Received BFL Jalapeño Today!

[SgtSpike]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

[Rampion]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

I think it's fair to warn everybody reading here that NO MORE PREORDERS should be placed until they really prove they can give PRECISE delivery dates for both past and new orders.

[SgtSpike]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

I think it's fair to warn everybody reading here that NO MORE PREORDERS should be placed until they really prove they can give PRECISE delivery dates for both past and new orders.

I think it is fair to warn everybody about past performance, but it is not fair to tell them what to do.  If people want to place preorders, it's no business of yours.  Warn them that BFL has only delivered a handful of units since taking preorders back in 2011.  Warn them that BFL has no precise delivery date.  But who are you to decide whether it is a good or bad investment for them?  That is a decision for them to make.

[PuertoLibre]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

I think it's fair to warn everybody reading here that NO MORE PREORDERS should be placed until they really prove they can give PRECISE delivery dates for both past and new orders.

I think it is fair to warn everybody about past performance, but it is not fair to tell them what to do.  If people want to place preorders, it's no business of yours.  Warn them that BFL has only delivered a handful of units since taking preorders back in 2011.  Warn them that BFL has no precise delivery date.  But who are you to decide whether it is a good or bad investment for them?  That is a decision for them to make.

I don't understand, is there some kind of mind control going on that I don't know about?

People will read Rampions message and take heed. That is their choice. The rest of the "hostages" will have to wait to see what happens or bail.

[Rampion]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

I think it's fair to warn everybody reading here that NO MORE PREORDERS should be placed until they really prove they can give PRECISE delivery dates for both past and new orders.

I think it is fair to warn everybody about past performance, but it is not fair to tell them what to do.  If people want to place preorders, it's no business of yours.  Warn them that BFL has only delivered a handful of units since taking preorders back in 2011.  Warn them that BFL has no precise delivery date.  But who are you to decide whether it is a good or bad investment for them?  That is a decision for them to make.

In fact they have delivery dates, which has been proved A LIE for +6 months. Delays and more delays. It's outrageous to see how they send a few units to PR guys and WIRED magazine just to keep the money flowing in their preorder backlog. Man, how could you not feel that? They should be working their asses off in order to explain to their customers when they will be able to manufacture en ship en masse, but they seem to spend all their energy trolling in these forums and in PR stunts + aggressive advertising.

It's a shame.

[DataPlumber]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

I think it's fair to warn everybody reading here that NO MORE PREORDERS should be placed until they really prove they can give PRECISE delivery dates for both past and new orders.

I think it is fair to warn everybody about past performance, but it is not fair to tell them what to do.  If people want to place preorders, it's no business of yours.  Warn them that BFL has only delivered a handful of units since taking preorders back in 2011.  Warn them that BFL has no precise delivery date.  But who are you to decide whether it is a good or bad investment for them?  That is a decision for them to make.

+1

[ninjaboon]

congrats, happy for you

[DataPlumber]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

I think it's fair to warn everybody reading here that NO MORE PREORDERS should be placed until they really prove they can give PRECISE delivery dates for both past and new orders.

I think it is fair to warn everybody about past performance, but it is not fair to tell them what to do.  If people want to place preorders, it's no business of yours.  Warn them that BFL has only delivered a handful of units since taking preorders back in 2011.  Warn them that BFL has no precise delivery date.  But who are you to decide whether it is a good or bad investment for them?  That is a decision for them to make.

In fact they have delivery dates, which has been proved A LIE for +6 months. Delays and more delays. It's outrageous to see how they send a few units to PR guys and WIRED magazine just to keep the money flowing in their preorder backlog. Man, how could you not feel that? They should be working their asses off in order to explain to their customers when they will be able to manufacture en ship en masse, but they seem to spend all their energy trolling in these forums and in PR stunts + aggressive advertising.

It's a shame.

There are facts in what you say, but there are also conclusions presented as facts that seem fueled by frustration.

Fact: They missed deadlines.  But the word "lie" implies intent.  How can you be absolutely sure their project plans didn't reflect the ship dates that they stated at that time?  It's absolutely fair to say that they were wrong about the dates, but the conclusion of intent is unsupported by any facts I'm aware of.  They've been quite transparent about the problems they've been having (tho I do feel that they're somewhat overdue for an update atm.)  Unsupported conclusions are not "facts."

