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Jammalan the Prophet (OP)
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July 16, 2017, 09:23:07 PM
Last edit: October 11, 2017, 01:19:28 AM by Jammalan the Prophet
 #1

del
fatlever
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July 16, 2017, 09:28:31 PM
 #2

Good god man, your picture summarizes exactly what I've been thinking.  All this decentralization has been a shit show of a spectacle.  

Iranus
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July 16, 2017, 09:35:39 PM
 #3

It's all about money.

Who can control the majority of hash rate?  People with money.

Who can control the majority of nodes, if they want to?  People with money.

Who can control which chain wins on August 1st?  People with money, and people who receive or provide services related to money (merchants and exchanges).

Unfortunately, BTC ends up with people who were greedy in the first place having a lot of power.  But the fiat system is worse, and there's nowhere better for me to go for now, so I'm gonna stick with it and see where it's heading.  It still hasn't 100% gone to shit, anyway.

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dquancey
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July 16, 2017, 09:39:33 PM
 #4

Exactly what Iranus said.

Where there is money to be made, there is also greed. Enter Bitmain, Ver, Wright and all the other wombles.

I think if something like this does happen, then at least there is some very good coins out there that we could all band around. If not, then it's bandit country.
Thatstinks
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July 16, 2017, 09:47:12 PM
 #5

Satoshi and "his or their" silence shows that he truly cares less what happens to bitcoin.

Makes me think more and more it was just a project that grew to an experiment and never anything more. The man has their data now on how this theory would play out without centralization and are smiling.

The joke is on all of us here.
AgentofCoin
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July 16, 2017, 09:50:03 PM
 #6

We are all witnesses to one miracle..
DECENTRALIZATION
On its deathbed.

The path of the most revolutionary decentralized currency will be decided on Aug 1st.
By who?
By the people "in charge".

This is the miracle of miracles. The moment when something which was supposed to be under no authority that can't be controlled by the government by the banks by the aliens..is finally controlled by somebody. And the results are for everyone to see !!!!!
...

I disagree with the prophet.

There is no decision that will be made here, there is no "in charge".
Majority of actions that are to come, are all attacks on the Bitcoin system.
Bitcoin may have reached the point that Satoshi prophesied would come.
What has transpired was a Kobayashi Maru all along.

I support a decentralized & unregulatable ledger first, with safe scaling over time.
Request a signed message if you are associating with anyone claiming to be me.
Yakamoto
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July 16, 2017, 09:55:36 PM
 #7

Yup, decentralization can't work and comply with human nature because people are too fucking stupid or stubborn to roll along with something everyone else chooses, hell they all want to secure power for themselves and see whether or not they can actually come out with something of value at the end of it. The Bitcoin community may ironically be, or have been too intelligent for its own good and everyone was smart enough to seek their own power grab, be it their own fork, coin, whatever, instead of being stupid enough to just follow the leader.

I'm not on either (or any) side of the fork debate, really. If it does through, good. I won't have any issues with it. If it doesn't, fine. But the entire time leading up to the fork has been a shitshow and at this point, I don't care. Make it work or it will fall through. I have no invested mining material nor do I operate a node. I have no vested interest and am powerless. I only have this account as an asset that relies on Bitcoin, and $125 isn't much for value.

Shame it couldn't be figured out but whatever I guess.
AgentofCoin
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July 16, 2017, 10:14:05 PM
Last edit: July 16, 2017, 10:56:18 PM by AgentofCoin
 #8

We are all witnesses to one miracle..
DECENTRALIZATION
On its deathbed.

The path of the most revolutionary decentralized currency will be decided on Aug 1st.
By who?
By the people "in charge".

This is the miracle of miracles. The moment when something which was supposed to be under no authority that can't be controlled by the government by the banks by the aliens..is finally controlled by somebody. And the results are for everyone to see !!!!!
...
I disagree with the prophet.

There is no decision that will be made here, there is no "in charge".
Majority of actions that are to come, are all attacks on the Bitcoin system.
Bitcoin may have reached the point that Satoshi prophesied would come.
What has transpired was a Kobayashi Maru all along.
Then Theymos is trolling his own forum as this is from the little announce on top:

Quote
The large Bitcoin miner Bitmain announced that they might engage in a (nonsensically-named) "user activated hardfork" ("UAHF") shortly after BIP148 activates if BIP148 has any success. This would definitely cause an additional split, resulting in up to three currencies: BIP148-Bitcoin, Bitmain-coin, and (depending on the degree of BIP148's success) status-quo-Bitcoin. As mentioned previously, if you have x BTC before the split, you'll be technically able to claim x of all three of these currencies after the split.

I'm asking you this, who the fuck decided that this shit should be implemented on August 1.

