting?

[icicle]

Hey Madchow,

Got your reply. I don't know why it isn't appearing.

That was fiendishly clever! Love it!