Senate passes internet sales tax bill

[pekv2]

Makes my skin crawl. I think it still needs to go through house to be fully passed. I'd like to get DeathandTaxes opinion on this. I see he post some good points on subjects.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/may/06/senate-passes-internet-sales-tax-amazon

Imo, this country is gonna be taxed to death.

[myrkul]

Oh, my god. "Marketplace Fairness Act."

If that isn't a lovely little piece of doublespeak straight out of Atlas Shrugged.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Yeah it is going to be bad news if it passes.  The real problem isn't entities like Amazon but smaller companies.  I mean honestly $1M in sales isn't that much even for a small business.  Most banks put the line between small business and corporate accounts at $10M in annual sales.

For small businesses (and note small businesses are the job created) it (along with health care reform bill) is a death blow.  In the US IIRC there are something like 237 different tax localities (some at state level and some at city/county level).  Most states also have multiple different tax rates depends on the product.  That is simply a massive burden for small businesses.  Many will fail, many will remain noncompliant and risk getting sued, many will scale back their online activities.

For a country struggling to grow the number of jobs well this is just asinine.

[dotcom]

Makes my skin crawl. I think it still needs to go through house to be fully passed. I'd like to get DeathandTaxes opinion on this. I see he post some good points on subjects.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/may/06/senate-passes-internet-sales-tax-amazon

Imo, this country is gonna be taxed to death.

step 1: spend more
step 2: tax more
step 3: go back to step 1

the u.s. government spends itself into near financial collapse, then uses budget cuts and subsequent job losses as a fear-tactic to raise taxes (even though their budget actually grew this year so they shouldn't have had to cut anything). every year our economy grows more and more dependent on the government and central economic planning.

not to mention anybody who speaks out against it is labeled as a naive nutjob who doesn't want to pay for the 'roads' they use.

[pekv2]

Makes my skin crawl. I think it still needs to go through house to be fully passed. I'd like to get DeathandTaxes opinion on this. I see he post some good points on subjects.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/may/06/senate-passes-internet-sales-tax-amazon

Imo, this country is gonna be taxed to death.

step 1: spend more
step 2: tax more
step 3: go back to step 1

the u.s. government spends itself into near financial collapse, then uses budget cuts and subsequent job losses as a fear-tactic to raise taxes (even though their budget actually grew this year so they shouldn't have had to cut anything). every year our economy grows more and more dependent on the government and central economic planning.

not to mention anybody who speaks out against it is labeled as a naive nutjob who doesn't want to pay for the 'roads' they use.

What rots me, is that these people in senate, house, white house, leo's & feds don't do a damn thing to get hand calluses, they live off of the citizens, claiming they work. I was watching this bill to be passed, on CSPN, you know how many people I seen just standing around in suits doing nothing and getting paid by peoples taxes? There was a ton of them. I just nodded my head in shame at these people. Fucking leeches.

[compro01]

Makes my skin crawl. I think it still needs to go through house to be fully passed. I'd like to get DeathandTaxes opinion on this. I see he post some good points on subjects.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/may/06/senate-passes-internet-sales-tax-amazon

Imo, this country is gonna be taxed to death.

Oh FFS.

THIS IS NOT A NEW FEDERAL TAX.

This is allowing states to require out-of-state merchants to collect tax on sales to residents of their states.

This is taxes you're supposed to already be paying, but don't bother to because you don't get caught.

Basically, Congress is using their commerce clause power to reverse National Bellas Hess v. Illinois, which found the states don't have the power to require out-of-state merchants to collect tax.

[myrkul]

Basically, Congress is using their commerce clause power to reverse National Bellas Hess v. Illinois, which found the states don't have the power to require out-of-state merchants to collect tax.

...And?

Still has the same effect of quashing small businesses' online presence, and limiting the big boys' (Amazon and Wal-mart) competition.

In fact, a new federal tax would be better than this. Easier to keep track of and implement in the online commerce systems.

[Rassah]

So... does this mean that an online business that sells stuff, and files taxes to their one state (along with Federal taxes) will now have to keep track of taxes for every sale, and file taxes to all 50 states (minus the few that don't have sales tax)? Tax accountants will be loving this...

[Ekaros]

Federations...

Still, EU also have this in some ways. For certain amount of bussiness to certain country they have to pay VAT...

[pekv2]

So... does this mean that an online business that sells stuff, and files taxes to their one state (along with Federal taxes) will now have to keep track of taxes for every sale, and file taxes to all 50 states (minus the few that don't have sales tax)? Tax accountants will be loving this...

Big disaster imo.

[wdmw]

So... does this mean that an online business that sells stuff, and files taxes to their one state (along with Federal taxes) will now have to keep track of taxes for every sale, and file taxes to all 50 states (minus the few that don't have sales tax)? Tax accountants will be loving this...

Big disaster imo.

50 wouldn't be bad.  There are over 7500 different sales tax jurisdictions in the US.

