It cost me $2 + 12 hours to send $25 in BTC now

[ProfessionalGoogler]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

[olushakes]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

I have ways maintained that if the people that matter concerning decision making when it comes to bitcoin could not do anything fast, I see other currencies taking over I could remember how a campaign could not pay as at when due because of high fees that would run in to several dollars until when everyone started looking for alternatives, and then the bitcoin they so much get greedy with becomes worthless in their own very eyes.

[peter0425]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Well, this high transaction fee is really a pain now. That's why I believed some people are moving away from bitcoin because of this. And I speculate that some have already did, moving to ETH that is why the price of ETH now is so high. And its so hard to see that this is not yet resolved until now. So it might be possible that ETH can overtake bitcoin because of this issue.

[Thekool1s]

I don't know in which mutli verse you are living in but the last time i checked the average transaction fee for ethereum was around $1.4 for each transaction. So it doesn't matter which coin you use, you will end up paying the same amount of fees

[Qartada]

I don't know in which mutli verse you are living in but the last time i checked the average transaction fee for ethereum was around $1.4 for each transaction. So it doesn't matter which coin you use, you will end up paying the same amount of fees

Unless you use a coin with low fees (e.g. DOGE for as long as it doesn't have a high transaction volume, and IOTA if it works out right), in which case the transaction fees will be perfectly low.

If you want to use an altcoin to pay low fees, just use an obscure one.  Even if they're not scalable, they'll be cheap for now (e.g. Litecoin).

If you want security and you want to send high amounts, use Bitcoin.

[25hashcoin]

Blame Core.

[BTCIV]

If you want security and you want to send high amounts, use Bitcoin.

That is where Monero comes in place. Agree Bitcoin is in a though position right now, something needs to be done until it's gonna be too late.

[25hashcoin]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

Nope. No one cares. They would rather bitcoin implode on itself than do anything but their slimy segwit settlement disaster. They will even tell users to use fiat instead. Fuck Core.

[OROBTC]

If you want security and you want to send high amounts, use Bitcoin.

That is where Monero comes in place. Agree Bitcoin is in a though position right now, something needs to be done until it's gonna be too late.

Monero is one of the alts that may catch on, I am keeping an eye this one.  Note that I have never bought or traded any alts, so my comment means little other than Monero is designed for privacy, which IMO will become a more important issue going forward.

But, for making larger trx, BTC works just fine for me.  I pay up.  But, at some point, many people will abandon BTC if they don't fix the scaling problem(s).

It is receiving small payments that is the problem re confirmation.

[coolcoinz]

I don't know in which mutli verse you are living in but the last time i checked the average transaction fee for ethereum was around $1.4 for each transaction. So it doesn't matter which coin you use, you will end up paying the same amount of fees

That's true fees are going up along with the price of the currency, it's natural. Bitcoin fees are going up too fast because of block size issues it's facing, but if this gets resolved we'll still be facing the problem of rising fees. It may take a year or two, but eventually we'll go back to >$1 fees.
Ether is being hyped now, but it's not better. People are putting money there to profit not because it's revolutionary.

[Qartada]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

They will even tell users to use fiat instead. Fuck Core.

Anyone who did the slightest bit of research into this statement would realise that it is a lie.

Then use fiat. Pretty sure they'll charge you more than 0.5% for the same service.

He's suggesting that fiat fees are typically higher than Bitcoin fees when sending a higher amount.  Not to mention that credit card fees (in some countries), end up being even higher than that.

[baam25]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

I know, the fees are absolutely ridiculous. Something has to give!!!  

how can I convince my friends on the superiority of this technology when it costs this much money? Only the fat cats right now are getting rich, this technology should be for the masses

we have to fight back  

[buenav]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

I agree the fees are a problem but Ethereum transactions are starting to experience some of the same problems, namely that the fees are rising due to network congestion.

[raymond541]

fees now really problem for small amount sender.$2 is really high for who want to sending under $100.fees now seems like business Blockchain.info stop their multi send option.you can now send 1 wallet to 1 wallet.someone said up above sending 3 million dollar cost $2 well this good but how many people sending 3 million dollar?
I see every block have 90% transactions are under $100 transaction.if block size not increase bitcoin will fall in big trouble.

[25hashcoin]

This is why you should boycott Blockstream and their Core influence. They have a flawed vision of bitcoin: https://mobile.twitter.com/excellion/status/783994642463326208

[1Referee]

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Ethereum fees are not that low either. Even stronger, they are increasing on a weekly basis. I am seeing +$1 fees being pumped through basically in every minted Ethereum block, and some transactions even top $3 in fees. Just wait for it, these fees will only increase in the coming months, where at some point people will start to change their mind about how cheap these fees really are...

[Pearls Before Swine]

Makes more sense to send fiat, wouldn't it?  I mean seriously, spending 10% just to pay for something or whatever, that's insanity.  It's incentive to use cash money and not bitcoin...or at least an altcoin with lower fees.  Did you need to do this transaction with bitcoin?

I'm quite tired of this myself.  The blockchain wallet, which is what I use, while generally not too bad, has a sort of low fee.  Others are just ripoffs.

[Pearls Before Swine]

Makes more sense to send fiat, wouldn't it?  I mean seriously, spending 10% just to pay for something or whatever, that's insanity.  It's incentive to use cash money and not bitcoin...or at least an altcoin with lower fees.  Did you need to do this transaction with bitcoin?

I'm quite tired of this myself.  The blockchain wallet, which is what I use, while generally not too bad, has a sort of low fee.  Others are just ripoffs.

[TryNinja]

This is why you should boycott Blockstream and their Core influence. They have a flawed vision of bitcoin: https://mobile.twitter.com/excellion/status/783994642463326208

I believe this tweet ends up passing a wrong view of what Samson really wanted to mean.

