2017-08-01 Coinbase/GDAX Biggest Crypto Fraud in history?

[Gimpeline]

i think i raised a legit question about BTC-BCC/BCH, the fact that coinbase (dunno if its the biggest exchange) is holding a huge amount of a coins that were aquired because their clients have deposits of BTC .

so for example if:

1.coinbase in a few months decides to support bcc/bch will they give their clients the amount of bch/bcc = btc they had today?

2.does gdax now has a position where they can manipulate all other exchanges prices on btc-bch pair?

just to be clear i didnt had any btc/etc/ltc/shit on gdax/coinbase

also dont compare other services that didnt hand bcc to coinbase/GDAX .

also about the robbery...if i someones tells you they are gonna rob you before they do it ...that makes it ok?

there tons of new investors in crypto that only know that 1 btc is worth 2.7kusd and problably will be worth 5kusd in the future, for them a fork is a tool to eat, so coinbase/gdax announce for those investors its like toilet paper

GDAX does have alot of support on this forum.

If you were told by a bank "I'm going to empty this safe in 2 weeks. Please move your money to a better place" Would you move your money? Or wait and call the police the day after they did it.
How is that a fraud or robbery?

[falmeida]

i think i raised a legit question about BTC-BCC/BCH, the fact that coinbase (dunno if its the biggest exchange) is holding a huge amount of a coins that were aquired because their clients have deposits of BTC .

so for example if:

1.coinbase in a few months decides to support bcc/bch will they give their clients the amount of bch/bcc = btc they had today?

2.does gdax now has a position where they can manipulate all other exchanges prices on btc-bch pair?

just to be clear i didnt had any btc/etc/ltc/shit on gdax/coinbase

also dont compare other services that didnt hand bcc to coinbase/GDAX .

also about the robbery...if i someones tells you they are gonna rob you before they do it ...that makes it ok?

there tons of new investors in crypto that only know that 1 btc is worth 2.7kusd and problably will be worth 5kusd in the future, for them a fork is a tool to eat, so coinbase/gdax announce for those investors its like toilet paper

GDAX does have alot of support on this forum.

If you were told by a bank "I'm going to empty this safe in 2 weeks. Please move your money to a better place" Would you move your money? Or wait and call the police the day after they did it.
How is that a fraud or robbery?

well if the bank had the door that gives access to your safe locked for those 2 weeks wouldnt you call the police?

https://community.coinbase.com/c/gdax

because it seems alot of ppl werent able to withdraw their money

[HabBear]

also about the robbery...if i someones tells you they are gonna rob you before they do it ...that makes it ok?

If someone tells you "hey, you better move your money out of our business by this date and time a week from now if you want the full benefit of what's about to happen"...it's not robbery. Period.

because it seems alot of ppl werent able to withdraw their money

What people? I don't hear anyone complaining that they couldn't get their money out of they wanted to? This OP of this thread isn't even claiming that they couldn't get their money out.

I was able to get money out of Coinbase on July 31st with no problem, the transaction took 10 minutes to get confirmed and cost less than $2...which made me think, why are people making such a big deal about transaction times and fees?!?!

[falmeida]

too many coinbase/gdax defense lawyers around...i give up

all those complaining on coinbase support forum are stupid ppl that cant read, and the whole operation was transparent and clean, like the next months will be

[Barcode_]

I don't see this as a case of fraud by Coinbase since they have already issued many notices to their customers weeks ago, if any of their customers who wishes to get Bitcoin Cash from the upcoming fork, the correct procedure would be to transfer their bitcoins out of Coinbase into a wallet which they are in control of their own private key.

[adaseb]

They are not keeping the coins to themselves.

They said in an FAQ that if there is enough interest in Bitcoin Cash they will let users withdraw their coins. Right now they are assuming its some failed altcoin.

