BTC can be a great store of value. Not for small transactions.

[mol76]

BTC can be a great store of value without being able to use it for small transactions. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

https://mobile.twitter.com/mecampbellsoup/status/872549286008979460

What dou you think?

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[magneto]

BTC can be a great store of value without being able to use it for small transactions. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

https://mobile.twitter.com/mecampbellsoup/status/872549286008979460

What dou you think?

A comparison that i'm going to make is gold with bitcoin.

Gold is obviously extremely hard to store with all the storage fees and insurance fees, extremely hard to move around as taxes and cutsoms are probably going to eat into your total net worth if you were to relocate your gold(not even taking into account any sort of shipping and handling charges here), and it is not divisible so it'll be impractical for anyone to buy a loaf of bread with gold pieces. But it's still very popular and seen as a store of value.

Now, bitcoin is much more divisible, much more convenient and the costs are significantly lower. So what i don't understand is that why do people think that gold can succeed while bitcoin cannot? Altcoins won't overtake bitcoin in the long run, just like copper can't overtake gold. People TRUSt bitcoin, and when there is trust, there is store of value.

[mol76]

BTC can be a great store of value without being able to use it for small transactions. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

https://mobile.twitter.com/mecampbellsoup/status/872549286008979460

What dou you think?

A comparison that i'm going to make is gold with bitcoin.

Gold is obviously extremely hard to store with all the storage fees and insurance fees, extremely hard to move around as taxes and cutsoms are probably going to eat into your total net worth if you were to relocate your gold(not even taking into account any sort of shipping and handling charges here), and it is not divisible so it'll be impractical for anyone to buy a loaf of bread with gold pieces. But it's still very popular and seen as a store of value.

Now, bitcoin is much more divisible, much more convenient and the costs are significantly lower. So what i don't understand is that why do people think that gold can succeed while bitcoin cannot? Altcoins won't overtake bitcoin in the long run, just like copper can't overtake gold. People TRUSt bitcoin, and when there is trust, there is store of value.

Thanks for your opinion! I agree... totally.

[Pursuer]

BTC can be a great store of value without being able to use it for small transactions. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

https://mobile.twitter.com/mecampbellsoup/status/872549286008979460

What dou you think?

like always it is idiotic to say bitcoin is just one thing and not the other.
bitcoin is a great store of value and it is a great way to sent small transactions, the fact that currently (because of reasons everyone knows) fees have gone up doesn't change the fact that bitcoin has been great at both fronts for 8+ years!

if today we start saying bitcoin is not for "small transactions" and agree on it, to morrow we will hear "bitcoin is not for medium transactions" and eventually we will turn bitcoin into something that a small group of people will hold millions in and never move. in other words we will kill bitcoin with our own hands.

[Ayiranorea]

Looking at the present situation the price of bitcoin is not that good for small transactions. Recently I too experiencd it personally when made a small transaction where 1/10 the amount was paid as transaction fee. With higher volume transaction this won't be happening.

[Denker]

Looking at the present situation the price of bitcoin is not that good for small transactions. Recently I too experiencd it personally when made a small transaction where 1/10 the amount was paid as transaction fee. With higher volume transaction this won't be happening.

Small transactions have nothing to do with the price of bitcoin. It's more about the issue transaction capacity per Block.
SegWit will bring some short to midterm improvement here.In the future Layer 2 implementations like Lightning Network, Thunder Network etc. will be inevitable. A small blocksize increase of 2-4mb may be possible as well. But not much more as the base layer has to be as much decentralized as possible. Yo can build centralized and decentralized services on top of a decentralized base layer but not the other way around!
So with layer 2 implementations small transactions, micro transactions will be possible again what the price of Bitcoin will be.

[jjacob]

Looking at the present situation the price of bitcoin is not that good for small transactions. Recently I too experiencd it personally when made a small transaction where 1/10 the amount was paid as transaction fee. With higher volume transaction this won't be happening.

Small transactions have nothing to do with the price of bitcoin. It's more about the issue transaction capacity per Block.
SegWit will bring some short to midterm improvement here.In the future Layer 2 implementations like Lightning Network, Thunder Network etc. will be inevitable. A small blocksize increase of 2-4mb may be possible as well. But not much more as the base layer has to be as much decentralized as possible. Yo can build centralized and decentralized services on top of a decentralized base layer but not the other way around!
So with layer 2 implementations small transactions, micro transactions will be possible again what the price of Bitcoin will be.

Unfortunately, there is no consensus even on small blocksize increases. If you look at the extent of centralization, it is not going to change just because the blocksize is increased marginally. However, increasing the transaction capacity would result in the price rocketing.