His answer to someone on the same chain of tweets: https://twitter.com/Excellion/status/784007812896714752
that's fine in concept. But do you really think people subsisting on $2 a day are computer literate enough to safely transact BTC?

This isn't what we really need to be thinking off and it does not really justify what he is doing, but in some way it's actually true and I understand his point.

[DrMatrix]

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Ethereum fees are not that low either. Even stronger, they are increasing on a weekly basis. I am seeing +$1 fees being pumped through basically in every minted Ethereum block, and some transactions even top $3 in fees. Just wait for it, these fees will only increase in the coming months, where at some point people will start to change their mind about how cheap these fees really are...

I have very little knowledge about all the fees structure works as far as fees increasing based on the blockchains (i am going to look into it) however, it is surprising to hear that ETH apparently has these such high fees already, considering BTC has been around alot longer.

Any experts have any predictions on what the ETH fees might be a year or two from now if it continues gaining popularity?

[Celsiuss]

This is really sad, spending bitcoins is becoming harder and harder, and I hope ethereum will take over as it seems like a more ideal coin to use because of fees and confirmation times.

[asdalani]

Makes more sense to send fiat, wouldn't it?  I mean seriously, spending 10% just to pay for something or whatever, that's insanity.  It's incentive to use cash money and not bitcoin...or at least an altcoin with lower fees.  Did you need to do this transaction with bitcoin?

I'm quite tired of this myself.  The blockchain wallet, which is what I use, while generally not too bad, has a sort of low fee.  Others are just ripoffs.

That’s why people shouldn’t spend money that they plan on spending within the year. Bitcoin investments should only be placed in such a manner where the money won’t move unless the investor plans on cashing it out when the price goes up. If that investor plans on cashing out his Bitcoin then he/she won’t get back into Bitcoin because it wouldn’t make any sense for him to do so.

[lighpulsar07]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Yes ethereum will take over if this confirmation delays keeps up but the DCG and the other 58 companies world wide along with the miners signed the bitcoin scaling agreement. So we will have segwit sooner and a 2mb hardfork.I know this confirmation delays pissed you off but we have nothing to do about it.

[shinratensei_]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

If you have tried for using the recommended fees from the blockchain and I think you will get low fees. Read this https://medium.com/@DCGco/bitcoin-scaling-agreement-at-consensus-2017-133521fe9a77
I think so, there is a chance for ethereum to take the bitcoin's place. The ethereum chain can be processed up to 40 Txs in a second.

[ImHash]

Then use Ethereum you little noob, let bitcoin for grown ups. developers have nothing to do with this, they are not employees of any where or anyone, there are no organization to pay them for their job, they have zero obligation and it's no one's job actually to do anything for bitcoin, they only propose changes that's all, it's up to miners to activate any proposals.
I honestly don't know how you managed to pay $2 and wait 12 hours, because I'm doing at least 1 transaction every day paying $1 up to $2 and it confirms less than 30 minutes.

[ProfessionalGoogler]

Then use Ethereum you little noob, let bitcoin for grown ups. developers have nothing to do with this, they are not employees of any where or anyone, there are no organization to pay them for their job, they have zero obligation and it's no one's job actually to do anything for bitcoin, they only propose changes that's all, it's up to miners to activate any proposals.
I honestly don't know how you managed to pay $2 and wait 12 hours, because I'm doing at least 1 transaction every day paying $1 up to $2 and it confirms less than 30 minutes.

You remind me of Wells Fargo.

I use blockchain.info as I mentioned before.

[DOGE12321]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Yeah transaction fees and confirmation times are becoming a major issue in the Bitcoin community. I have faced a similar issue with a slightly higher transaction. The only suggestion that I can give is to use accelerators and place the fastest and most economical transaction rate. At the moment this is 450-satoshi/byte. This website will keep you updated on the rate: https://bitcoinfees.21.co/

[Astvile]

Dude just try to understand the state of bitcoins and its network now,bitcoin network now is facing too many spam attacks and problems so they took longer to confirm transaction now matter how high is the fees.It is a normal situation right now

[Tyrantt]

 Well we're  all hoping for the segwit implementation on 1st of august and for this fee problem to be fixed. For the transaction of 0.015btc I use about 1.5$ for transaction not to get stuck as I've had that problem before. Bitcoin just needs to survive, safety is the priority.

[jubalix]

IOTA $0 fees forever.

and you wonder why it has a 2B MKT CAP

[Silberman]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

It is an issue and it is so important that the developers already created a solution for it in the form of segwit the problem is that it has not been activated, and it seems they have taken another approach by using BIP 148 UASF, basically they will reject any blocks that are not signaling segwit support, this is in my opinion a risky maneuver but it shows that the developers care about the speed of confirmation.

[pooya87]

It cost me $2 + 12 hours to send $25 in BTC now
Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

[sarcasm mode: on]
this is the most rational argument i have ever heard. ethereum will replace bitcoin soon, we will go to ethereum and pay $1.5 per transaction instead of paying what OP paid ($2) and if the eth tx fee trend continues on this path we will soon pay $21 per transaction in 3 months (another 1300% rise).

lets all switch to ethereum right now, transactions are so cheap



https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/ethereum-transactionfees.html#3m

[krishnapramod]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Yeah, the current situation is definitely making bitcoin unusable for smaller transactions, around 10 to 15% in fee and if you are sending $20 or $200 the fee is the same in bytes.

The developers and the majority wants Segwit to be activated, but it could be done by two means and this is where the problem starts. BIP 148 would activate Segwit without much cooperation from miners and there is Segwit2x, Segwit + 2 MB block size increase.

Segwit2x (hard fork) would start running from July 21, https://segwit2x.github.io

BIP 148 would be deployed on August 1.

