#3 - BTCJam loan, 10 BTC @ 2% weekly for a month

[shbtc]

This is my third loan and is partially secured with a share of ASICMiner. Even though the terms are weekly payments for a month, BTCJam calculated it in a way so that there are 5 payments. Feel free to ask me any questions. https://btcjam.com/listings/4428

[Vod]

Feel free to ask me any questions.

Why haven't you done the credit score verification on btcjam?

[shbtc]

Feel free to ask me any questions.

Why haven't you done the credit score verification on btcjam?

This is the only thing I have failed to verify and I have several reasons.
1) I don't feel very comfortable giving out that information.
2) I'm self employed and haven't really looked into what documentation would be required for that, because of #1.
3) The majority of my income comes from my small local business. I only bring in about $600 a week from that, so it's not very impressive. My investment income currently averages about $200 per week. $800 per week before taxes may seem very low to most people but in the southern US, it's plenty. I also own my home with about $50k equity, if that matters. I also have 2 roommates that pay almost my entire mortgage, so I'm left with only utilities and such.

I have some disposable income and never take out a loan that I couldn't repay if the worst should happen and my investments went sour.

[Vod]

Feel free to ask me any questions.

Why haven't you done the credit score verification on btcjam?

This is the only thing I have failed to verify and I have several reasons.
1) I don't feel very comfortable giving out that information.
2) I'm self employed and haven't really looked into what documentation would be required for that, because of #1.
3) The majority of my income comes from my small local business. I only bring in about $600 a week from that, so it's not very impressive. My investment income currently averages about $200 per week. $800 per week before taxes may seem very low to most people but in the southern US, it's plenty. I also own my home with about $50k equity, if that matters. I also have 2 roommates that pay almost my entire mortgage, so I'm left with only utilities and such.

I have some disposable income and never take out a loan that I couldn't repay if the worst should happen and my investments went sour.

Everything you say is worthless, unless it can be confirmed.  (Do you believe I am actually Peter Griffen?) The reason for verification is that you can be held accountable if you don't pay your loan back.  If you are not comfortable giving out that information, I'm sure you can understand that people won't be comfortable lending you over a thousand dollars.  

[shbtc]

Feel free to ask me any questions.

Why haven't you done the credit score verification on btcjam?

This is the only thing I have failed to verify and I have several reasons.
1) I don't feel very comfortable giving out that information.
2) I'm self employed and haven't really looked into what documentation would be required for that, because of #1.
3) The majority of my income comes from my small local business. I only bring in about $600 a week from that, so it's not very impressive. My investment income currently averages about $200 per week. $800 per week before taxes may seem very low to most people but in the southern US, it's plenty. I also own my home with about $50k equity, if that matters. I also have 2 roommates that pay almost my entire mortgage, so I'm left with only utilities and such.

I have some disposable income and never take out a loan that I couldn't repay if the worst should happen and my investments went sour.

Everything you say is worthless, unless it can be confirmed.  (Do you believe I am actually Peter Griffen?) The reason for verification is that you can be held accountable if you don't pay your loan back.  If you are not comfortable giving out that information, I'm sure you can understand that people won't be comfortable lending you over a thousand dollars.  

I understand that my word is not good enough. I have verified everything else about myself including ID, address, social networks, and phone number, as well as reached out to this community where I hope to build a reputation, not only as a borrower. This should be more than enough to ensure that I am held accountable for my debts. If that is not enough for you, don't invest. A thousand dollars really isn't a large sum IMO. I mean no offense and I understand where you are coming from. I just feel like I'm being hassled on one little detail for a small loan, after working hard for months to build what little reputation I have. It's a little frustrating, especially when combined with all the scammer offers and lowballers I get daily for my Avalon batch 3 listing.

