About BCC (Bitcoin's Cancer Cell)

[krizniq]

if hashrate leaves difficulty will adjust and show will keep going .. what's the issue here?

in a normal world there are 1 block every 10 minutes on average which makes 144 block each day. 144 * 12.5BTC = 1,800BTC
imagine you have 10% of the hashrate and lets say each day you get 10% of 1800BTC = 180BTC = $486,000

(assuming BCH reached equilibrium and is mining 1 block every 10 min on average) now in our fucked up world you can one day decide to switch your 10% hashrate on bitcoin to bitcoin cash. with it you can mine a lot more because first of all 10% on BCH is a lot more (nearly 80% of total there maybe more but lets take 80%) and also because of this big hashrate rise more blocks will be generate in 1 day. lets say 200 blocks
200 * 12.5 BCH * 80% * $500 = $1,000,000

right now ViaBTC that has 5% of bitcoin hashrate has mined 25% of bitcoin cash's blocks.

of course things aren't as simple as this and i am making big assumptions about numbers. for example a miner can not just sell the coins as he gets them. coinbase transaction (that 12.5) need to stay about 100 blocks IIRC or so before becomes spendable.

if I understand bitcoin design correctly, it's adjusting based on how much power you have on the network so if u have lower hashrate it doesnt mean everything will be slowed down, it's emmiting btc in about same speed no matter how much miners you have.

If I'm wrong, sorry for my ignorance

[Casdinyard]

The Cancer is not only a direct threat to Bitcoin, but ultimately to itself since it is built on faulty fundamentals:

I believe its as much a "threat" to Bitcoin as ETC is to ETH. none.

I hold this view as well, some people are worried about the price of BCC but that price is not going to last for long as people begin to dump the coin and it is eventually killed not by the miners but by the users.

Of course the price now is only a hype and soon as many will dump their bch when exchanges have orders, that price will have a big dip and as a result of high supply but no demand in the market.
And I believe bch is not a totally threat to btc as this coin is just an imitation.

[figmentofmyass]

The Cancer is not only a direct threat to Bitcoin, but ultimately to itself since it is built on faulty fundamentals:

I believe its as much a "threat" to Bitcoin as ETC is to ETH. none.

I hold this view as well, some people are worried about the price of BCC but that price is not going to last for long as people begin to dump the coin and it is eventually killed not by the miners but by the users.

Of course the price now is only a hype and soon as many will dump their bch when exchanges have orders, that price will have a big dip and as a result of high supply but no demand in the market.
And I believe bch is not a totally threat to btc as this coin is just an imitation.

what it all comes down to is whether it is profitable to mine. once difficulty adjusts to that point, the coin should be sustained. i imagine, like any other alt, some price floor will be found and it'll get pumped at some point. i wouldn't worry about it overtaking Bitcoin; with any luck, it'll take the BU crowd with it.

[BTCLovingDude]

if hashrate leaves difficulty will adjust and show will keep going .. what's the issue here?

in a normal world there are 1 block every 10 minutes on average which makes 144 block each day. 144 * 12.5BTC = 1,800BTC
imagine you have 10% of the hashrate and lets say each day you get 10% of 1800BTC = 180BTC = $486,000

(assuming BCH reached equilibrium and is mining 1 block every 10 min on average) now in our fucked up world you can one day decide to switch your 10% hashrate on bitcoin to bitcoin cash. with it you can mine a lot more because first of all 10% on BCH is a lot more (nearly 80% of total there maybe more but lets take 80%) and also because of this big hashrate rise more blocks will be generate in 1 day. lets say 200 blocks
200 * 12.5 BCH * 80% * $500 = $1,000,000

right now ViaBTC that has 5% of bitcoin hashrate has mined 25% of bitcoin cash's blocks.

of course things aren't as simple as this and i am making big assumptions about numbers. for example a miner can not just sell the coins as he gets them. coinbase transaction (that 12.5) need to stay about 100 blocks IIRC or so before becomes spendable.

if I understand bitcoin design correctly, it's adjusting based on how much power you have on the network so if u have lower hashrate it doesnt mean everything will be slowed down, it's emmiting btc in about same speed no matter how much miners you have.

If I'm wrong, sorry for my ignorance

you are correct about the "adjusting" part but not considering the time it takes. the adjustment has a period, it is done every 2016 blocks (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Difficulty#How_often_does_the_network_difficulty_change.3F) and it should take 2 weeks to find 2016 blocks, if hashrate goes up it will take less time so difficulty goes up to adjust the time again to fix this. and if it goes down the opposite with happen.

things are different in bitcoin cash though. they have changed the difficulty to drop (i think 25% if no blocks were found in 6 hours!) so the effects are a bit different.

PS it is interesting to see what will happen in reality with miners though!