Fact: They've been marketing and doing press at the same time they've been working on product and missing deadlines.  But to imply that they're spending 'all of their energy' on these things to the exclusion of working on shipping products is (at best) hyperbole.

I too am disappointed that it's taken this long for them to ship, but I don't feel that disappointment and frustration give a person license to present, as fact, conclusions based on two-thirds fact and one-third anger.

[k9quaint]

I just can't understand how anyone could defend BFL unless he/she has an incentive to do it (promised early machine or something) or hopes he might get one by placing himself in their backs.

I do it because I don't like people to be wrong on the internet.  If something needs to be corrected, I correct it.  BFL didn't purposefully do anything malicious, so I defend them.  They don't deserve to have various non-customers on the Bitcointalk forum slander them.

BFL has been caught in so many misrepresentations to date, all of which has been documented to death on this forum.
People claim there is no evidence of "intent". While defending their specs they made claims about the state of their chips and performance measurements of units that supposedly existed. Given what we know now, those claims could not possibly have been merely in error.

The reason why so many of these threads appear is because of people like you. You refuse to read the evidence presented in past threads, so we have to rehash the same stuff over and over again. Then Josh and his Sockpuppet show appears and starts yelling about trolls and calling everyone names.

Right up until the end, people believed in Pirate40 and defended him. I hope this is not history repeating itself. Yet again.

[Rampion]

Their whole communication approach is not helping at all. I really hope some real competition flourish in this market, we need that.

[DPoS]

For a $149 investment it'll repay itself and make $1300 on top in one month of mining.

Think again. You paid about 23 BTC 10 months ago. You'll make .3 btc/day. Even if the difficulty doesn't skyrocket (which it will), you need more than 2 months to just break even. You aren't making any profit for a long time.

No, he paid in USD, just like everyone else.  Nice try, though.

Meanwhile, if he bought BTC, he would have 23 BTC, right now. Nice try at post rationalizing though.

I don't see how BFL stopped him from buying 23 BTC at any time, can you please post where BFL forbids people from purchasing BTC once they purchase one of our products, which are sold for USD (Not BTC)?

You can't?  Oh, then your argument is fallacious.  Nice try at rationalizing a false premise, though.  Well, actually, no it's not.  It's pretty sophomoric and elementary.

You see this behavior a lot..  attack the dumbest argument cast at you so you look smart and on the ball while all the other hard questions go unanswered..

what is keeping BFL from shipping 400 a day like Josh boasted many times?

[Inaba]

BFL has been caught in so many misrepresentations to date, all of which has been documented to death on this forum.
People claim there is no evidence of "intent". While defending their specs they made claims about the state of their chips and performance measurements of units that supposedly existed. Given what we know now, those claims could not possibly have been merely in error.

Except... that's not really true.  Not terribly surprising coming from you, but none the less.  Trolls like you like to trot this out but to date, not a single one has been able to produce any evidence to back up this claim.  Meanwhile, in reality-land, I have provided numerous links and evidence to the contrary.  It's funny how you make these claims but never once back up your statements, but you keep at it, hoping someone will believe your BS.

The reason why so many of these threads appear is because of people like you. You refuse to read the evidence presented in past threads, so we have to rehash the same stuff over and over again. Then Josh and his Sockpuppet show appears and starts yelling about trolls and calling everyone names.

Ahh the wonderful sockpuppet defense.  For the record, BFL has exactly zero sockpuppet accounts.  Just like poor little Bryan Micon and his claims of a massive BFL Bot army downvoting his ridiculous little Reddit rants, it's just impossible for people like you, who have a tenuous grasp on reality at best, to believe that rational people actually evaluate the situation and the facts in a coherent manner and come to the logical conclusion.  Your little warped sense of reality doesn't really hold up to any sort of thorough or really even a cursory investigation.  It's why this particular subforum on Bitcointalk is the ass end of the internet - so many lies and deceit perpetrated by people with agendas, unbalanced sense of reality or just plain crazy, most rational people stay far, far away from it.  

There's a little handful of you trolls who troll every BFL thread.  I wouldn't even be posting here if there was moderation weeding out your useless little diatribes, but since there's none, here I am, arguing with idiots.  It's like a hobby at this point.  One I could certainly leave behind and be glad to be rid of it, let me tell you.  Maybe one day we'll get some real moderation here and Bitcointalk can become a place where rational adults can have discourse again, but not until people like PL, Syke, k9quaint, etc are all perma-banned.