[Vod]

I understand that my word is not good enough. I have verified everything else about myself including ID, address, social networks, and phone number, as well as reached out to this community where I hope to build a reputation, not only as a borrower. This should be more than enough to ensure that I am held accountable for my debts. If that is not enough for you, don't invest. A thousand dollars really isn't a large sum IMO. I mean no offense and I understand where you are coming from. I just feel like I'm being hassled on one little detail for a small loan, after working hard for months to build what little reputation I have. It's a little frustrating, especially when combined with all the scammer offers and lowballers I get daily for my Avalon batch 3 listing.

All of that is useless if you decide not to pay back the loan.  Credit score verification, which you have refused to get, is not "one little detail" - it is the only thing that would provide pressure on you to repay.  If you really want to build your reputation, other than taking out useless reputation loans, meet that requirement.  Everything else is meaningless.

[Tulkas]

I understand that my word is not good enough. I have verified everything else about myself including ID, address, social networks, and phone number, as well as reached out to this community where I hope to build a reputation, not only as a borrower. This should be more than enough to ensure that I am held accountable for my debts. If that is not enough for you, don't invest. A thousand dollars really isn't a large sum IMO. I mean no offense and I understand where you are coming from. I just feel like I'm being hassled on one little detail for a small loan, after working hard for months to build what little reputation I have. It's a little frustrating, especially when combined with all the scammer offers and lowballers I get daily for my Avalon batch 3 listing.

All of that is useless if you decide not to pay back the loan.  Credit score verification, which you have refused to get, is not "one little detail" - it is the only thing that would provide pressure on you to repay.  If you really want to build your reputation, other than taking out useless reputation loans, meet that requirement.  Everything else is meaningless.

Hello mlawrence,

By our new terms of service his identity will be disclosed in case of default and the arbitration award will be issued (it is legally binding).

It's a new time for us, announcement soon, but the terms are there, you can verify.

Regards

[Vod]

Hello mlawrence,

By our new terms of service his identity will be disclosed in case of default and the arbitration award will be issued (it is legally binding).

It's a new time for us, announcement soon, but the terms are there, you can verify.

Regards

You mean the identity he provided to btcjam.

The identity which is very easy to spoof, unless one clears the credit report requirement.

This is why so many people do not verify the credit report; they have purchased fake identities which they cannot confirm.   

[shbtc]

Hello mlawrence,

By our new terms of service his identity will be disclosed in case of default and the arbitration award will be issued (it is legally binding).

It's a new time for us, announcement soon, but the terms are there, you can verify.

Regards

You mean the identity he provided to btcjam.

The identity which is very easy to spoof, unless one clears the credit report requirement.

This is why so many people do not verify the credit report; they have purchased fake identities which they cannot confirm.   

Tulkas is right. For this loan, I was pleasantly surprised to see that I had to agree to the following terms before listing:

International Arbitration
Any controversy or claim arising out of or relating to this contract, or the breach of this contract, shall be settled by binding internet arbitration entity designated by BTCJam. The arbitrator's decision shall be final and legally binding and judgment may be entered thereon. This agreement is legally binding in the 146 countries that have signed the 1958 United Nations Convention of New York. Your identity information will be handed over to the authorities and lenders in case of default.

As for faking identities, I honestly wouldn't know how easy it might be (again, I know my word means nothing to you). I would assume it would actually be relatively difficult to fake an ID, utility bill, Facebook account with 262 friends, 4 year old eBay account, and a 4 year old paypal account that all match up. And if someone could fake all of those things, what would stop them from faking proof of income? Regardless, if you think it will really help my rep that much, I will reconsider and look into it again. Thank you for the suggestion.

[Vod]

As for faking identities, I honestly wouldn't know how easy it might be (again, I know my word means nothing to you). I would assume it would actually be relatively difficult to fake an ID, utility bill, Facebook account with 262 friends, 4 year old eBay account, and a 4 year old paypal account that all match up.

Probably less than $20 for the entire package.  You'd be surprised.   

[shbtc]

As for faking identities, I honestly wouldn't know how easy it might be (again, I know my word means nothing to you). I would assume it would actually be relatively difficult to fake an ID, utility bill, Facebook account with 262 friends, 4 year old eBay account, and a 4 year old paypal account that all match up.