I vote for it to be on August 2nd.
Oh my vote doesn't count. Yours neither. There is no voting.
Wtf?

Theymos has a right to his own opinion and has a certain responsibility to notify the
community as to what certain future Bitcoin actions may or may not bring about.
Whether those actions manifest or not, or whether Theymos has a personal choice
of one of the many possibilities, is ultimately irrelevant.

The BIP 148 was determined by its author and creator to be enforced on August 1st.
That is who decided it should be implemented then. It is now the responsibility of
users to run that client if they wish to force the miners to implement SegWit. If the
miners chose to resist that action, they will perform their own action which Theymos
is referring to. Thus, there are many actions that are or could occur that all violate
Community Consensus. (Update clarification: BIP 148 only manifested as a reaction
to miners forcing blocksize increase onto the users by using the HK Agreement with
individual handful of devs as their rational, which was never agreed to by the
users or High Community Consensus. This has only started because some internal
entities wanted the right to steer the future, when they had no right or authority to
do so.)

If you wish to have UASF activate and enforce on August 2nd, then you can create
your own client and advise the community that they should use yours, over the
Aug 1st vr. It will be impossible now to organize that, but it is your right to attempt.


Voting is an illusion in Bitcoin and never existed.
The truth is High Community Consensus or nothing.

Sometimes Nothing is the correct answer in this type of system we all participate.
If you disagree, and an action MUST be performed, it is almost always an attack type.

Edit: added update clarification

I support a decentralized & unregulatable ledger first, with safe scaling over time.
Request a signed message if you are associating with anyone claiming to be me.
fatlever
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July 16, 2017, 10:29:58 PM
 #9

Satoshi and "his or their" silence shows that he truly cares less what happens to bitcoin.

Makes me think more and more it was just a project that grew to an experiment and never anything more. The man has their data now on how this theory would play out without centralization and are smiling.

The joke is on all of us here.

I think part of the problem is that everyone is too invested in Bitcoin (both financially and emotionally).  Whether they admit it or not, a significant percentage of people are hoping to get  rich off it.  Bitcoin can't take a mistep and god forbid it can't fail.   The direction it should take has taken religious fervor with accusations flying from all sides.

I don't think we should be so afraid if it fails.  The idea and new system is more important than Bitcoin itself.  If it fails, we probably improve on it or there may already be another coin that will gain adoption and utility.  Really, the adoption of Bitcoin or AnyCoin will be a huge achievement and the future of crypto will have arrived regardless of whether Bitcoin fails or not because I think once the world catches on, there is no going back.
Barbarian
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July 17, 2017, 09:53:18 PM
 #10

Yup, decentralization can't work and comply with human nature because people are too fucking stupid or stubborn to roll along with something everyone else chooses
Decentralization works fine... Until Core developers try to pass rules and laws that force all citizens into off-chain pools where no one can remain independent or autonomous. Bitcoin was supposed to free us from communist banking pools.

communist banking pools
Never heard of communism and banking in one sentence.

A battle of Prophets? I will bring my popcorn, this is getting interesting.
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July 17, 2017, 09:56:20 PM
 #11

Current decentralization aims to improve bitcoin performance, especially in terms of time delivery of bitcoin transactions. This goal is very positive and I'm not afraid that bitcoin will be controlled by a community. Bitcoin still has the properties of freedom and anonymouse.
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July 18, 2017, 01:58:40 AM
 #12

OP, it might be the best idea for you to support the UASF/BIP148 then. If only it were easy to set up a node these days, I believe a lot of us would start signalling Segwit BIP 148 right now and let the everyone hear and see our cause.


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webcrypt
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July 18, 2017, 02:11:05 AM
 #13

Makes me think more and more it was just a project that grew to an experiment and never anything more. The man has their data now on how this theory would play out without centralization and are smiling.

The joke is on all of us here.

I agree somewhat, from the beginning most likely just an experiment set out into the wild to be funded by the wild. Millions of dollars created billions of dollars worth of concept design, productivity and applied theory. Social engineering at it's finest.   
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July 18, 2017, 05:22:21 AM
 #14

We are all witnesses to one miracle..

DECENTRALIZATION

On its deathbed.

The path of the most revolutionary decentralized currency will be decided on Aug 1st.
By who?
By the people "in charge".

This is the miracle of miracles. The moment when something which was supposed to be under no authority that can't be controlled by the government by the banks by the aliens..is finally controlled by somebody. And the results are for everyone to see !!!!!
Though it seems to be centralization of bitcoin,the decision of activating segwit was eagerly awaited by most of bitcoin holders so that transactions would be confirmed soon at a very low price.This decision of activating segwit is good for bitcoin progress.
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