[amacar2]

After activation of segwit we might bitcoin still suitable for small transactions or micro payments. But right now with above 300 Satoshi/byte recommended fee we might end up paying equal amount of BTC in fee when sending any amount lower than 1 mBtc.  

People have already started to use other cheaper alternatives for micro transactions however after segwit and LN bitcoin dominance might grow significantly.

[btc_angela]

After activation of segwit we might bitcoin still suitable for small transactions or micro payments. But right now with above 300 Satoshi/byte recommended fee we might end up paying equal amount of BTC in fee when sending any amount lower than 1 mBtc.  

People have already started to use other cheaper alternatives for micro transactions however after segwit and LN bitcoin dominance might grow significantly.

But sometimes it is so frustrating that we are not able to used bitcoin in micro payment because of the huge transaction fee it incurred. So I guess we might just have to wait until the segwit activation to see if indeed the issue has been resolved. For now just hold on bitcoin and see where we are heading in the future.

[alyssa85]

I wish vendors would accept doge, as it is perfect for small transactions. Doge can by used as an actual currency while bitcoin can be held as an asset and store of wealth.

The trouble is, they simple won't enable alts on their platforms.

[White sugar]

Yes, that is the design of Bitcoin.

Looks like some people forgot about it, or are just for the money and didn't a proper research about the topic.

[freebutcaged]

You are dead wrong, there is the possibility still to use Bitcoin for small transactions or rather paying a small fee to get fast confirmation.

I had a few transactions today with paying less than 70sats/B and I went to accelerate the first one using ViaBTC just to be surprised to see

That it was confirmed after a few minutes so I took advantage over the happy hour of miners and moved a few coins around.

[JohanM]

I hope it is clear to everyone that increasing the blocksize will do nothing in the medium or long run. Sure, for a few weeks or months it will decrease fees and then we'll be back to where we are now.
Off-chain with Segwit is the only way to go. Making the block chain bigger would probably slow down the development of off-chain transaction systems and hurt bitcoin more that it will help.

[1Referee]

I had a few transactions today with paying less than 70sats/B and I went to accelerate the first one using ViaBTC just to be surprised to see

That it was confirmed after a few minutes so I took advantage over the happy hour of miners and moved a few coins around.

That's just pure luck, plus you depend on a third party to do the work for you. If you didn't use ViaBTC, or any other acceleration service, you wouldn't be that excited, that's almost a guarantee.

[NUFCrichard]

You are dead wrong, there is the possibility still to use Bitcoin for small transactions or rather paying a small fee to get fast confirmation.

I had a few transactions today with paying less than 70sats/B and I went to accelerate the first one using ViaBTC just to be surprised to see

That it was confirmed after a few minutes so I took advantage over the happy hour of miners and moved a few coins around.

and what about on the other days when it isn't as cheap? In the future should I go to a restaurant and pay, but wait a few hours until the network isn't as busy so that I don't have to pay several dollars extra just to get the transaction confirmed?

Bitcoin is supposed to be fast and cheap, it was never really all that fast, but it was cheap. Now it isn't cheap.  I don't really want to move coins around now, it is too expensive.

[freedomno1]

BTC can be a great store of value without being able to use it for small transactions. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

https://mobile.twitter.com/mecampbellsoup/status/872549286008979460

What dou you think?

It is a useful store of value, the difference with gold was that it is a good means of transferring value small and large, now with the transfers primarily being large it lost something in my opinion but it is still a good store of value. Consistent supply and demand metrics for now and appreciating value and utility that's what its good for.

[Syke]

My last transaction took a few hours to confirm, just over 1 satoshi/byte (0.03 USD). Plenty cheap and fast for me.

[Pursuer]

My last transaction took a few hours to confirm, just over 1 satoshi/byte (0.03 USD). Plenty cheap and fast for me.

because the freaking spam attack has finally ended! right now the number of unconfirmed transactions in the mempool is less than 10K and it was 80K-100K all this time when fees were high.
and when they said there is spam attack nobody believe, and when they said miners may be spamming nobody believed. now that they reached an agreement about SegWit and it is gaining a high support (80-90%) it is stopping!!!

[EXtremeAEX]

Yes, Bitcoin was meant to be an investment from the start, like gold but digital and with limited supply. Given the fees Bitcoin will never be used for micr-transactions. An alternative way may be to use an altcoin with low fees and fast transaction time, but that would be a long way to go for many to start adopting it.

[tiggytomb]

Definitely not for small transactions at the moment, the fee is just too high to send anything small if you want it to reach the recipient in a reasonable amount of time.