[Xian01]

it's just impossible for people like you, who have a tenuous grasp on reality at best, to believe that rational people actually evaluate the situation and the facts in a coherent manner and come to the logical conclusion.  Your little warped sense of reality doesn't really hold up to any sort of thorough or really even a cursory investigation.  

 You have absolutely no license or credibility to speak about having a firm grasp of reality.

[smoothie]

For a $149 investment it'll repay itself and make $1300 on top in one month of mining.

Think again. You paid about 23 BTC 10 months ago. You'll make .3 btc/day. Even if the difficulty doesn't skyrocket (which it will), you need more than 2 months to just break even. You aren't making any profit for a long time.

No, he paid in USD, just like everyone else.  Nice try, though.

Meanwhile, if he bought BTC, he would have 23 BTC, right now. Nice try at post rationalizing though.

I don't see how BFL stopped him from buying 23 BTC at any time, can you please post where BFL forbids people from purchasing BTC once they purchase one of our products, which are sold for USD (Not BTC)?

You can't?  Oh, then your argument is fallacious.  Nice try at rationalizing a false premise, though.  Well, actually, no it's not.  It's pretty sophomoric and elementary.

You see this behavior a lot..  attack the dumbest argument cast at you so you look smart and on the ball while all the other hard questions go unanswered..

what is keeping BFL from shipping 400 a day like Josh boasted many times?

I think it is they don't have enough preorder customer money. Why else would they ship the first units to PR people?

So far there isn't a slew of devices from BFL being shipped out. What < 20? < 10?

[Syke]

Fact: They missed deadlines.  But the word "lie" implies intent.  How can you be absolutely sure their project plans didn't reflect the ship dates that they stated at that time?  It's absolutely fair to say that they were wrong about the dates, but the conclusion of intent is unsupported by any facts I'm aware of.  They've been quite transparent about the problems they've been having (tho I do feel that they're somewhat overdue for an update atm.)  Unsupported conclusions are not "facts."

You can't build an ASIC product overnight, which is what they keep claiming to do. In mid-Oct they claimed they'd still ship in Oct, yet they had no chips or anything close to a working product. Their schedule has been impossible to meet. That can only mean they lied about it.

[PuertoLibre]

it's just impossible for people like you, who have a tenuous grasp on reality at best, to believe that rational people actually evaluate the situation and the facts in a coherent manner and come to the logical conclusion.  Your little warped sense of reality doesn't really hold up to any sort of thorough or really even a cursory investigation.  

 You have absolutely no license or credibility to speak about having a firm grasp of reality.

Folks, if you don't believe us and instead believe Inaba, PLEASE, read the past. It will give you absolutely all the answers you need.

A troll would not say this. There is plenty to show, the mere claims made that we are idiots is nothing more than a ball of smoke to convince the most willfully ignorant.

Do your homework before you invest in that company. When you do, come on here and tell us what you found and you will shed more light on the subject and counter many of Inaba's spurious claims. Some of us are more antagonistic than others because we already know better.

Do your homework before you throw down thousands of dollars on these folks. Know their company inside and out before you pay at the checkout as you have only yourself to blame if you lose anything.

Visit the BFL forums and go to the very first pages. Learn the truth!

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/announcements/index2.html

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/index23.html

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/jalapeno-single-sc-support/index11.html

[k9quaint]

BFL has been caught in so many misrepresentations to date, all of which has been documented to death on this forum.
People claim there is no evidence of "intent". While defending their specs they made claims about the state of their chips and performance measurements of units that supposedly existed. Given what we know now, those claims could not possibly have been merely in error.

Except... that's not really true.  Not terribly surprising coming from you, but none the less.  Trolls like you like to trot this out but to date, not a single one has been able to produce any evidence to back up this claim.  Meanwhile, in reality-land, I have provided numerous links and evidence to the contrary.  It's funny how you make these claims but never once back up your statements, but you keep at it, hoping someone will believe your BS.