Both of them have a the same agenda, to activate Segwit, but they are not compatible with each other. And a collision between these two would split the chain.

It is highly likely that BIP 148 would be deployed on August 1.

The fee is an issue and would be until August 1 and if the chain splits fee would not be the only thing we would be worrying about.

[leyton11]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Sure, I will choose ETH if I need send money now because it fast more and fee lower than BTC, when BTC can fix issue confirm transaction slow and hight fee, I will comeback to it. I just wait in end yaer 2017 Bitcoin Segwit!

[Pearls Before Swine]

Makes more sense to send fiat, wouldn't it?  I mean seriously, spending 10% just to pay for something or whatever, that's insanity.  It's incentive to use cash money and not bitcoin...or at least an altcoin with lower fees.  Did you need to do this transaction with bitcoin?

I'm quite tired of this myself.  The blockchain wallet, which is what I use, while generally not too bad, has a sort of low fee.  Others are just ripoffs.

And just how are you going to send that money? If you're buying a good or service PayPal will charge $1.025 and it takes a lot longer to get the money and have it be spendable. You could do a bank wire for $15, or a money order for $1.25 and again a much longe time. You could throw it in an envelope and pray that it makes it, but I don't see how sending fiat could be better in anyway.

Ehhh...I got a PayPal debit card, so it's spendable to immediately.   And I don't know what you're talking about as far as that fee goes.   I don't pay anything when I spend PayPal.  Maybe that's just a U.S. thing.

[RoommateAgreement]

It cost me $2 + 12 hours to send $25 in BTC now
Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

[sarcasm mode: on]
this is the most rational argument i have ever heard. ethereum will replace bitcoin soon, we will go to ethereum and pay $1.5 per transaction instead of paying what OP paid ($2) and if the eth tx fee trend continues on this path we will soon pay $21 per transaction in 3 months (another 1300% rise).

lets all switch to ethereum right now, transactions are so cheap



https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/ethereum-transactionfees.html#3m

i have found out that most people who say an altcoin is better than bitcoin and will replace it have never used an altcoin in their lives before which is why they only THINK they are better.
i doubt OP even has an ethereum wallet to know what is going on and how much fees that shitcoin will cost him! he is just hyped up because ETH is being pumped...

[Juggy777]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Well I do understand your frustration op, I realised the same when I was trying to send 0.84 $ and I had to pay 2$ in fees so I junked the transaction. Well the fees is a big pain, but to say eth will take over no I don't agree with it, eth is a alt it always will be a alt, alts come and go Bitcoin is here to stay strong. Eth is only being marketed well and hence I am bit wary of it in the long term.

[ProfessionalGoogler]

It cost me $2 + 12 hours to send $25 in BTC now
Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

[sarcasm mode: on]
this is the most rational argument i have ever heard. ethereum will replace bitcoin soon, we will go to ethereum and pay $1.5 per transaction instead of paying what OP paid ($2) and if the eth tx fee trend continues on this path we will soon pay $21 per transaction in 3 months (another 1300% rise).

lets all switch to ethereum right now, transactions are so cheap



https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/ethereum-transactionfees.html#3m

i have found out that most people who say an altcoin is better than bitcoin and will replace it have never used an altcoin in their lives before which is why they only THINK they are better.
i doubt OP even has an ethereum wallet to know what is going on and how much fees that shitcoin will cost him! he is just hyped up because ETH is being pumped...

I have only ever believed in BTC and ETH and show support for BTU. You can make stuff up all you want. Does not make it true.

Due to advances in blockchain research, it was shown that significantly lower block times were possible and perhaps beneficial given the current connectivity of the internet. One of the potential risks of a low block time is a higher rate of orphaned blocks (competing blocks that do not make it into the main chain). To counter this, a GHOST protocol is used which pays for these orphaned blocks (known as uncles), adding to the security of the main chain. Instead of the main chain being "longest", it is instead "heaviest".

During the development of Ethereum, several different times and targeting algorithms were tested, eventually settling around 15s. Due to the specific total difficulty calculation used, the actual time between blocks is currently around 17 seconds, however a change scheduled for Homestead will hopefully alter this closer to 15 seconds. This is only proposed as a temporary solution, as Ethereum intends to transition to proof-of-stake, potentially offering near-instant finality.

[bill gator]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

I don't know why you think Ethereum would be any better if equally as many people used it, or if everyone switched as you're suggesting. It would be victim to the same problems that you're experiencing now; the solution isn't to run away From the problem to deal with it another day, we need to discuss how to make the Bitcoin protocol better and more accountable to the influx off transactions that follow price changes!

[ProfessionalGoogler]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

I don't know why you think Ethereum would be any better if equally as many people used it, or if everyone switched as you're suggesting. It would be victim to the same problems that you're experiencing now; the solution isn't to run away From the problem to deal with it another day, we need to discuss how to make the Bitcoin protocol better and more accountable to the influx off transactions that follow price changes!

Ethereum tackles the solution and continues to do so - you can be blind all you want and believe what the trolls here say, still does not make it true.

Due to advances in blockchain research, it was shown that significantly lower block times were possible and perhaps beneficial given the current connectivity of the internet. One of the potential risks of a low block time is a higher rate of orphaned blocks (competing blocks that do not make it into the main chain). To counter this, a GHOST protocol is used which pays for these orphaned blocks (known as uncles), adding to the security of the main chain. Instead of the main chain being "longest", it is instead "heaviest".

During the development of Ethereum, several different times and targeting algorithms were tested, eventually settling around 15s. Due to the specific total difficulty calculation used, the actual time between blocks is currently around 17 seconds, however a change scheduled for Homestead will hopefully alter this closer to 15 seconds. This is only proposed as a temporary solution, as Ethereum intends to transition to proof-of-stake, potentially offering near-instant finality.

