Ripple is in major trouble

[JoelKatz]

Well, Ripple will most likely do alright but XRP is in major trouble.
Now since the first one has used copy-paste of xrp's code the foot is in the door and opened the floodgates.
Every Bank will create its own token as it is the cheapest way.
Creation and maintenance is next to nothing and lots of Banks already have contractual agreement to work with Ripple and use their services.
It is plain and simply stupid to think an Indian Bank will use the same xrp as a American Bank one or a Nigerian one ......

By no means will it stop at Banks, Tokens/Coins will be as common as email addresses and the common reference point is Bitcoin the "President". Every President has a running mate which obviously must be very similar in every aspect (not from the opposition camp) and "clean" of scams.
You could call it the "Bitcoin Standard".
A system of providing and controlling the exchange of coins, in which the value of the coin is fixed against that of Bitcoin.

If every bank creates their own token, you just reinvent the settlement problem.

If banks create tokens backed by fiat, then each token is tied to a jurisdiction and there's still a huge market in providing liquidity across jurisdictions. (This would be one possible way to improve domestic payments.)

If banks create unbacked tokens, then they have to incentivize all the liquidity themselves and we're way ahead of them with plenty of bank support. They'd have to raise and expend all the funds that we already have.

I have almost no doubt that all of these things will be tried and that some of them will be successful. Bitcoin could also gain significant market share as a settlement currency between inter-ledger exchanges locked in particular jurisdictions (the payment tech Ripple is cooperating to build will, I hope, be good for many cryptos). We think we can position XRP to compete on a level playing field.

You might also start to see more organic growth of XRP. XRP transactions are much faster, cheaper, and more reliable than transactions on any other major blockchain. And XRP has many features that other blockchains don't such as key rotation, native multisign, native support for arbitrary assets, order books, and cross-currency payments, and so on. It may not just be Ripple pursuing international payments for much longer.

Of course, there are no guarantees. These things also might not happen.

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[blacque]

<disclosure:  I owned XRP's starting from early 2014.>
Wanting to be part of the crypto revolution through only owning Ripples is like wanting to be part of the internet revolution by buying Barnes & Noble shares instead of Amazon shares.
Wasn't the idea of Bitcoin and crypto and blockchains and DAO's to get us away from banks?
I liked Ripple, but my thinking has moved on....I want a crypto that gets me away from banks, not back towards them.
Coins like Ether, Tezos, NEM, Heat, Ardor, PIVX, Sia and perhaps even Stellar Lumens represent the current evolution of crypto software coding.  These coins too will next year be obsolete or seen as ageing.
In the future, all humans will use software-coded coins to exchange value and to conduct trade and to run countries.  This genie ain't going back in the bottle, she only gets more evolved and virulent.
Buying a first generation cryptocoin, like Bitcoin or Ripple, is like buying Windows 386 or MS-DOS 3.3 in 1990 and thinking it will serve the computer industry for the next fifty-to-hundred years.
Cryptocoins are nothing but software code and code evolves daily, so will our coins.
Move on as each new generation of cryptocoin emerges, Darwinian evolution in the flesh.  There's no going back, TINA (there is no alternative).

[JoelKatz]

Wasn't the idea of Bitcoin and crypto and blockchains and DAO's to get us away from banks?

You miss the point entirely. Look at the Internet. The first Internet companies worked closely with the government, building a network with the government as their main customers. Was the point of the Internet to get away from government (or other centralized) control of information? Of course. The key thing was that the Internet was not a network controlled by the government.

I liked Ripple, but my thinking has moved on....I want a crypto that gets me away from banks, not back towards them.

That's what we're doing. We're getting the banks to use a network they don't own or control.

In the future, all humans will use software-coded coins to exchange value and to conduct trade and to run countries.  This genie ain't going back in the bottle, she only gets more evolved and virulent.
Buying a first generation cryptocoin, like Bitcoin or Ripple, is like buying Windows 386 or MS-DOS 3.3 in 1990 and thinking it will serve the computer industry for the next fifty-to-hundred years.
Cryptocoins are nothing but software code and code evolves daily, so will our coins.
Move on as each new generation of cryptocoin emerges, Darwinian evolution in the flesh.  There's no going back, TINA (there is no alternative).

You may well be right. And if you are, the way to get there is to bridge the existing financial system in -- because that's where the money is.

[blacque]

Banks don't have money today because they worked hard and sweated and laboured tirelessly for every single dollar in their vaults....banks survive a la GFC, because the government gives them a license to print dollars into existence and then underwrites them with implicit guarantees (taxpayer funded).  Banks take the dollar you give them then they rehypothecate it / fractionally reserve lend it into being 10 or 100 dollars as loans to mortgage owners (you and me, who are silly enough to slave away at our cubicle farms for forty years to pay back a mortgage debt plus fat interest) or as loans to businesses (who use lawyers to pass the buck to bag holders, a la Bernie Madoff).
So yes, banks have lots of money TODAY to potentially path into crypto currencies....but will they?  ....can they? .....given how they need to externalise their problems onto bagholders.  This ship will sail.
Banks are a 20th century legacy idea, 21st century will replace banks....with something like cryptocoins or their successor.
Banks are an idea whose 'use by' date has arrived.

