2013-05-15 [ARStech] Feds reveal the search warrant used to seize Mt Gox account

[solex]

There is a plausible defense for the statement in 2011.  Nobody anywhere in the government (any government) had made any type of guidance, determination, or regulation regarding Bitcoin being a currency or that a Bitcoin exchange was a MSB or money transmitter.  Now not registering as a MSB AFTER FinCEN released its guidance in March 2013.  Well that is another story.  Not sure why MtGox didn't do that or how they expected FinCEN to simply ignore their lack of registration.

The convention is 180 days to comply. They authorities didn't wait, and acted a lot sooner.

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[Terk]

It seems that Mutum Sigillum LLC operations were exactly to “accept funds from customers and send the funds based on customers' instructions” as the company was incorporated with that single purpose in mind and served only this one goal - to transfer people's money into MtGox.

I am going to correct myself as I just read some opinion on Reddit. Mutum Sigillum LLC wasn't accepting money from customers and they weren't sending money to customers. It might be the reason why they involved Dwolla instead of making people to deposit directly to Mutum Sigillum LLC. If they were only transferring money between one company and another company, they might not fall into the money transmitter category.

[oakpacific]

So someone intentionally made false declaration when opening a bank account. That's illegal anyway, no matter it's related to btc or not

There is a plausible defense for the statement in 2011.  Nobody anywhere in the government (any government) had made any type of guidance, determination, or regulation regarding Bitcoin being a currency or that a Bitcoin exchange was a MSB or money transmitter.  Now not registering as a MSB AFTER FinCEN released its guidance in March 2013.  Well that is another story.  Not sure why MtGox didn't do that or how they expected FinCEN to simply ignore their lack of registration.

Government regulation specifically defined "currency" as something issued by a government,  a guidance is not a piece of law.

[marcus_of_augustus]

So someone intentionally made false declaration when opening a bank account. That's illegal anyway, no matter it's related to btc or not

There is a plausible defense for the statement in 2011.  Nobody anywhere in the government (any government) had made any type of guidance, determination, or regulation regarding Bitcoin being a currency or that a Bitcoin exchange was a MSB or money transmitter.  Now not registering as a MSB AFTER FinCEN released its guidance in March 2013.  Well that is another story.  Not sure why MtGox didn't do that or how they expected FinCEN to simply ignore their lack of registration.

Government regulation specifically defined "currency" as something issued by a government,  a guidance is not a piece of law.

This ^^ ... would be interested to know the statue (letter and verse) that is supposed to have precipitated such a jack-booted re-action? God it must have been a matter of extreme criminality or national security or something ... I didn't notice anybody claiming they were defrauded or robbed or anything like by Jon Corzine's  MF effing GLOBAL or anything?

Where were they seizing banksters' bonuses 'funds' when the real big cons were taking place?

Um, nowhere to be seen, ask JP Morgan they appeared to escape any funds seizures or accounts closed down pre-emptively. Rule of Law? Show me the Law. Or they are just a bunch of gangsters pretending to play law.

[solex]

So someone intentionally made false declaration when opening a bank account. That's illegal anyway, no matter it's related to btc or not

There is a plausible defense for the statement in 2011.  Nobody anywhere in the government (any government) had made any type of guidance, determination, or regulation regarding Bitcoin being a currency or that a Bitcoin exchange was a MSB or money transmitter.  Now not registering as a MSB AFTER FinCEN released its guidance in March 2013.  Well that is another story.  Not sure why MtGox didn't do that or how they expected FinCEN to simply ignore their lack of registration.

Government regulation specifically defined "currency" as something issued by a government,  a guidance is not a piece of law.

This ^^ ... would be interested to know the statue (letter and verse) that is supposed to have precipitated such a jack-booted re-action? God it must have been a matter of extreme criminality or national security or something ... I didn't notice anybody claiming they were defrauded or robbed or anything like by Jon Corzine's  MF effing GLOBAL or anything?

Where were they seizing banksters' bonuses 'funds' when the real big cons were taking place?

Um, nowhere to be seen, ask JP Morgan they appeared to escape any funds seizures or accounts closed down pre-emptively. Rule of Law? Show me the Law. Or they are just a bunch of gangsters pretending to play law.

Bloggers like Yves Smith, Karl Denninger and Tyler Durden have been railing about misapplied financial regulation for years: one law for banksters and one for everyone else. It appears Mark Karpeles is not an honorary bankster (unlike Corzine)