Communism: Pro and Cons

[KoningSilk]

Communism is an economic system.
Dictatorship is an political system.

After stating that, I would like to see a democratic nation try to impliment communism (not in my country though).

First of all, nowadays pure communism is almost extinct and what remains is socialism.
Unfortunately all countries are supporting socialist ideas in some way. I've seen so many right wing parties trying to cut themselves from the leftist ideology and calling them communists and socialists, while at the same time following socialist way of thinking.
Take taxes for an example. In most countries they are based on income, so that all give according to their ability, but this means that those who have more are forced to give more. It's one of the foundations of communism and socialism.

Problem with taxes is that the ultra rich will simply leave the country if the taxes are to much. On the other side there is the problem with the ultra poor: they will remain poor.

What I mean to point out is that you shouldn't make laws for the ultra poor or the ultra rich to try to make them get close to each other. You should try to make the middel class more abundant. Thats what communism should be about.

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[Palmerson]

Why those who make much money have to pay more? It's not fair. I knew a man who was earning very much, but he was working 18 hours a day. The result of the constant stress he died at 46 years old. And there are people who do nothing at work, receive minimum wage and are dissatisfied with the fact that there are rich. Probably a percentage in taxes has to pay the same, and the amount will be different.

[mk3000]

Why those who make much money have to pay more? It's not fair. I knew a man who was earning very much, but he was working 18 hours a day. The result of the constant stress he died at 46 years old. And there are people who do nothing at work, receive minimum wage and are dissatisfied with the fact that there are rich. Probably a percentage in taxes has to pay the same, and the amount will be different.

a lot of people also make a lot of money by exploiting someone else. plenty of corporations make a lot of money by exploiting people in third world countries, not paying taxes, etc. so it's not a black and white issues

[KoningSilk]

Why those who make much money have to pay more? It's not fair. I knew a man who was earning very much, but he was working 18 hours a day. The result of the constant stress he died at 46 years old. And there are people who do nothing at work, receive minimum wage and are dissatisfied with the fact that there are rich. Probably a percentage in taxes has to pay the same, and the amount will be different.

a lot of people also make a lot of money by exploiting someone else. plenty of corporations make a lot of money by exploiting people in third world countries, not paying taxes, etc. so it's not a black and white issues

Agree, if you make so much money that you don't know what to do with it, you should give some to people who are less fortunate than you. But please, let the richer person decide for himself to whom he gives the money.

For example: I am perfectly happy to give money to people who need it, but I dont want to give money to some low life scum who does bad stuff to other people. Sadly, goverment decrees that I should give money to everybody..

[Tyrantt]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

[Ciccotelligc]

Well there's a reason communims hasn't survived of all the times some people have tried it.

[whaawh]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

It is very interesting to read the posts of people who just think they know what communism is the point that Never and never felt what one can feel under communism. Its time even under the Soviet Union, the comma was an opportunity to try to find out what exactly communism is in the country. Under communism a person is a slave, a labor force and no freedom of speech and action.

[coolcoinz]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

It is very interesting to read the posts of people who just think they know what communism is the point that Never and never felt what one can feel under communism. Its time even under the Soviet Union, the comma was an opportunity to try to find out what exactly communism is in the country. Under communism a person is a slave, a labor force and no freedom of speech and action.

Actually communism doesn't limit the freedom of speech, it's not built into the system. The fact that communist leaders turn into dictators and rule with an iron fist is somehow the evolution, extension of the system, maybe the result of its weaknesses.
They can't sustain it, so they try to scare people, force them to keep the system going. This oppression grows to the point of breakdown and a revolution and this is how it always ends.

[Okurkabinladin]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

It is very interesting to read the posts of people who just think they know what communism is the point that Never and never felt what one can feel under communism. Its time even under the Soviet Union, the comma was an opportunity to try to find out what exactly communism is in the country. Under communism a person is a slave, a labor force and no freedom of speech and action.

Actually communism doesn't limit the freedom of speech, it's not built into the system. The fact that communist leaders turn into dictators and rule with an iron fist is somehow the evolution, extension of the system, maybe the result of its weaknesses.
They can't sustain it, so they try to scare people, force them to keep the system going. This oppression grows to the point of breakdown and a revolution and this is how it always ends.