[blacque]

"The key thing was that the Internet was not a network controlled by the government."
Visited Turkey, Iran, North Korea lately?
The government did not think of the ideas that gave us Facebook, Google, Uber, bitcointalk.org, Wikipedia.....your favourite web business/site.  People, us, we did that.
If anything, government kills or hobbles or undermines nascent industries.
Arguing that government is an essential ingredient before you can make something new is to suggest that progress can only be assured by centralised states like Orwellian ones.....e.g. North Korea, Syria, past versions of Communist Russia / China, etc.  Ummm, when was the last time any of these pro-government models made your life better?
Ripple might try to be clever and co-opt the engine house that modern banks might be....but 20th century banking is an inherently compromised model that Darwin will not suffer to continue....banks as constituted today will be superseded by an animal fitter to adapt and thus survive.

[qiwoman2]

I bought some Ripple yesterday in the dip - only a few - and I noticed that most other cryptos went up except for Ripple which is still down. I am not sure if I should hold it for a day or two or just dump at a loss and buy into something like Stratis or ETC which still has some leg room for growth. I noticed though generally there is a real love and hate relationship with Ripple due to the banking situation.

[AmarO]

I bought some Ripple yesterday in the dip - only a few - and I noticed that most other cryptos went up except for Ripple which is still down. I am not sure if I should hold it for a day or two or just dump at a loss and buy into something like Stratis or ETC which still has some leg room for growth. I noticed though generally there is a real love and hate relationship with Ripple due to the banking situation.

Hold it will go back up

[Spoetnik]

@blacque
Agreed !

I also don't see it happening.
I've eluded to many points over time.

What it boils down to is Ripple employees can SAY what ever they want.
Then idiots here get to go buy XRP at Polo.
That is what is happening.. for years now.

In other words i can make a coin called "Bring Down the Govt"
Premine all of them then send some of them to Polo for the morons to buy.
Then.. just keep posting news that we are in talks with groups to bring them down.

Lots of ways to look at this but the idiots out there.. are idiots.

If XRP is not going to be technically used by banks then what happens ?
Sounds to me like we have a company called Ripple inc luring children on Bitcointalk into buying 100% premined coins to further a corporate agenda.. selling some block-chain / ledger type shit to a bank.
now..
Does that in any way shape or form sound like shit we're interested in ?
Investors ?
Well ?

[juicejoyce]

R3 is a major competitor to the Ethereum Platform as well after having abandoned ETH in 2016.

I can't agree more with you. And i am a supporter of the Ethereum platform and hope more and more innovative programs can be developed based on this platform. 

[manfred]

It is clear a lot have not understood or come to terms with the decentralize progress at work.
I dont need a Bank or Politician or anyone else to tell me what to do.
Technology is available now where i can upvote on all the things of interest to me.
Now with economically sensible Micropayment possibilities available soon upvoting will be taken to the next level.
You don't share the CV or email address with just anyone, why would you do so with tokens/coins?
A private Blockchain instantly verifiable proves my creditworthiness.

[Boxxl]

It is clear a lot have not understood or come to terms with the decentralize progress at work.
I dont need a Bank or Politician or anyone else to tell me what to do.
Technology is available now where i can upvote on all the things of interest to me.
Now with economically sensible Micropayment possibilities available soon upvoting will be taken to the next level.
You don't share the CV or email address with just anyone, why would you do so with tokens/coins?
A private Blockchain instantly verifiable proves my creditworthiness.

You don't need a bank? How do you pay all day?
I use my bank everyday, most people do.
I don't see a change in 10 years.. Thats why I still believe in Ripple.

I see a good future for some crypto. But They can't change the dollar or other value.
Maybe a little..

[cerejobastos]

It is clear a lot have not understood or come to terms with the decentralize progress at work.
I dont need a Bank or Politician or anyone else to tell me what to do.
Technology is available now where i can upvote on all the things of interest to me.
Now with economically sensible Micropayment possibilities available soon upvoting will be taken to the next level.
You don't share the CV or email address with just anyone, why would you do so with tokens/coins?
A private Blockchain instantly verifiable proves my creditworthiness.

You don't need a bank? How do you pay all day?
I use my bank everyday, most people do.
I don't see a change in 10 years.. Thats why I still believe in Ripple.

I see a good future for some crypto. But They can't change the dollar or other value.
Maybe a little..

Do you know who Ripple founder is?

Ofc we use banks everyday, there was no other choice! until a few years ago. Blockchain is not mainstream, YET!, and it will be harder to make it mainstream with people backing up Ripple (not even a blockchain, shame on it) and any organization helping banks to once again rule over this new tech. Thanks for being so naive and only seeing profits once again community.
Anyway, blockchain is stronger than that, in time you will see that ripple was never a good intend company nor investment longterm.
Enjoy the short term hype while you can.

[cerejobastos]

I liked Ripple, but my thinking has moved on....I want a crypto that gets me away from banks, not back towards them.

That's what we're doing. We're getting the banks to use a network they don't own or control.