[RoommateAgreement]

snipped...

I have only ever believed in BTC and ETH and show support for BTU. You can make stuff up all you want. Does not make it true.

Due to advances in blockchain research, it was shown that significantly lower block times were possible and perhaps beneficial given the current connectivity of the internet. One of the potential risks of a low block time is a higher rate of orphaned blocks (competing blocks that do not make it into the main chain). To counter this, a GHOST protocol is used which pays for these orphaned blocks (known as uncles), adding to the security of the main chain. Instead of the main chain being "longest", it is instead "heaviest".

During the development of Ethereum, several different times and targeting algorithms were tested, eventually settling around 15s. Due to the specific total difficulty calculation used, the actual time between blocks is currently around 17 seconds, however a change scheduled for Homestead will hopefully alter this closer to 15 seconds. This is only proposed as a temporary solution, as Ethereum intends to transition to proof-of-stake, potentially offering near-instant finality.

what you are saying in OP and what you quoted is regarding transaction fees not block time!
let me break it down for you.
you paid $2 in bitcoin, which has been the popular coin for 8-9 years and has been handling lots of transactions daily with its blocks full for about a year and has had a mempool full of 50K to 80K unconfirmed ones and block time is 10 minutes on average.

in ethereum you will have to pay the same amount of fee and it is not even popular for transaction making but only for trading, the number of daily transactions for ETH is 1/4 of bitcoin and bock time is 15 seconds (~40 times faster) and doesn't have any backlog and there is no blocks are full. but the fees have been rising faster than bitcoin!

now you choose between them for your transactions!

[jorneyflair]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

If you're not ready to use such high fees then use an altcoin. Steem currently has 0 transaction fees for miners for both Steem and Steem dollars(which is an asset that is pegged thereotically to 1 USD value but can fluctuate wildly depending on market conditions). Dogecoins still has the standard 1 doge transaction fee which is ridiculously cheap right now.

Ethereum itself has a high transaction fee, so i'm not sure why you're suggesting that ethereum will be overtaking bitcoin. Sure, the market capitalization is a close race at the moment, but you have to consider the fact that when Ethereum withdrawal fees on major exchanges are 0.01 ETH and 1 ETH is worth $400, it actually equates to more in transaction fees paid in fiat terms than btc(0.001*2700=$2.7).

You could try paying a lower fee and use a free transaction acceleration service as well, but you'r etaking on a risk here.

[Thekool1s]

Ethereum tackles the solution and continues to do so - you can be blind all you want and believe what the trolls here say, still does not make it true.

Alright this proves it, This guy is a troll. Did you bother reading the replies above you? Or Did you even bother to "Google"? The Fees are still hovering above $1.2 plus you failed to mention how much dust you were trying to transfer, Yes bitcoin has become inefficient recently to transfer dust, but so has ethereum. Just look at the current transaction fee.

https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/ethereum-transactionfees.html

[Betwrong]

Sure sounds like a slow process but the same can be said as: "It only cost $2 to send 3 million USD, and it securely is ready for spending by the other party in only 12 hours! No third party signing off required!"

Exactly, and actually the situation with time taking for the first confirmation is even better. Whatever amount you want to transfer in BTC it will surely be confirmed in 60 minutes (and most likely in 30 minutes) when you pay 360+ satoshis/byte which means you'll pay $2.7 max for your transaction.

[dunfida]

Sure sounds like a slow process but the same can be said as: "It only cost $2 to send 3 million USD, and it securely is ready for spending by the other party in only 12 hours! No third party signing off required!"

Exactly, and actually the situation with time taking for the first confirmation is even better. Whatever amount you want to transfer in BTC it will surely be confirmed in 60 minutes when you pay 360+ satoshis/byte which means you'll pay $2.7 max for your transaction.

This would really affect you up when you do make micro transactions but when we are talking about big amounts then these fees wont really bother at all and as op said eth might surpass bitcoin if this situation continues and I would like to say that fees on Eth is still high and they are just breakeven.They do only differ on confirmation speeds.

[danherbias07]

And do you think Ethereum womt have the same kind of issues once it bloated in population there?
With a lot of transactions that is being processed it is hard to maintain that.
Why not try other wallets if you are having problem with just one.
There is a lot out there and you are paying high. They will gladly escort you into making it faster.

[fabrizeo]

fees now really problem for small amount sender.$2 is really high for who want to sending under $100.fees now seems like business Blockchain.info stop their multi send option.you can now send 1 wallet to 1 wallet.someone said up above sending 3 million dollar cost $2 well this good but how many people sending 3 million dollar?
I see every block have 90% transactions are under $100 transaction.if block size does not increase bitcoin will fall in big trouble.

The average amount of transaction in the US was 140 usd in 2017 on Desktop. Makes me wonder who is going to use bitcoin to make online purchase.
Bitcoin : long confirmation time, high fee, no insurance
Credit card : instant confirmation, low fee, insured by visa and your bank.

honestly, where is the advantage for the average consumer?

[Lorilikes]

It is frustrating that a 20 dollar transaction results in approximately 4.00 dollars after all the hands get their part of the goods.   It makes it feel like the only transactions that are going to make sense for Bitcoin are the big ones.  Otherwise too much slips away into frivolous fees.

[1Referee]

And do you think Ethereum womt have the same kind of issues once it bloated in population there?

It's a lack of understanding, mainly. People can't make up the difference between empty (empty in the way that they receive barely any usage) networks, and networks that are under constant pressure by loads of transactions waiting in line to get confirmed. Another major problem is forming due to people farming faucets, farming captcha sites, doing certain tasks for small numbers of coins, etc. If people try to move these funds, and especially when combined, they take up a serious amount of block space, and thus you will have to pay for it - whining about high fees won't solve anything.