Here is you claiming 60w power usage and shipping in 2 weeks in Nov 2012:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119460.msg1314947#msg1314947
Here is you claiming the Jalapeno was getting FCC approval in 2 weeks and you were waiting for the test lab to issue the test report in Nov 2012. Oh, and that you were testing "all the devices at once" as if you actually had stuff that worked.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119351.msg1314335#msg1314335
Here is you betting on BFL @ 1.1GH/watt
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119351.msg1314335#msg1314335
And that is after looking through a few pages of you calling everyone on these boards trolls and douchebags. I'd rather not look through hundreds of posts of you being an ass. I will just find one of the summary threads where this has been composed and collated nicely.

The reason why so many of these threads appear is because of people like you. You refuse to read the evidence presented in past threads, so we have to rehash the same stuff over and over again. Then Josh and his Sockpuppet show appears and starts yelling about trolls and calling everyone names.

Ahh the wonderful sockpuppet defense.  For the record, BFL has exactly zero sockpuppet accounts.  Just like poor little Bryan Micon and his claims of a massive BFL Bot army downvoting his ridiculous little Reddit rants, it's just impossible for people like you, who have a tenuous grasp on reality at best, to believe that rational people actually evaluate the situation and the facts in a coherent manner and come to the logical conclusion.  Your little warped sense of reality doesn't really hold up to any sort of thorough or really even a cursory investigation.  It's why this particular subforum on Bitcointalk is the ass end of the internet - so many lies and deceit perpetrated by people with agendas, unbalanced sense of reality or just plain crazy, most rational people stay far, far away from it.  

There's a little handful of you trolls who troll every BFL thread.  I wouldn't even be posting here if there was moderation weeding out your useless little diatribes, but since there's none, here I am, arguing with idiots.  It's like a hobby at this point.  One I could certainly leave behind and be glad to be rid of it, let me tell you.  Maybe one day we'll get some real moderation here and Bitcointalk can become a place where rational adults can have discourse again, but not until people like PL, Syke, k9quaint, etc are all perma-banned.

It is actually a handful of people who defend BFL. A couple of low post count month old accounts that only post in BFL threads, Kano and you.
We know why Kano is pimping for BFL.
It doesn't look like the same cast of characters attacking you as before:

Except for PuertoLibre it is a whole new cast.

[Xian01]

Here is you claiming 60w power usage and shipping in 2 weeks in Nov 2012:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119460.msg1314947#msg1314947
Here is you claiming the Jalapeno was getting FCC approval in 2 weeks and you were waiting for the test lab to issue the test report in Nov 2012. Oh, and that you were testing "all the devices at once" as if you actually had stuff that worked.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119351.msg1314335#msg1314335
Here is you betting on BFL @ 1.1GH/watt
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119351.msg1314335#msg1314335
And that is after looking through a few pages of you calling everyone on these boards trolls and douchebags. I'd rather not look through hundreds of posts of you being an ass. I will just find one of the summary threads where this has been composed and collated nicely.

 So, Mr. Zerlan. Care to explain further about "so many lies and deceit perpetrated by people with agendas, unbalanced sense of reality or just plain crazy"

 It would seem clear to me that YOUR agenda is to shirk all responsibility or honor for your prior commitments.

[k9quaint]

Here is you claiming 60w power usage and shipping in 2 weeks in Nov 2012:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119460.msg1314947#msg1314947
Here is you claiming the Jalapeno was getting FCC approval in 2 weeks and you were waiting for the test lab to issue the test report in Nov 2012. Oh, and that you were testing "all the devices at once" as if you actually had stuff that worked.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119351.msg1314335#msg1314335
Here is you betting on BFL @ 1.1GH/watt
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119351.msg1314335#msg1314335
And that is after looking through a few pages of you calling everyone on these boards trolls and douchebags. I'd rather not look through hundreds of posts of you being an ass. I will just find one of the summary threads where this has been composed and collated nicely.

 So, Mr. Zerlan. Care to explain further about "so many lies and deceit perpetrated by people with agendas, unbalanced sense of reality or just plain crazy"

 It would seem clear to me that YOUR agenda is to shirk all responsibility or honor for your prior commitments.

He is probably busy deleting the posts. 

[DPoS]

 It's why this particular subforum on Bitcointalk is the ass end of the internet - so many lies and deceit perpetrated by people with agendas, unbalanced sense of reality or just plain crazy, most rational people stay far, far away from it.  

are you shipping 400 a day like you boasted many times or not?

simple question which of course you avoided