Laughing at this sentence. They wont control it, but Ripple will, see any difference? both are centralized, so no difference at all.


This guy is being paid by ripple, yet you choose to follow his advice other than people who are trying to fight the corruption. He even has a Gaben-like photo. All he cares is for money, not us just like Gaben. Throw it at him if you will. Ripple is a shame for the cryptocurrency world.

Do you know who Ripple founder is?

[Boxxl]

After years Ripple is still in business.
Maybe you don't like the banks or Ripple, but they have a very good solutions for banks.

We see it in a couple of years...

[cerejobastos]

After years Ripple is still in business.
Maybe you don't like the banks or Ripple, but they have a very good solutions for banks.

We see it in a couple of years...

They might, who knows, have not seen anything yet, I just wont support it.

Banks and central financial companies are the reason "someone" invented BITCOIN.

If you think centralization is the future, then go on, bet on Ripple. Everyone has its own opinion, I am just giving mine.

[JoelKatz]

Laughing at this sentence. They wont control it, but Ripple will, see any difference? both are centralized, so no difference at all.

I can't refute a conclusion. Why do you think Ripple will control it?

I would also add that at the moment, bitcoin is also far more centralized than I think most people would like. Its design makes miners stakeholders, and that is inherently centralizing because someone will have the best ASICs and the best price for electricity. Worse, miners interests are averse to the interest of other stakeholders because they want high transaction fees. (I'm long on bitcoin and a big believer. I don't think this is a disaster or deal breaker.)

Ripple is by no means perfect. But in a fair and realistic comparison to other technologies, I think it easily holds its own. You can really only make the kinds of arguments that you're making if you still think that anyone can mine competitively and that governance is not needed (as many people, including me, did back in 2011). But if I want SegWit and you don't, someone has to win and someone has to lose. And without governance, you get paralysis or war.

This guy is being paid by ripple, yet you choose to follow his advice other than people who are trying to fight the corruption. He even has a Gaben-like photo. All he cares is for money, not us just like Gaben. Throw it at him if you will. Ripple is a shame for the cryptocurrency world.

You have a fact followed by a bunch of insults. Pretty much everyone in this field puts their money where their beliefs are. If you think Ethereum will take over the world, you probably think it's smart to hold some Ether, and so you do. So how can you tell who is being honest and who is just a shill? Easy ... look at what they're saying.

Can they honestly acknowledge the weaknesses of the systems they like most? Do they make reasoned arguments rather than stating conclusions? Do they defend their claims when they're challenged? Do they change their mind when new facts come to light?

I'm not just being paid by Ripple, I was there from day one building the company. The day it no longer reflects my values or I no longer think we're working to make the world a better place, I'll go do something else.

[Aerys2]

Damn so ill have to remove myself from stellar

[PhoenixWarrior333]

Ripple has a ripple in its own network due to these other said persons ideas coming into play.

[cerejobastos]

First of all I didnt insult, I stated some facts along with some fun. If you find it offensive then bad for you.
Second, I dont lie, I really hate Ripple and i think it should go to 0 asap, same for Stellar.
Third, not even a blockchain and it is centralized.
Fourth, do you guys know who was the founder of Ripple?
Fifth, do you know who was the founder of MtGox?

[btcbug]

http://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/Japan-s-SBI-megabanks-take-stakes-in-blockchain-group-R3?n_cid=NARAN012

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/23/r3-funding-blockchain-intel-bank-of-america-hsbc.html



So Ripple signed Japan SBI which was a group of about 47 banks and created SBI Ripple Asia which caused pump from .20c to .40c but news just came out today that Japan SBI joined R3 and are creating their own coin. R3 has loads of banks on board and is like a Universal Bank Consortium, majority will be owned by the banks in it unlike Ripple. They will use it to implement blockchain solutions to save them money. I saw this coming a mile away. All these banks are investing in their own ILP Ripple type network so they don't have to depend on a third party. Why depend on a third party when you can have your own and save even more? Whales are trying to maintain XRP value as some hold a lot but they can only keep buying so long because noone else is buying.

Below are some competitors in the blockchain banking scene with more coming:


R3
Quorum
Ripple
Axoni
InfoSys


Good bye Swift and Ripple, hello R3 lol get out before the house burns down I've been saying this for awhile now. There is no more good news left for Ripple. They were a shame at Consensus and now their own group just ditched them. Greedy centralized trash.

Well according to this: http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/23/r3-funding-blockchain-intel-bank-of-america-hsbc.html Goldman Sachs and Santander dropped out. It's far from a done deal as to the outcome. Ripple and R3 may both have value. Time will tell.

Also, your point about banks investing in their own ILP... that doesn't really convince me. The difference is that instead of paying fees to Ripple, they're going to invest hundredes of millions up front to develop their own solution. Surely it will still require usage fees and ongoing upkeep, no? Why do you think oil companies contract out the drilling and well servicing, when they could just own the drilling rigs and all the equipment? In most cases it makes sense to hire out vs dealing with all the overhead and ongoing costs.

To me it makes a lot of sense that banks would sign onto a solution that is ready, working, and ISN'T controlled by their competition, but is a neutral 3rd party.