[Nicol3]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

So sad that the dev team are not doing anything about it. It has been an issue for the high price for every transactions we make. And we'll never know too, if and if Ethereum will take over Bitcoin and will become over populated do you think this issue won't happen all over again?

[687_2]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

There are so many good options for making small, fast and almost free transfers: PayPal, Venmo, wechat, etc. PayPal even lets you transfer for free. Why can't you use any of those?  

[nelmari]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

So sad that the dev team are not doing anything about it. It has been an issue for the high price for every transactions we make. And we'll never know too, if and if Ethereum will take over Bitcoin and will become over populated do you think this issue won't happen all over again?

I agree, there is a huge possibilty it would happen to Ethereum too. With the numbers increasing everyday, people transferring from Bitcoin to Ethereum I'm sure it would also clog up the transactions if a lot of people will be using Ethereum instead of Bitcoin. And the fees of Ethereum are not that cheap as far as what I've encountered.

[iv4n]

I don't know in which mutli verse you are living in but the last time i checked the average transaction fee for ethereum was around $1.4 for each transaction. So it doesn't matter which coin you use, you will end up paying the same amount of fees

I didn't know this, nice information to know, it would be nice if someone who is using many coins to post here how much is transaction for each coin, that would be good to know.
Transaction fees are rising like crazy, and judging by your comment same is happening with other alts, for my financial situation fees are really high and I rethink every time when I wish to send some mBTC-s.
I wish to ask a question: Will we ever see lower transaction fees or they will just keep rising?

[AjithBtc]

It is frustrating that a 20 dollar transaction results in approximately 4.00 dollars after all the hands get their part of the goods.   It makes it feel like the only transactions that are going to make sense for Bitcoin are the big ones.  Otherwise too much slips away into frivolous fees.

Looking the scenario it's clear that the one who profit with the bitcoin transaction is the huge volume bitcoin transaction makers. For smaller​ transaction, the fee is completely higher and this will eventually cause a big problem with the small scale transaction makers and service renders.

[Betwrong]

Sure sounds like a slow process but the same can be said as: "It only cost $2 to send 3 million USD, and it securely is ready for spending by the other party in only 12 hours! No third party signing off required!"

Exactly, and actually the situation with time taking for the first confirmation is even better. Whatever amount you want to transfer in BTC it will surely be confirmed in 60 minutes when you pay 360+ satoshis/byte which means you'll pay $2.7 max for your transaction.

This would really affect you up when you do make micro transactions but when we are talking about big amounts then these fees wont really bother at all and as op said eth might surpass bitcoin if this situation continues and I would like to say that fees on Eth is still high and they are just breakeven.They do only differ on confirmation speeds.

True. It looks like it is better to use Ethereum for small transactions. But then I have a question: Why not to use Litecoin for small transactions since transaction fees for LTC are much smaller than for ETH?

[BitcoinzB]

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

Ethereum fees are not that low either. Even stronger, they are increasing on a weekly basis. I am seeing +$1 fees being pumped through basically in every minted Ethereum block, and some transactions even top $3 in fees. Just wait for it, these fees will only increase in the coming months, where at some point people will start to change their mind about how cheap these fees really are...

I was looking to switch to ethereum to avoid the high fees we are experiencing with Bitcoin right now.. but I've noticed that aswell!
I thought fees would be much lower for an alt coin, but I was definitely wrong in this case

[linkme]

i think it's normal, every e-currency should increase their fees so that Bitcoin's high fees are just normal

[DrMatrix]

What I do enjoy about bitcoin is the ability to adjust our fees, sure it might not always be ideal to do that, but it's nice to have a choice.

I need to look up this update someone talked about that the devs have coming in the near future to help with fees.

[ProfessionalGoogler]

snipped...

I have only ever believed in BTC and ETH and show support for BTU. You can make stuff up all you want. Does not make it true.

Due to advances in blockchain research, it was shown that significantly lower block times were possible and perhaps beneficial given the current connectivity of the internet. One of the potential risks of a low block time is a higher rate of orphaned blocks (competing blocks that do not make it into the main chain). To counter this, a GHOST protocol is used which pays for these orphaned blocks (known as uncles), adding to the security of the main chain. Instead of the main chain being "longest", it is instead "heaviest".

During the development of Ethereum, several different times and targeting algorithms were tested, eventually settling around 15s. Due to the specific total difficulty calculation used, the actual time between blocks is currently around 17 seconds, however a change scheduled for Homestead will hopefully alter this closer to 15 seconds. This is only proposed as a temporary solution, as Ethereum intends to transition to proof-of-stake, potentially offering near-instant finality.

what you are saying in OP and what you quoted is regarding transaction fees not block time!
let me break it down for you.
you paid $2 in bitcoin, which has been the popular coin for 8-9 years and has been handling lots of transactions daily with its blocks full for about a year and has had a mempool full of 50K to 80K unconfirmed ones and block time is 10 minutes on average.

in ethereum you will have to pay the same amount of fee and it is not even popular for transaction making but only for trading, the number of daily transactions for ETH is 1/4 of bitcoin and bock time is 15 seconds (~40 times faster) and doesn't have any backlog and there is no blocks are full. but the fees have been rising faster than bitcoin!

now you choose between them for your transactions!

You apparently don't understand Ethereum operates (gets updates) --- differently (better management), and that Bitcoin has a chance to adjust as well, or else you help provide support for BTU.

In that case you are stuck in that past. Like AOL and Yahoo!

Anyway, I will for sure be supporting Bitcoin Unlimited because of posts such as yours.

Caveman!

[RoommateAgreement]

snipped...

