WIN.AVALON - Closed!

[wisard]

So I own 4 Avalon Batch # 3 units of 4 modules each. I had bought them via HorseRider's deal. So he will be managing them in China for 10% of the revenue + electricity cost (0.25USD / kwh).

I'm posting here to see if there is any interest if I convert this into a security and list it either on bitfunder or on btct.

Please let me know if you would be interested in investing in such an asset, and if the demand is decent enough, I'll go ahead and create the security.

If the demand is not there, I may just put up an auction for 1 of the units instead.

Thank you.

[jjdub7]

BitFunder please, if you do.  There will be demand.

[Franktank]

Plans for expansion? More details pl0x

With ASICMiner getting all the love, we need some underdog small timers!! And that German one is lacking some info... (Granted its in German so...)

[m_yaw]

demand from my side is definitely there...

[jjdub7]

Do you have a share distribution plan?  What will the equivalent hashing power be per share and what will the IPO share price be set at?

[wisard]

Total hashing power would be 336GHz.
I was thinking of issuing 67,200 shares (so 1 share = 5MHz).

I was thinking of going with an IPO auction instead of a big sell wall.

I know Avalon had calculated sales price based on 30 day returns. I'm thinking of basing mine on 60-90 day returns. So minimum share price would probably be 0.02 to 0.025 BTC.

Expansion plans. I don't know what people would want. Would you want it so that only 70% dividends are paid and 30% is kept aside to buy more equipment? Or would you rather prefer earning 100% dividends and no expansion (and you can invest in your own equipment or invest in other shares)? I guess I'll do what the majority wants after the IPO.

[madmax_ger]

if you do split and reinvest 30%, shares would probably hold it's value.

but who knows if you get more hardware in reasonable time then as
you might not want to invest until the coins are mined.

Better option would be to reinvest the IPO income, and to publish your
expansion plans/orders in detail. that would be a reason for me to accept the
lower payout.

interested as long as IPO <= 3btc/ghs.

+1 for bitfunder

[jjdub7]

I mean theoretically in macroeconomics, the perfect savings rate is 30%, so I'm on board with that

[MikeMark]

Hi wisard,

I like the idea. I'll be watching how things develop. 

[wisard]

1. We changed the name from W.Avalon to Win.Avalon as per Ukyo's recommendation. (He is trying to set a standard of first 3 prominent letters for new securities.)

2. We have listed on Bitfunder.
https://bitfunder.com/asset/Win.Avalon

3. I've listed 600 shares at 0.018 per share to test the demand out. Please post your buy offers and I'll fill them out over 0.018 per share every day till 33600 shares are sold.

Thanks.

[MikeMark]

Hi wisard,

Nice. I'm glad you decided to list.

You haven't specified a minimum dividend percentage. Do you have one?

Put another way, can we expect that at least 70% of profit will be paid as dividends?

[wisard]

Yes. 70% and more is to be expected.

[TheJuice]

so 67200 * 0.018 = 1209 BTC for 4 avalon batch 3 miners. Am I missing something? That seems way to high. 1209/336(Ghz) = 3.6 BTC per GHz. Then fees.

What am I missing?

[wisard]

What you are missing is 2 things.

1. Even at 3.6 BTC per GH, the units will be profitable. Sure they won't show a positive ROI in 30 days, but they will in a few months.

2. Re-investment. 20-30% of profits will be re-invested in other mining equipment.

While I doubt we will ever start making our own mining equipment, I'm confident that we will find opportunities to buy other equipment as time goes on. We'll never be ASICMiner. But we can be a good competitive mining asset that earns bitcoins consistently.

[MikeMark]

For comparison, ASICMiner Block Erupter blades producing 10 GHz ave or 12.8 GHz max just sold by ASICMiner for BTC49.99.

That's BTC3.9 / GHz min or about BTC5 / GHz average.

Looking at it that way, WIN.AVALON is a good buy.

[Deprived]

For comparison, ASICMiner Block Erupter blades producing 10 GHz ave or 12.8 GHz max just sold by ASICMiner for BTC49.99.

That's BTC3.9 / GHz min or about BTC5 / GHz average.