[figmentofmyass]

things are different in bitcoin cash though. they have changed the difficulty to drop (i think 25% if no blocks were found in 6 hours!) so the effects are a bit different.

PS it is interesting to see what will happen in reality with miners though!

wow, if the bolded is true, that explains it. i was thinking that the BCH chain might just be dead on arrival. that was a smart fail-safe on their part, to incentivize miners.

still not sure if it's profitable yet. if/when it is, things will get more interesting. once it's sustainable from a supply/demand perspective vs. miners, i think we will start to see a healthy period of accumulation and/or up-trending.

[krizniq]

btw this is viabtc announcement:

4. If New Fork Fails To Survive

After 00:00 15th August 2017 (UTC Time), if the BIP148 split chain cannot last, it will be considered failed. We will then cancel the “148/ETH” trading pair and all your “148” assets will be erased from your account.

After 00:00 15th August 2017 (UTC Time), if the BitcoinABC split chain cannot last, it will be considered failed. We will then cancel the “BCC/CNY” and “BCC/BTC” trading pairs and all your “BCC” assets will be erased from your account.

does it means BCC is now in sort of lock-in period?

[oslak]

if hashrate leaves difficulty will adjust and show will keep going .. what's the issue here?

in a normal world there are 1 block every 10 minutes on average which makes 144 block each day. 144 * 12.5BTC = 1,800BTC
imagine you have 10% of the hashrate and lets say each day you get 10% of 1800BTC = 180BTC = $486,000

(assuming BCH reached equilibrium and is mining 1 block every 10 min on average) now in our fucked up world you can one day decide to switch your 10% hashrate on bitcoin to bitcoin cash. with it you can mine a lot more because first of all 10% on BCH is a lot more (nearly 80% of total there maybe more but lets take 80%) and also because of this big hashrate rise more blocks will be generate in 1 day. lets say 200 blocks
200 * 12.5 BCH * 80% * $500 = $1,000,000

right now ViaBTC that has 5% of bitcoin hashrate has mined 25% of bitcoin cash's blocks.

of course things aren't as simple as this and i am making big assumptions about numbers. for example a miner can not just sell the coins as he gets them. coinbase transaction (that 12.5) need to stay about 100 blocks IIRC or so before becomes spendable.

if I understand bitcoin design correctly, it's adjusting based on how much power you have on the network so if u have lower hashrate it doesnt mean everything will be slowed down, it's emmiting btc in about same speed no matter how much miners you have.

If I'm wrong, sorry for my ignorance

you are correct about the "adjusting" part but not considering the time it takes. the adjustment has a period, it is done every 2016 blocks (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Difficulty#How_often_does_the_network_difficulty_change.3F) and it should take 2 weeks to find 2016 blocks, if hashrate goes up it will take less time so difficulty goes up to adjust the time again to fix this. and if it goes down the opposite with happen.

things are different in bitcoin cash though. they have changed the difficulty to drop (i think 25% if no blocks were found in 6 hours!) so the effects are a bit different.

PS it is interesting to see what will happen in reality with miners though!

You will see a lot of hopping from miners. whichever is profitable. This is bad for both chains. Gaming the difficulty.

[r0ach]

The big block vision is one where blocks become so huge that only a few datacenters will be able to operate nodes

Conversely, anyone trying to force the entire planet onto a fixed block size coin with low scaling is inherently pushing an extreme PRO-USURY stance for everyone to be extorted.  The only way you're not doing so is if bitcoin used something like Monero-style scaling block size.

The only solution?

Cryptocurrency does not do anything better than precious metals like gold and silver in current state.  It's probably not even possible to create a decentralized cryptocurrency in the first place.  People in cryptocurrency are generally just creating Rube Goldberg machines one after another that are just obfuscated centralization/reputation systems while claiming they're decentralized.

BCH is not the solution, nor is BTC or the other 900 altcoins.  The further you abstract away from barter the bigger a scam the monetary system you're using is.  If you want to use an actual sound money system, you have to use a physical based commodity form of money aka gold and silver.

[Cranidos]

It seems that we are on a scenario where the only choices are to kill or be killed. I never imagined that BCC/BCH can deliver even worse problem to Bitcoin. At first I thought BitcoinCash will die very soon because it has a very minimum support in the community. And with this enlightenment, it seems we are on a chronic war and we are stuck at the center of this chaotic scenario.

[romero121]

How about the reality we are not sure yet. Everything happening with bitcoin is completely based on the belief people have over it. Same could happen with bitcoin cash in the future, it's in the early days of existence. So nothing to segregate this to be good and that to be bad. Anyhow things has taken place and it's our responsibility to safeguard from loss using different platforms. I personally haven't experienced the pain of cancer, but have seen people suffering. So it would be appreciable if Op removes the term cancer from the thread. There is nothing necessary to mention bitcoin cash as cancer.