Precisely. All the way back 1900 great thinkers predicted, that only way, that communism (ie. permanent redistribution of wealth and privileges) can work is through tight state control of free speech and even movement of individuals. Political loyalty takes precedence over personal capabilities, it is the opposite of meritocracy by design.

To justify that, you have to turn state in God, erasing any notion of separationf of church and state in the process. All the authority comes from the select few that run the state in name of the People and are not to be questioned. Communism as it was practiced was closer to theocracy, than anything else.

[Tyrantt]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

It is very interesting to read the posts of people who just think they know what communism is the point that Never and never felt what one can feel under communism. Its time even under the Soviet Union, the comma was an opportunity to try to find out what exactly communism is in the country. Under communism a person is a slave, a labor force and no freedom of speech and action.

Actually communism doesn't limit the freedom of speech, it's not built into the system. The fact that communist leaders turn into dictators and rule with an iron fist is somehow the evolution, extension of the system, maybe the result of its weaknesses.
They can't sustain it, so they try to scare people, force them to keep the system going. This oppression grows to the point of breakdown and a revolution and this is how it always ends.

It's turns into a dictatorship later on because first we're not all the same, someone isn't satisfied with going to job every day for the rest of his life, and that person may want to invest into a private businesses and when people like that stand up, they're put down in the moment in order not to speak out against the regime. Communism doesn't work and will never because not all people are the same.

Tho it sounds all nice on paper, it's absolutely not possible in practise.

[Okurkabinladin]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

It is very interesting to read the posts of people who just think they know what communism is the point that Never and never felt what one can feel under communism. Its time even under the Soviet Union, the comma was an opportunity to try to find out what exactly communism is in the country. Under communism a person is a slave, a labor force and no freedom of speech and action.

Actually communism doesn't limit the freedom of speech, it's not built into the system. The fact that communist leaders turn into dictators and rule with an iron fist is somehow the evolution, extension of the system, maybe the result of its weaknesses.
They can't sustain it, so they try to scare people, force them to keep the system going. This oppression grows to the point of breakdown and a revolution and this is how it always ends.

It's turns into a dictatorship later on because first we're not all the same, someone isn't satisfied with going to job every day for the rest of his life, and that person may want to invest into a private businesses and when people like that stand up, they're put down in the moment in order not to speak out against the regime. Communism doesn't work and will never because not all people are the same.

Tho it sounds all nice on paper, it's absolutely not possible in practise.

True and more than that.

Rift between communism and social democracy came, when the latter said, that violence cannot be used as means to an end. Communism already emerged on bones and blood of its opponents and supporters, which dictated its further form.

Both social democracy and communism is not based on equality of opportunity (which is in essence capitalist aswell as christian doctrine), but on idea of equality of outcome. While Das Kapital of Karl Marx did not mention it, tyranny is ultimately tied inherently to communism, because any attempts at it will lead to breach of individual property and freedoms.

[Lancusters]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

The theory of communism is a utopian theory which is based on dreams and does not include an economic component. When there is no properly structured economy always appear dissatisfied and that leads to dictatorship. It is better not to build communism, because the result is obvious and it is confirmed by life.

[KoningSilk]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

The theory of communism is a utopian theory which is based on dreams and does not include an economic component. When there is no properly structured economy always appear dissatisfied and that leads to dictatorship. It is better not to build communism, because the result is obvious and it is confirmed by life.

Confirmed by life.... 3 dictatorships arose in countries who claimed they were communists. That was not real communism, that was just a propaganda strategy to get the power.

[Okurkabinladin]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

The theory of communism is a utopian theory which is based on dreams and does not include an economic component. When there is no properly structured economy always appear dissatisfied and that leads to dictatorship. It is better not to build communism, because the result is obvious and it is confirmed by life.

Confirmed by life.... 3 dictatorships arose in countries who claimed they were communists. That was not real communism, that was just a propaganda strategy to get the power.

You dont know what you are talking about, your education sucks.

Three countries? Where on the map do you see three countries?