Looking at it that way, WIN.AVALON is a good buy.

Well if you want to compare then you have to take into account delivery dates.

The blades would arrive within a week.  When will the Avalons arrive?  How much will each GHz of blade hash-power mine in the interim?  Without that data a comparison is meaningless: using your logic you could compare to BFLs (which would work out far cheaper on paper - but ONLY exist on paper).

Only thing you can easily do a fair comparison is other batch 3 Avalon securities - as those are likely to arrive around same time and have same hashpower and reliability.

[wisard]

Avalon batch #2 started shipping today. Avalon batch #3 is expected to ship within 20-25 from today then.

Also, each batch of avalon is going to take 2-3 weeks or more to ship. So an order that is ahead in line (like Win.Avalon's is) should have quite a bit of a head start over other Avalons from the same batch.

In the end, you should do your own calculations and invest if you think you will earn a profit.

[MikeMark]

For comparison, ASICMiner Block Erupter blades producing 10 GHz ave or 12.8 GHz max just sold by ASICMiner for BTC49.99.

That's BTC3.9 / GHz min or about BTC5 / GHz average.

Looking at it that way, WIN.AVALON is a good buy.

Well if you want to compare then you have to take into account delivery dates.

The blades would arrive within a week.  When will the Avalons arrive?  How much will each GHz of blade hash-power mine in the interim?  Without that data a comparison is meaningless: using your logic you could compare to BFLs (which would work out far cheaper on paper - but ONLY exist on paper).

Only thing you can easily do a fair comparison is other batch 3 Avalon securities - as those are likely to arrive around same time and have same hashpower and reliability.

Ok, lets say the ASICMiner Block Erupter (like the name! ) arrives 7 days earlier.

A 1 GHz miner is currently (diff = 11187257) expected to produce about BTC0.045 per day on average.

For 7 days that's about 0.315 / GHz earned. So then subtracting accumulated income for comparison:

That's BTC3.585 / GHz min or about BTC4.685 / GHz average.

Probably should take the average (expected instead of overclocked) as the comparison number.

The two become even (at the current diff) in about 31 days. That is, at expected production, the Avalons could arrive 31 days later and the current price of Win.Avalon would still be as good as buying an ASICMiner Block Erupter.

[MikeMark]

I think this may be the current best choice among the various mining stocks available.

Reasons:

Issuer. Equipment. Timing. Price.

Requirement:

Investment. Patience.


Easy! 

[wisard]

I received an email from HorseRider today to discuss the refund offer as made by Avalon because of the delay in shipping.

Because it was a group order, I think the group collectively has to decide for or against a refund. We just have 16 out of 200 total modules bought by HorseRider - so can't swing the vote one way or another.

If the refund goes through - then we have 2 options:

1. Liquidate and distribute the refunded amount to share holders. As this may be low, I will distribute the 40 BTC or so from IPO too.

2. Or I can substitute the HorseRider Avalon's with other Avalon's I have personally invested in. But I've not invested in 4 units of 4 modules each outside of this - so will need to calculate and destroy the unsold shares.

[wisard]

Discussion on the HorseRider bulk purchase thread:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=158295.40

[wisard]

Also,

it is my recommendation to not buy Win.Avalon shares above the IPO price - unless you want to speculate on HorseRider not going for a refund.

According to my calculations, on liquidation, each share would receive a bit more than 0.0185 BTC.

[Kushedout]

Or...

1) Release more shares
2) purchase the Avalons from does who want refund.
3) Swing the vote
4) Pray for Avalon to start shipping after 14th.
5) BTCBTCBTC

[wisard]

So HorseRider had received the Avalons some time back.
He has sent the profits today - so dividends will be issued in an hour or so.

Some details:

HorseRider's BTC address where entire group's mining revenue goes to:
https://blockchain.info/address/1CZg4CTgLBk3LhrfthChZ4sh7NZwv6EX5P

HorseRider takes 10% management fees plus electricity.
Our stake is about 35% of the BTC that is earned in the above link.