I have only ever believed in BTC and ETH and show support for BTU. You can make stuff up all you want. Does not make it true.

Due to advances in blockchain research, it was shown that significantly lower block times were possible and perhaps beneficial given the current connectivity of the internet. One of the potential risks of a low block time is a higher rate of orphaned blocks (competing blocks that do not make it into the main chain). To counter this, a GHOST protocol is used which pays for these orphaned blocks (known as uncles), adding to the security of the main chain. Instead of the main chain being "longest", it is instead "heaviest".

During the development of Ethereum, several different times and targeting algorithms were tested, eventually settling around 15s. Due to the specific total difficulty calculation used, the actual time between blocks is currently around 17 seconds, however a change scheduled for Homestead will hopefully alter this closer to 15 seconds. This is only proposed as a temporary solution, as Ethereum intends to transition to proof-of-stake, potentially offering near-instant finality.

what you are saying in OP and what you quoted is regarding transaction fees not block time!
let me break it down for you.
you paid $2 in bitcoin, which has been the popular coin for 8-9 years and has been handling lots of transactions daily with its blocks full for about a year and has had a mempool full of 50K to 80K unconfirmed ones and block time is 10 minutes on average.

in ethereum you will have to pay the same amount of fee and it is not even popular for transaction making but only for trading, the number of daily transactions for ETH is 1/4 of bitcoin and bock time is 15 seconds (~40 times faster) and doesn't have any backlog and there is no blocks are full. but the fees have been rising faster than bitcoin!

now you choose between them for your transactions!

You apparently don't understand Ethereum operates (gets updates) --- differently (better management), and that Bitcoin has a chance to adjust as well, or else you help provide support for BTU.

In that case you are stuck in that past. Like AOL and Yahoo!

Anyway, I will for sure be supporting Bitcoin Unlimited because of posts such as yours.

Caveman!

it seems like it doesn't matter what anyone says you are just looking for an excuse to support buggy Bitcoin Unlimited. and the funny thing is BU is the reason why we are in this mess because they divided everything and prevented us from moving forward!

[Seansky]

snipped...

I have only ever believed in BTC and ETH and show support for BTU. You can make stuff up all you want. Does not make it true.

Due to advances in blockchain research, it was shown that significantly lower block times were possible and perhaps beneficial given the current connectivity of the internet. One of the potential risks of a low block time is a higher rate of orphaned blocks (competing blocks that do not make it into the main chain). To counter this, a GHOST protocol is used which pays for these orphaned blocks (known as uncles), adding to the security of the main chain. Instead of the main chain being "longest", it is instead "heaviest".

During the development of Ethereum, several different times and targeting algorithms were tested, eventually settling around 15s. Due to the specific total difficulty calculation used, the actual time between blocks is currently around 17 seconds, however a change scheduled for Homestead will hopefully alter this closer to 15 seconds. This is only proposed as a temporary solution, as Ethereum intends to transition to proof-of-stake, potentially offering near-instant finality.

what you are saying in OP and what you quoted is regarding transaction fees not block time!
let me break it down for you.
you paid $2 in bitcoin, which has been the popular coin for 8-9 years and has been handling lots of transactions daily with its blocks full for about a year and has had a mempool full of 50K to 80K unconfirmed ones and block time is 10 minutes on average.

in ethereum you will have to pay the same amount of fee and it is not even popular for transaction making but only for trading, the number of daily transactions for ETH is 1/4 of bitcoin and bock time is 15 seconds (~40 times faster) and doesn't have any backlog and there is no blocks are full. but the fees have been rising faster than bitcoin!

now you choose between them for your transactions!

You apparently don't understand Ethereum operates (gets updates) --- differently (better management), and that Bitcoin has a chance to adjust as well, or else you help provide support for BTU.

In that case you are stuck in that past. Like AOL and Yahoo!

Anyway, I will for sure be supporting Bitcoin Unlimited because of posts such as yours.

Caveman!

BTU is not the solution to the problem we have at hand. It is just another bullshit proposal and segwit or segwit2x is the best solution not BTU. What anyone says is irrelevant to you though you just want to express your support for bitcoin unlimited, I guess we have our own opinions so I won't say that you are wrong for supporting it.

[ufaiz50]

indeed many are turning to eth because of the smaller transaction fee but that's my opinion has been a long  that's happen but in fact bitcoin is still widely used especially for large-value transactions. for the transaction itself eth already take over bitcoin but as number one of cryptocurrency bitcoin still far standing above eth.

[pooya87]

indeed many are turning to eth because of the smaller transaction fee but that's my opinion has been a long  that's happen but in fact bitcoin is still widely used especially for large-value transactions. for the transaction itself eth already take over bitcoin but as number one of cryptocurrency bitcoin still far standing above eth.

it is not true at all. people have only turned to ethereum because it was pumped and made them a good amount of money. they have been doing that for years with different altcoins and this time they did that not only with ETH but with a lot of other altcoins. take a look at their price history and you will see!

but they certainly did NOT turn into eth because of its transaction fees because if you have take some time to read previous comments you can see the screenshot i shared in page 2 about the extremely high transaction fees of ethereum. and besides nobody makes any transaction on ETH because there is no reason to do so apart from participating in an ICO or moving funds between your wallet and exchange wallet!
and if anybody wants cheaper transactions there are a LOT of other altcoins with nearly free transactions such as Dogecoin! or LTC

[arimamib]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

yeah ethereum the best way for make a transaction for right now. its only about 2-3 minutes.

[carlfebz2]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

yeah ethereum the best way for make a transaction for right now. its only about 2-3 minutes.