[LTU_btc]

Calm down dude. Coinbase warned their users that they will not support BCH and won't credit to their users:
"Customers who wish to access both bitcoin (BTC) and bitcoin cash (BCC) need to withdraw bitcoin stored on Coinbase before 11.59 pm PT July 31, 2017. If you do not wish to access bitcoin cash (BCC) then no action is required."
I withdrawed all my btc from Coinbase and now I received BCH. In this case, I don't see reasons to blame Coinbase. And why you aren't blaming all other services which didn't credit BCH to their users?

[R2Pleasent]

I think the main reason Coinbase decided to skip out completely on BCC (Bitcoin Cash) was compliance.  For them to issue the new coin to their customers would probably be super complicated due to regulations in the SEC, etc.  They probably realized it wasn't worth the hassle and just told everyone to withdraw their coins.  I'd say that if there was any proof Coinbase claimed the BCC attached to customer deposits, they'd be committing fraud.  Considering the potential risk involved, I'd like to believe the company makes the sound decision and does not claim BCH with their private keys.

[BitcoinBarrel]

There are 5 rules that everyone must learn about Bitcoin:
1. Control your Private Keys
2. Don't keep coins on exchange
3. HODL
4. Mining is for fun not profit
5. Don't keep coins on exchange

[keithers]

so coinbase/gdax didnt gave out bch or bcc to btc holders...so where did the bch/bcc went ? to coinbase pocket?

is it the biggest robbery/fraud in crypto history?

I definitely don't think it would be accurate to classify it as a robbery, because they have very openly stated that they were not going to support the fork and gave everyone the opportunity to move their funds into a wallet that you are able to control the private keys.

They gave I think a few weeks notice.  I was wondering if they were going to have a problem processing all the withdrawals.   I left a little bit at coinbase, but not much as I don't make it a habit to store much there, especially since sending BTC to other addresses is even now super slow using coinbase.   

I basically only use it to purchase BTC...and that has become a disappointment since the $1000 instant purchase is no longer available either (to my knowledge).

[lonelygrimm]

this is just you making this problem become bigger, oh i know, you forgot to withdraw some of your penny in Coinbase and lost a chance to get some BCC from it and you blame them for nothing. Dude, be mature, If you're using a serivce company, you should agree with their TOS, because that you should read every TOS before accept with it, we all know they have a big chance to take a big profit from peoples BCC but that's not because they really want it, they have opportunity from people agreement, so there is no one to blame.

[Sithara007]

Customers who had left their BTC on Coinbase agreed to the terms of not getting their BCH by not withdrawing their balances. It's a dick move from Coinbase although not illegal.

Agree with that. It was not illegal, but the move proved extremely costly for the BTC holders in Coinbase. Right now, BCH represents at least 12% of the combined BTC+BCH market cap. That means that the Coinbase holders lost at least 12% of their net worth for no fault of theirs.

[Rinaze]

Fraud no. Greedy yes. Complacent yes.

BY RIGHT you should expect one of the top service / biggest entity in the crypto industry to provide top notch service by trying to keep up with the trend but instead it's the other way around. This industry is probably one of those that business can override customers without much consequences. It's not just Coinbase, look at how many others is doing the same as well.

The other thing is the crypto community is still relative small compared to real world numbers so people aren't really expecting much most of the time to be frank. Imagine if crypto do take over as the main currency one fine day, I don't think any of these would have happen and if it did the business will definitely pay for it. Imagine if BoA do this even if they announce weeks or month before, I don't think it will just be contained at the Bitcointalk level. Even at the internet level, that would have dealt significant damage to them and I can't even start to think of physical consequences (protest?, etc).

[iamTom123]

I understand how some of the Coinbase customers are feeling right now that they are not getting any share of the free Bitcoin Cash (BCH) airdrops but we have to consider also that Coinbase had announced their stand on the matter and so if it up to the customers to move their Bitcoin to another service provider that is supporting BCH. They should have moved their Bitcoin to Bittrex where things went smooth and we already have our BCH on our accounts.