Probably less than $20 for the entire package.  You'd be surprised.   

How much extra for proof of income?

[Vod]

As for faking identities, I honestly wouldn't know how easy it might be (again, I know my word means nothing to you). I would assume it would actually be relatively difficult to fake an ID, utility bill, Facebook account with 262 friends, 4 year old eBay account, and a 4 year old paypal account that all match up.

Probably less than $20 for the entire package.  You'd be surprised.   

How much extra for proof of income?

No idea, I don't deal in that market.  I do know that such identity packages are for sale, weened from compromised email accounts and the such.  The items asked for in the credit report are probably a lot harder to get, since they are more recent.

[Tulkas]

As for faking identities, I honestly wouldn't know how easy it might be (again, I know my word means nothing to you). I would assume it would actually be relatively difficult to fake an ID, utility bill, Facebook account with 262 friends, 4 year old eBay account, and a 4 year old paypal account that all match up.

Probably less than $20 for the entire package.  You'd be surprised.   

How much extra for proof of income?

No idea, I don't deal in that market.  I do know that such identity packages are for sale, weened from compromised email accounts and the such.  The items asked for in the credit report are probably a lot harder to get, since they are more recent.

The paypal verified account is harder to get since you need to have access to the bank statement AND have high-res identity documents AND a matching address proof. Hacked accounts usually lack the last two itens.

Also, can you please point me (can be via PM) to a "package" like that. It may help prevent future scammers.

Thanks!

[Vod]

The paypal verified account is harder to get since you need to have access to the bank statement AND have high-res identity documents AND a matching address proof. Hacked accounts usually lack the last two itens.

Also, can you please point me (can be via PM) to a "package" like that. It may help prevent future scammers.

Thanks!

I'm talking hacked paypal accounts that are already verified.  A criminal wouldn't go through the process of getting a paypal account verified.     Identity theft has a large underground market on the internet.

Here is a good blog that will explain some of it:
http://blog.webroot.com/2013/02/20/new-underground-e-shop-offers-access-to-hundreds-of-hacked-paypal-accounts/

Edit:  If you are looking for a way to prevent future scammers, you should have the person send you a picture doing something odd - such as a shoe on the head or making a thumbs up.  You may be able to buy a drivers license, paypal account, ebay account, bank account, etc, but one thing they cannot produce is a custom photo with the same person's image. 

[shbtc]

Edit:  If you are looking for a way to prevent future scammers, you should have the person send you a picture doing something odd - such as a shoe on the head or making a thumbs up.  You may be able to buy a drivers license, paypal account, ebay account, bank account, etc, but one thing they cannot produce is a custom photo with the same person's image. 

That's actually a really good idea, that I had never heard before. Thank you.

[hitman_8787]

No need for all this. In order to verify that some documents are not fake, just make it mandatory to send his id/passport/utility bill/bank statement with a picture of him holding them. So not just scans/pictures of the documents, but also a picture with the person holding them in their hands. A lot of gambling sites do this.
It is true that a package of this kind is about 80-100$, and not 20$, but a plastic ID is somewhere around 200-400$, depending of the quality. So even though that some still can fake this, they would require a loan of at least 4-5 BTC, so at least it draines some of the scamers. Also i don't know if scamers would like their picture shown to someone.

If you would like details or consultation regarding this, just PM me and i will answer you. I used to work to a local company here, where they handled with this sort of things among others.

[shbtc]

So my ASICMiner stock is being held as collateral for the loan. Does anyone know what happens to my dividends during the length of the loan? Will I get all dividends back at the end? I PM'd Tulkas yesterday and sent an email to support the day before but haven't gotten an answer. Anyone have any experience with this? This weeks dividend tripled over last weeks. I understand it would be a pain to distribute them during the life of the loan, but I should at least get the dividends back at the end right? If BTCJam is just going to pocket them, this is a problem.