I wouldn't argue with this since I experience the fast confirmation of ETH transactions I can say that its a lot way better than on the current state of bitcoin, there might people who do use ETH as of now over bitcoin but we cant really remove that people do always love bitcoin inspite of its problem regarding on high fees.I don't know on whats ahead on bitcoin path if this would continue. $2 fee is already average as of now I guess.

[Amph]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

So sad that the dev team are not doing anything about it. It has been an issue for the high price for every transactions we make. And we'll never know too, if and if Ethereum will take over Bitcoin and will become over populated do you think this issue won't happen all over again?

they are doing what they can but the ultimate decision is based on consensus, not on centralized team behind bitcoin that decide everything, and the OP is forgettign that ETH also has under the table a thing like raiden network that will work like the LN

this mean that they are not in a position to de-throne bitcoin without any addition

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

yeah ethereum the best way for make a transaction for right now. its only about 2-3 minutes.

not accepted in any shop like bitcoin, therefore having a cool time on tx means nothing to me, it's a useless coin for now

[haroldtee]

This is actually becoming extremely alarming and I hope the devs will do something soon. Paying that much for such a lengthy period of transaction is just a NO NO. Dragging this scaling issue and not uniting will cause more harm than good for the bitcoin community giving chance for an alternative to take over the throne which I'm sure no bitcoin enthusiast wants.

[DoublerHunter]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

The only thing that i know why ethereum is going up and trying to take over bitcoin is because of its smart contacts that are mostly ICOs and that is the only thing why the price is crazy and always going up to the highest point. Ethereum will be just for smart contacts while bitcoin can be the currency itself and we should not be complaining to the fees and speed of transaction because it is part of the growth and the people in the team of bitcoin are really working hard to find solutions for these like Segwit.

[Silberman]

I don't know in which mutli verse you are living in but the last time i checked the average transaction fee for ethereum was around $1.4 for each transaction. So it doesn't matter which coin you use, you will end up paying the same amount of fees

This, the day you could send dust from one side of the planet to the other almost free are over, we must accept it and move on, yes there are problems with the network but these problems are being addressed and will eventually be solved, but still I do not think we are going to go back to those days.

[ynatopak14]

until now it is happening here in philippines though they shortended the time .. the fee still at high cost

[xskl0]

SAD! For this reason now I use only Bitcoin Cash

[25hashcoin]

Use Bitcoin Cash. I gave up on segwit high fee coin.

[zuliph9]

SAD! For this reason now I use only Bitcoin Cash

Agreed, a bit worrying

I recently bought both coins - can't use bitcoin cash since no one accepts it yet and can't use btc since it's asking for 2.50$ on a 10$ tx

Are we really waiting for lightning to fix this ?

[25hashcoin]

SAD! For this reason now I use only Bitcoin Cash

Agreed, a bit worrying

I recently bought both coins - can't use bitcoin cash since no one accepts it yet and can't use btc since it's asking for 2.50$ on a 10$ tx

Are we really waiting for lightning to fix this ?

Nope, just waiting for merchants and services to pivot to Bitcoin Cash. Won't be long.

[Monnt]

SAD! For this reason now I use only Bitcoin Cash

Agreed, a bit worrying

I recently bought both coins - can't use bitcoin cash since no one accepts it yet and can't use btc since it's asking for 2.50$ on a 10$ tx

Are we really waiting for lightning to fix this ?

Nope, just waiting for merchants and services to pivot to Bitcoin Cash. Won't be long.

Well…too bad to see things roll out this way. You know, what is the Lightening Network even made for? I thought the Lightening Network has been released because I came Bitfury website where they discussed their successful taste of the lightning network…but I’m still seeing nothing. Hope it gets implemented soon, and let me see how it works out.

[BitcoinBarrel]

Try selling/trading gold and then come back and talk about fees.

[iamaruf]

Now Bitcoin transaction taking too much time.A few days ago I send Bitcoin another address which was very urgent.And I pay the 18$ fee for the fast transaction.Miners accepted within 2 minutes.But it took about 7-8 hours to confirm my transaction.which was expensive and boring.

[skyline247]

Now Bitcoin transaction taking too much time.A few days ago I send Bitcoin another address which was very urgent.And I pay the 18$ fee for the fast transaction.Miners accepted within 2 minutes.But it took about 7-8 hours to confirm my transaction.which was expensive and boring.

You paid $18 fee?!

This is too much my friend. You must be sending a whole lot of Bitcoin to pay an $18 fee. Well, I suppose that actually you raised the fee very high for this high priority transaction. Hopefully there will be measures in place to lower fees in the future to save us money.

[danherbias07]

I have sent $30 and paid $2 and waited 24hours but that doesn't mean after that I will say ethereum will take over. 
Do you really think you could pull all the people by just this one problem? It happened to most of us not just you but we are still here. Try to understand how many out there are just sending low fees. Hell, even VIABTC's 100 hash accelerator are depleted in just minutes and every hour that does happen. Why do you think that is happening? You are not the only user here and the number of users that are doing transactions is not equal to the number of miners that confirms it.

[Doms]

The fees have somewhat increased after the August 1 event. Prior to that, there was a period of maybe two or three weeks when the transactions where confirmed quickly and fees were average. Now, it takes over a dollar to send a $20 transaction, which I think is still fair, for as long as the waiting time don’t last for over an hour. I think since the hard fork, many people had their confidence back in doing transactions which leads to a bit of congestion that results in higher fees and slower processing times.

[greeklogos]

I use Blockchain.info wallet and I can't say their minimal fee for transaction >1 hour is too much. Maybe in dollars it is, but in bitcoins it is stayed the same like it was years ago. i recommend you to try to save some good amount first, like 100$ before to withdraw. With all that little sum you only loose. Good luck!