In fact, communism was tried again and again all around the planet through out 20th century. Leaving millions of crushed skulls in its wake. Its leadership always emerged through election of working class (there, the initial democratic phase).

You know who was by far the most ardent communist ever? The one, who took Das Kapital literally? Little brown dude named Pol Pot.



With education in western university of Sorbonna, in France.  École française de radioélectricité. He was influenced by marxists right there.

He would through shrewd politics eventually get an iron grip on communist party of Cambodia and since the biggest difference between communists and social democracy is the approval of politically motivated violence by the former, the dice was rolled.



In a single decade, Pol Pot, the revolutionary leader, the visionary, the equalizer managed to exterminate nearly third of his own nation in an attempt to "cleanse it" from capitalism and any traditions and to mold them into "better humans" he murdered up to two million of his countrymen through his goons, starvation and concentration camps.

You wont find humane communism, because then, it wouldnt be communism. Social democracy? Maybe. But not communism.

[yoseph]

Communismpromises equal share of the National pie to every individual but in reality it's only the elite few who end up enjoying it and the majority are left to suffer and if they end of protesting they are killed , this sums it up. It's a brutish system.

[Tyrantt]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

The theory of communism is a utopian theory which is based on dreams and does not include an economic component. When there is no properly structured economy always appear dissatisfied and that leads to dictatorship. It is better not to build communism, because the result is obvious and it is confirmed by life.

Confirmed by life.... 3 dictatorships arose in countries who claimed they were communists. That was not real communism, that was just a propaganda strategy to get the power.

That's what communism is. They get to the top promising everything for everyone, the fail to provide it as usual, people start protesting, they use force to contain them and then use force and fear to keep it that way, eventually leading the country to collapse. Ok then, name one communist country that succeeded... is it Cuba, Stalin Russia, Venezuela? North Korea maybe?

[Okurkabinladin]

Well so far I don't know and haven't found any legit pros of communism but I guess the "real communism hasn't been tried yet", right?
and I think we've all made sure that communism doesn't work.

The theory of communism is a utopian theory which is based on dreams and does not include an economic component. When there is no properly structured economy always appear dissatisfied and that leads to dictatorship. It is better not to build communism, because the result is obvious and it is confirmed by life.

Confirmed by life.... 3 dictatorships arose in countries who claimed they were communists. That was not real communism, that was just a propaganda strategy to get the power.

That's what communism is. They get to the top promising everything for everyone, the fail to provide it as usual, people start protesting, they use force to contain them and then use force and fear to keep it that way, eventually leading the country to collapse. Ok then, name one communist country that succeeded... is it Cuba, Stalin Russia, Venezuela? North Korea maybe?

North Korea went commmunist and far beyond, though. The iron grip of Kim dynasty turned it into theocratic monarchy with "the leader" akin to living god with state being the church, that guides all good Koreans to salvation.

State classified its population on the basis of loyalty (which is hereditary) and previous archievements towards party goals. "Songbun".

[aucryptotrader]

Communism is great if you don't mind being persecuted and watching your family get murdered by the ruling party.  Given the choice I'd much rather live under another Adolf Hitler than another Joseph Stalin. 

And let's not forget about Venezuela who are experiencing the final stage prior to another communist dictatorship.  Watch them and learn.

[seojp]

I am not for communist because communism is bad for the countries economy eventhough it is pro poor or pro farmers. The economy will be bad if you always rely on the poor. It has negative effect in the future so I am from for capitalism because it is good both side the rich and the poor. The business man and the employer.

[aucryptotrader]

I am not for communist because communism is bad for the countries economy eventhough it is pro poor or pro farmers. The economy will be bad if you always rely on the poor. It has negative effect in the future so I am from for capitalism because it is good both side the rich and the poor. The business man and the employer.

Actually the farmers get it the worst, the whole idea of Communism is to "seize the means of production".  The state first claims the farmland (collectivization) then executes the feudal owners. 

And don't you think that a poor person in the USA is better off than a poor person in Cuba, Venezuela or North Korea?  So no, it's not actually better for poor people either, it just makes everyone poor so they're all equal in poverty.