HorseRider's payments to us:
https://blockchain.info/address/1J4fZYS4vTD3dBQCTW99XeeZTZm5AYJcQk

Growth fund BTC address:
https://blockchain.info/address/1Ksb8ANKsMUeFENQGXdGaRiLk1JDdCAwUY

[wisard]

Date: 16 August 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 33.76274218 BTC
Total dividend payments: 23.64 BTC

Total in growth fund: 10.12274218 BTC

[Kushedout]

Nice! Thanks Wizard.

[wisard]

So we may go with investing the growth funds with CoinHoarder's diversified group purchase.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=268280.0

If anyone has an objection or any better ideas, please let me know either here or by PM.
Thank you.

[Kushedout]

So we may go with investing the growth funds with CoinHoarder's diversified group purchase.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=268280.0

If anyone has an objection or any better ideas, please let me know either here or by PM.
Thank you.

That's a good idea. I already got some funds invested there.

[metal_jacke1]

You lost me with "China"

[wisard]

You lost me with "China"

Why?

Mining is not illegal in China. And HorseRider is very capable in dealing with any issues that come up.

[wisard]

Date: 25 August 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 24.76145455 BTC
Total dividend payments: 17.332896 BTC

Total in growth fund: 17.55130073 BTC

[wisard]

Date: 31 August 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 17.17057106 BTC
Total dividend payments: 12.01939200 BTC

Total in growth fund: 22.70247979 BTC

[salihno71]

Hi Wizard,
you have pm.

[wisard]

Date: 9 Sep 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 15.07947198 BTC
Total dividend payments: 10.55510400 BTC

Total in growth fund: 27.22684777 BTC

[wisard]

Date: 16 Sep 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 11.80674471 BTC
Total dividend payments: 8.26425600 BTC

Total in growth fund: 30.76933648 BTC

[wisard]

Date: 21 Sep 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 9.20591646 BTC
Total dividend payments: 6.44380800 BTC

Total in growth fund: 33.53144494 BTC

[wisard]

Date: 8 Oct 2013
Total shares: 67,200
Total revenue: 16.14024057 BTC
Total dividend payments: 11.29816840 BTC

Total in growth fund: 38.37402151 BTC

[Kushedout]

Any update on the divs?

[digit]

Any update on the divs?

any updates on an update :\

[wisard]

HorseRider moved to monthly dividends because the payout has been so low on mining.

Anyways Bitfunder is closing down on November 14. And I don't have the resources to manage the asset out side of Bitfunder.

I have created a buy wall from my personal funds for 0.00074 per share - which is more than what I think the asset is worth - as we cannot use the growth funds to buy new equipment (because no equipment on the market has a positive ROI as of now).

I recommend every one who wants to take advantage of the buy wall and take an exit.

I will make a final payment on Nov 11 and freeze trading after that - I will completely pay off the growth fund during the final payment.

Thank you.

Note: If anyone wants to take over managing the asset outside of bitfunder - or wants to buy the ASICs that are managed by HorseRider - send me a PM. Otherwise the above post stands and I'll wrap things up on 11 November.

[digit]

HorseRider moved to monthly dividends because the payout has been so low on mining.

Anyways Bitfunder is closing down on November 14. And I don't have the resources to manage the asset out side of Bitfunder.

I have created a buy wall from my personal funds for 0.00074 per share - which is more than what I think the asset is worth - as we cannot use the growth funds to buy new equipment (because no equipment on the market has a positive ROI as of now).

I recommend every one who wants to take advantage of the buy wall and take an exit.

I will make a final payment on Nov 11 and freeze trading after that - I will completely pay off the growth fund during the final payment.

Thank you.

Note: If anyone wants to take over managing the asset outside of bitfunder - or wants to buy the ASICs that are managed by HorseRider - send me a PM. Otherwise the above post stands and I'll wrap things up on 11 November.

how can we sell?  its impossible to place a sell order on bitfunder now unless verified.

[wisard]

how can we sell?  its impossible to place a sell order on bitfunder now unless verified.

Transfer your shares to user "wisard" - and then send me a PM with the number of shares you have transferred as well as your bitcoin address as listed on bitfunder. I will send you the BTC manually within a day or so.

Thank you.

[wisard]

November 11 2013

Final dividend of 0.00074 BTC per share has been paid and the asset has been frozen and closed.

Thank you.