[deadsilent]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

That's a bad thing about bitcoin. The fee is going higher and higher. Owning bitcoin now is getting harder and expensive these days. Small people like me can't afford transacting because fee is too high. I usually send small amount. 15-20 dollars plus the fee $4. $4 is huge for me. Fee will slowy kill bitcoin. They must do something about this.

Now Bitcoin transaction taking too much time.A few days ago I send Bitcoin another address which was very urgent.And I pay the 18$ fee for the fast transaction.Miners accepted within 2 minutes.But it took about 7-8 hours to confirm my transaction.which was expensive and boring.

Wow! This bigger than i thought. With that amount of fee, it still takes hours to confirm? That sucks.
If this continues, many bitcoin owners will switch to altcoins. I see IOTA becoming huge. It actually satoshipay replace bitcoin for IOTA. It's faster and no fees. Is this the time to switch?

[Qunenin]

I appreciate that you have the ability to bring up the network fees which would normally speak things up, but maybe somewhere at the process you're tweaking something that's bringing that speed back down. Other than that the fee seems about right depending on how you're doing it . There are much cheaper ways to do it but it depends on sites that you use and the services you need.

[BitcoinPC]

It sounds like you're messing with too many options yourself. I have a particular client that daily sent us a payment of 0.3 Bitcoins. That contact with Bitcoin is the only contact they have, they do not care about Bitcoin and they know very little about it. They use a simple online wallet, choose our name from the address book and send that amount. Every single one of those transactions for the past 2 years has cleared and confirmed within an hour usually less.

[blockchainmarketus]

I don't know in which mutli verse you are living in but the last time i checked the average transaction fee for ethereum was around $1.4 for each transaction. So it doesn't matter which coin you use, you will end up paying the same amount of fees

Unless you use a coin with low fees (e.g. DOGE for as long as it doesn't have a high transaction volume, and IOTA if it works out right), in which case the transaction fees will be perfectly low.

If you want to use an altcoin to pay low fees, just use an obscure one.  Even if they're not scalable, they'll be cheap for now (e.g. Litecoin).

If you want security and you want to send high amounts, use Bitcoin.

Low fee with small amount better to use doge coin, eth  or litecoin, I usually use eth, litcoin or dogecoin. For high amount of transaction more than 0.1 BTC I like Bitcoin. Most exchanger accept bitcoin for fiat. I send 0.1 with fee 0.001. I think it's not big amount of fees for sending the money in hours. If we cash out via banks we need take days to cash out, with bitcoin I only need an or two hours if not problem less than 30 minutes. That's comfortable for me.

[richmcrich]

I thought I was the only one that witnessed it until I saw your post. It actually took me four hours to fund an account with blockchain and then I started getting scared that the money was lost in transaction probably

[A1exander]

I had a similar experience. As I've said before, now bitcoin is completely unsuitable as a system of payment for goods and services, etc. It seems to be an excellent investment and obviously it is much more convenient than gold bullion, but it cannot compete with credit cards for everyday shopping. Let's see if the Lightning Network can change the situation.

[albert11]

Due to the extremely high deduction. Others are forced to stop their bitcoins. There is another that is still trying to replace it. If this does not resolve many bitcoins holders will have to full out their Bitcoins and replace it with other crypto currencies. And if this happens then the bitcoin price will falls

[RawDog]

Nope, just waiting for merchants and services to pivot to Bitcoin Cash. Won't be long.

That is already happening: https://www.dashforcenews.com/ryan-x-charles-switched-bitcoin-cash/

Indeed, any application that needs low fees is already running to the Bitcoin Cash blockchain.

[kotbi]

Remember this is temporary. Segwit is slowly kicking in. It will increase the block size from 1MB to 4 MB. In no time, the mempool will be empty and the transaction will cost pennies.

[1Referee]

Indeed, any application that needs low fees is already running to the Bitcoin Cash blockchain.

You easily discard the fact that now Segwit has been activated, the doors are wide open for Lightning Network to step in and offer people insanely low transaction fees. On top of that, you are promoting something that has no viable long term perspective. I even doubt that at some point it will manage to maintain a value of +0.05BTC. Bitcoin Cash isn't any different from the hundreds of other altcoins there are in this market. I rather use something as Litecoin than something that is backed by malicious entities.

[pugman]

Still no one on the dev team considers this an issue?

I have sent multiple $20 transactions all with high fee ALONG WITH high confirm times..

Blockchain.info now has 2 different fee modes to send, both of which are high.

Ethereum will take over Bitcoin if this keeps up.

It takes a lot of time and the transaction fees have become damn high , I totally agree with everyone out there who are not happy with the recent delays and high fees issues. Ethereum replacing bitcoin,not sure about that because anything and everything is possible in the crypto-currency world.

[kotbi]

Indeed, any application that needs low fees is already running to the Bitcoin Cash blockchain.

You easily discard the fact that now Segwit has been activated, the doors are wide open for Lightning Network to step in and offer people insanely low transaction fees. On top of that, you are promoting something that has no viable long term perspective. I even doubt that at some point it will manage to maintain a value of +0.05BTC. Bitcoin Cash isn't any different from the hundreds of other altcoins there are in this market. I rather use something as Litecoin than something that is backed by malicious entities.

I totally agree with you.  On the other hand, I believe smarter people will win in a long term. Some people will choose a different path and realize the gold path much later.

[1Referee]

On the other hand, I believe smarter people will win in a long term. Some people will choose a different path and realize the gold path much later.

Long term minded Bitcoiners will always win - it has been like that since the very early days, and it will continue to be like that in the forthcoming years. People like RawDog are only out to cause drama, where they morally have no problems with knowingly pushing people into the wrong direction. It's either a paid shill, or a very sore loser due to him having sold his coins far too early. Just browse through his entire, or at least recent post hisorty - 90% of his posts have a trollish tint to them, that should say enough.