Now, it is already too late to demand Coinbase to support BCH but in case it is true that they are actually holding BCH as equivalent of the Bitcoin of their customers then it is very imperative for them to release those BCH to their customers otherwise Coinbase is committing a fraud.

[HabBear]

Fraud no. Greedy yes. Complacent yes.

BY RIGHT you should expect one of the top service / biggest entity in the crypto industry to provide top notch service by trying to keep up with the trend but instead it's the other way around. Thi

No "BY RIGHT" customers should expect to be notified if the company wishes to not engage is specific areas of the industry that their customers would expect.

A business' ability to provide service today does not entitled the customers the right to have the service provided forever or for service to be expanded.

The customers have a right to know what the company intends to do and to have adequate time to make changes as needed (i.e., discontinue the relationship with the business). Coinbase fulfilled this obligation. If someone ignored their notifications and suggestions or ignored the personal email that Coinbase sent to every account owner, that's the customer's fault.

Imagine if BoA do this even if they announce weeks or month before, I don't think it will just be contained at the Bitcointalk level. Even at the internet level, that would have dealt significant damage to them and I can't even start to think of physical consequences (protest?, etc).

If BoA did this their notice to customers would suffice to legally absolve them of any wrongdoing.

I'm SHOCKED had how much frustration there is with Coinbase among a community that celebrates a currency that has inherent "buyer beware" requirements. Bitcoin is a system where YOU are required to manage YOUR balance...the fact that people are upset because they failed to manage their balance is laughable.

[falmeida]

my final note on this issue:

seems that coinbase clients feel scammed/robbed whatever u wanna call it.... just have a look at the coinbase forum https://community.coinbase.com/

with bcc at current price this was obviously the biggest robbery/fraud in crypto history  after all coinbase claims to have 10% of all btc

[sylance]

I don't think Coinbase has done any fraud or 'scammed' anyone.  Just as everyone stated, Coinbase was very clear on their plans and highly recommended people withdraw their BTC... even going so far as saying they recommend doing it early due to wait times.

That being said... as one of their customers I would like to know what they did with the BCC that was allocated to the respective BTC.  I can't seem to find how much BTC is stored in Coinbases wallets, but Bitfinex was transparent so let's use that as a place holder.  For now, let's assume Coinbase is storying the same 131,000 BTC as Bitfinex.

131,000 x $500 = $65,000,000*

That's a ton of cash that should be accounted for.  Again I'm not saying they 'owe' their customers this cash or even that they scammed anyone, just would be nice if they were upfront on where that BCC went.  I can't imagine they 'burned' those coins so where are they?

*knowing that dumping 131K coins would lower the selling price, also knowing that Coinbase may have less than Bitfinex.

[Omega Weapon]

so coinbase/gdax didnt gave out bch or bcc to btc holders...so where did the bch/bcc went ? to coinbase pocket?

is it the biggest robbery/fraud in crypto history?

I do not think you can call it fraud, coinbase was very open about the fact they were not going to credit BCH to any of their customers and encouraged anyone that wanted to have that altcoin to get their bitcoin out of coinbase, if someone did not listen or did not attend the call then that is not coinbase fault also there is not a single proof they stole BCH for their own benefit, maybe it was a technical decision or one based on principles.

[keithers]

my final note on this issue:

seems that coinbase clients feel scammed/robbed whatever u wanna call it.... just have a look at the coinbase forum https://community.coinbase.com/

with bcc at current price this was obviously the biggest robbery/fraud in crypto history  after all coinbase claims to have 10% of all btc

It would be unfair if coinbase did not give customers any forewarning about what would would happen post fork but they were 100% transparent in saying that they were not supporting bitcoin cash. I left a little bit there and I'm bummed that I did, but I left it there myself, I had the full opportunity to zero out my bitcoin balance from there, so did everyone else.

[pushups44]

It's obvious to me that Coinbase will eventually give customers at least some of their bitcoin cash. Lawyers are no doubt working round the clock to "clock" Coinbase and the expenses of these lawsuits will probably outweigh simply giving customers their coins.