[myrkul]

So... does this mean that an online business that sells stuff, and files taxes to their one state (along with Federal taxes) will now have to keep track of taxes for every sale, and file taxes to all 50 states (minus the few that don't have sales tax)? Tax accountants will be loving this...

Big disaster imo.

50 wouldn't be bad.  There are over 7500 different sales tax jurisdictions in the US.

State, county, city (!) It's going to be a nightmare.

[Rassah]

So... does this mean that an online business that sells stuff, and files taxes to their one state (along with Federal taxes) will now have to keep track of taxes for every sale, and file taxes to all 50 states (minus the few that don't have sales tax)? Tax accountants will be loving this...

Big disaster imo.

50 wouldn't be bad.  There are over 7500 different sales tax jurisdictions in the US.

I didn't know certain cities and counties had their own sales taxes on top of the "standard" state sales tax

[Jobe7]

For a country struggling to grow the number of jobs well this is just asinine.

Along with other things, makes you wonder what they're really trying to do..

I mean, before this new tax, if I was in charge and said to my team of *peoplewhoscreweveryoneelseover* "what can we do next to further destroy peoples jobs and small businesses and get people more in debt slavery?"

I'm sure there'd be a few people yelling "TAX THE INTERWEBZ!"

So.. whats next

[Ekaros]

For a country struggling to grow the number of jobs well this is just asinine.

Along with other things, makes you wonder what they're really trying to do..

I mean, before this new tax, if I was in charge and said to my team of *peoplewhoscreweveryoneelseover* "what can we do next to further destroy peoples jobs and small businesses and get people more in debt slavery?"

I'm sure there'd be a few people yelling "TAX THE INTERWEBZ!"

So.. whats next

A couple more nice wars? Get's that military complex really going, maybe to some legistlation in support too.

[Operatr]

Once this gets to the House vote it will probably be DOA, which is the general feeling. They have tried pushing through this crap for 15 years, and have failed for 15 years to implement it.

[myrkul]

Once this gets to the House vote it will probably be DOA, which is the general feeling. They have tried pushing through this crap for 15 years, and have failed for 15 years to implement it.

Primarily because Amazon and company were against it. Now that they're big enough, and have locations in enough places that they're already doing most of the work the bill would require, they're all for it.

The better to keep out any small competition.

[DeathAndTaxes]

So... does this mean that an online business that sells stuff, and files taxes to their one state (along with Federal taxes) will now have to keep track of taxes for every sale, and file taxes to all 50 states (minus the few that don't have sales tax)? Tax accountants will be loving this...

If it passes ... yes however it is most like 237 tax jurisdictions. Don't forget taxes depend not just on the state but the city/county as well.

On edit:
Actually I was wrong there are 11,000 distinct taxing jurisdictions in the US however many have opted to not assert that authority (for example in VA all county/city sales taxes are 1%) so there are "only" 237 different tax rates in the country.   However that could change at anytime, a city/county in VA feeling budget shortfall could opt to raise sales tax from 1% to 1.5%.  It gets worse when you consider that some states tax different products at different rates and some exempt some types of products.  Of course there is no standardization.  One state might tax food at a lower rate, while another might tax all sales the same, while another might exempt medicine and food, and still another only exempt some types of food, and yet another tax food at a lower rate and exempt medicine. 

The number of permutations is utterly mindboggling which is why the moratorium passed to begin with.  The "idea" was that states could work together to consolidate and reduce the tax collection burden (imagine 27 states opted for the same rate and exemptions).  Somehow that has changed to ... we won't make it any easier (so same problem still exists) we will just burden small businesses with it.

If it didn't make sense 15 years ago it doesn't make sense today.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Once this gets to the House vote it will probably be DOA, which is the general feeling. They have tried pushing through this crap for 15 years, and have failed for 15 years to implement it.

Primarily because Amazon and company were against it. Now that they're big enough, and have locations in enough places that they're already doing most of the work the bill would require, they're all for it.

The better to keep out any small competition.

Amazon has been fighting collection of state sales taxes in states where it doesn't have a physical presence so expect them to lobby hard against this.  The good news is that although it is incorrect (and as pointed out above it isn't a new tax) most people will perceive it as a new tax.  The speaker of the house has indicated not supporting it.  Combine big internet companies being against it, the speaker not supporting it, and "new taxes" it likely will die ... this year.  Sadly I feel it is only a matter of time.

[myrkul]

Once this gets to the House vote it will probably be DOA, which is the general feeling. They have tried pushing through this crap for 15 years, and have failed for 15 years to implement it.

Primarily because Amazon and company were against it. Now that they're big enough, and have locations in enough places that they're already doing most of the work the bill would require, they're all for it.

The better to keep out any small competition.

Amazon has been fighting collection of state sales taxes in states where it doesn't have a physical presence so expect them to lobby hard against this.

Not any more...

The bill has aligned unlikely parties. Amazon, the largest online retailer, has joined its bricks-and-mortar rivals including Walmart to support the act. Amazon was once a staunch critic of the tax but as it has built more distribution centers it has become liable for sales tax in more states and is now a backer.