[Dux2K]

How about the reality we are not sure yet. Everything happening with bitcoin is completely based on the belief people have over it. Same could happen with bitcoin cash in the future, it's in the early days of existence. So nothing to segregate this to be good and that to be bad. Anyhow things has taken place and it's our responsibility to safeguard from loss using different platforms. I personally haven't experienced the pain of cancer, but have seen people suffering. So it would be appreciable if Op removes the term cancer from the thread. There is nothing necessary to mention bitcoin cash as cancer.

Everyone have right to state some point or opinion.  For me bitcoin cash is alt and such it can never supress bitcoin by price or popularity.

[setupbounds]

if hashrate leaves difficulty will adjust and show will keep going .. what's the issue here?

Hashrate will never leave because bitcoin will never let you down forever so I would say that think good because it will make you better every time because bitcoin always do everything good. Bitcoin will never do something wrong so I would say that hashrate will be still the same but even faster than before as it is showing the speed.

[jc89]

So, the thing we've been trying to avoid for years has actually happened: a contentious hard fork.

What are the ramifications?

Bitcoin Cancer Cell is the single crypto sharing SHA-256 with Bitcoin. Thus, miners are free to transition between the two as is more profitable. If Bitcoin Cancer increases in price, the market will subtract hashrate from Bitcoin and add it to the Cancer.

The Cancer is not only a direct threat to Bitcoin, but ultimately to itself since it is built on faulty fundamentals: The big block vision is one where blocks become so huge that only a few datacenters will be able to operate nodes, leading to a centralization level akin to PayPal and credit cards.

The Cancer comes from within us. It uses the same forums, chats and subreddits.

It is here to destroy.

The only solution? Excision before it metastazises and it's too late: Miners of the majority fork must band together and kill off the minority fork.

Miners banding together to kill the minority fork, I think, aren't gonna happen. There's still so much to see about bcc and it is too early to predict its fate. Though I'm not a fan and I don't own any bcc and not yet planning to have as of this moment. But I think it is not that bad and we can't do anything if investors chose to invest in bcc. But one thing I am sure of, btc will be forever and all my faith goes with btc.

[arbitrage]

BCC or BCH is just a weakness of BTC, and now those who wants to Abandon BTC has almost the same amounts of this new coin and they pushing it to the top, when you rethink about this it is totally unfair.  Small groups can govern how they like. I'm glad to see many people didn't fall on this, and still you can see rational thinking's.

[pinkflower]

BCC or BCH is just a weakness of BTC, and now those who wants to Abandon BTC has almost the same amounts of this new coin and they pushing it to the top, when you rethink about this it is totally unfair.  Small groups can govern how they like. I'm glad to see many people didn't fall on this, and still you can see rational thinking's.

Its not a just weakeness but also an attack window where the miners can freely point their mining farms. The war isnt over yet. Next year we might see the start of a mining arms race between BTC supporters and BCC supporters. We already know Bitmain is for BCC.

[alyssa85]

Isn't Bitcoin all about freedom and financial evolution? Let the free market decide. Maybe those guys are onto something and big blocks work more reliably. Maybe it'll crash and burn in which case we'll finally have the proof that larger blocks just don't cut it. Either way we're going to learn something.

This. BCC is interesting because it has large blocks, which may mean lower fees. Obviously we need to let the difficulty adjust to make it usable - but if people start using it to move money, because the fees are low, it has a future.

[fabiorem]

Trying to synch Bitcoin ABC for three days now.

First I had tried to use the same blockchain until the date of July. Didnt work, the program crashed.

Then started to synch since the beggining. It's on 50% yet, computer turned on all the time. Using another OS because the program uses the same registry as Core.

For me is showing 0 BCC for now, but the transactions until July appear on history as BCC.

I dont know if I will ever get these "free coins".

But I dont see a slow synch like that since I tried to download Ethereum blockchain some months ago (and dropped it after two weeks trying).

[arbitrage]

This. BCC is interesting because it has large blocks, which may mean lower fees. Obviously we need to let the difficulty adjust to make it usable - but if people start using it to move money, because the fees are low, it has a future.

We are not afraid of taking over or something similar but why should we give our support to an coin - altcoin? Majority already decided to use BTC. IF we decide to abandon BTC we can use Startis or Cloak coin or Monero, we surely do not have need for this one! 

[oslak]

84% reduction on BCH difficulty. We're seeing block less infrequently. More dumps to come as the chain becomes somewhat closer to normal blocktime spacing.

[pinkflower]

84% reduction on BCH difficulty. We're seeing block less infrequently. More dumps to come as the chain becomes somewhat closer to normal blocktime spacing.

Its a natural reaction by the holders. But which one has more upside, BTC or BCC? If everything goes as planned with BCC we might see more price growth in it because of heavy speculation.