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Author Topic: How much fee for a $2 Coffee transaction at the end of this Aug month?  (Read 1027 times)
very_452001
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August 09, 2017, 05:11:49 PM
 #1

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.
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kokojie
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August 09, 2017, 05:14:48 PM
 #2

Currently:
On BSegwit chain around $1.1
On BCash chain around $0.15

So draw your own conclusion

btc: 15sFnThw58hiGHYXyUAasgfauifTEB1ZF6
aleksej996
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August 09, 2017, 05:36:52 PM
 #3

I keep hearing that Segwit won't really bring the fees down. Is there anything in plan for Bitcoin Core to bring the fees down or do they want it this way?

1 satoshi is 100 millionth of a bitcoin and there will be 21 million of bitcoins, so there will be 2.1 quadrillion of satoshis. Now I don't know how much cash is there in the world, but some searching suggests about 60 trillion US dollars worth. That would mean that there would be about 35 satoshis for every dollar. So 1 satoshi would be around 3 cents.
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August 09, 2017, 05:44:26 PM
 #4

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

Cryptocurrency fees are very flexible, and their size determine how fast they will get their first confirmation. If your coffee merchant agrees to accept 0 confirmation and low fee payments, than you can buy coffee with Bitcoins with just a few cents in fees. But it's not a secret that transaction fees of any altcoin are cheaper than in Bitcoin for one simple reason - their networks process very small amounts of transactions, because no one really uses them, since their usage comes with security, volatility and conversion costs.

Currently:
On BSegwit chain around $1.1
On BCash chain around $0.15

So draw your own conclusion

With this kind of reasoning you should promote Dogecoin instead, since it has only $0.003 average transaction fee.

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BrewMaster
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August 09, 2017, 05:50:52 PM
 #5

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?
it is not a fair comparison. it would like comparing bitcoin fees with Dogecoin fees. you know $0.5 versus $0.0022

Quote
Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.
fees can be readjusted and even if not through code, people will pay less amount. for example if bitcoin was at 10K nobody would have paid 0.001BTC fee or they'd stop using bitcoin at some point for buying "gum/candy" Cheesy

There is a FOMO brewing...
Pearls Before Swine
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August 09, 2017, 05:56:41 PM
 #6

I work hard for my bitcoin and wouldn't spend anything but fiat on a cup of coffee.
Why wouldn't anyone spend crypto on anything so mundane?   And fees are only
part of the reason.   The opportunity cost alone makes it quite prohibitive.
Imagine if you'd wasted bitcoin on coffee last year...you'd be like that guy who
bought a 10,000BTC pizza.  I don't want that on my tombstone.
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August 09, 2017, 06:30:35 PM
 #7

I work hard for my bitcoin and wouldn't spend anything but fiat on a cup of coffee.
Why wouldn't anyone spend crypto on anything so mundane?   And fees are only
part of the reason.   The opportunity cost alone makes it quite prohibitive.
Imagine if you'd wasted bitcoin on coffee last year...you'd be like that guy who
bought a 10,000BTC pizza.  I don't want that on my tombstone.

However, if there aren't people that will spend bitcoin then it has no true value in the world. So overall, it is good to have people that will spend their bitcoin.

In the future I hope bitcoin will advance and find ways to make their transactions cheaper and more efficient.

panju1
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August 09, 2017, 07:07:35 PM
 #8

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

If you have to wait for 1 confirmation to pay for the coffee, then it doesn't matter if Bitcoin cash has lower transaction fees. It would take an insane amount of time to find a block and complete the payment.
mobnepal
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August 09, 2017, 07:18:52 PM
 #9

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

If you have to wait for 1 confirmation to pay for the coffee, then it doesn't matter if Bitcoin cash has lower transaction fees. It would take an insane amount of time to find a block and complete the payment.
Yes this is true and with segwit activated on bitcoin, sooner or later we will see lightening network that will make bitcoin payments instant and free with off chain transactions but with the same level of security as on-chain transactions.

At that point we don't have to worry about waiting for confirmation or very high fee for transactions worth of few $.
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August 09, 2017, 07:21:24 PM
 #10

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

If you have to wait for 1 confirmation to pay for the coffee, then it doesn't matter if Bitcoin cash has lower transaction fees. It would take an insane amount of time to find a block and complete the payment.
Yes this is true and with segwit activated on bitcoin, sooner or later we will see lightening network that will make bitcoin payments instant and free with off chain transactions but with the same level of security as on-chain transactions.

off chain transaction requires 3rd party permission, basically destroying Satoshi's intent "P2P Electronic Cash System". At that point, I'd just use credit cards.

btc: 15sFnThw58hiGHYXyUAasgfauifTEB1ZF6
aleksej996
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August 09, 2017, 10:21:23 PM
 #11

I work hard for my bitcoin and wouldn't spend anything but fiat on a cup of coffee.
Why wouldn't anyone spend crypto on anything so mundane?   And fees are only
part of the reason.   The opportunity cost alone makes it quite prohibitive.
Imagine if you'd wasted bitcoin on coffee last year...you'd be like that guy who
bought a 10,000BTC pizza.  I don't want that on my tombstone.

I imagine a tombstone with a QR code of a bitcoin address with words:

"He had _ bitcoins and he never moved them.
He died with his private keys.
Send 1000 satoshis to this address to pay respect."
very_452001
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August 09, 2017, 10:54:27 PM
 #12

I thought segwit will reduce the fees, so what good is segwit then apart from lowering fees?

Ok so lightning network is the only chance that can bring low fees to bitcoin spending?

Low fees/Free transactions plus instant confirmations is the only way i can see to go up against visa/mastercard/paypal otherwise bitcoin only use is a hedge fund nothing more.
Thatstinks
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August 09, 2017, 11:07:56 PM
 #13

Currently:
On BSegwit chain around $1.1
On BCash chain around $0.15

So draw your own conclusion

CRAZY!

As the weeks go by the realization Bitcoin Cash is superior and a better version will cause it's value to sky rocket.

Shame on core and segwit2x.
Beerwizzard
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August 09, 2017, 11:18:44 PM
 #14

Currently:
On BSegwit chain around $1.1
On BCash chain around $0.15

So draw your own conclusion
Segwit is not yet launched. Soon the changes will fully activated and we will have better better fee but the block size will still be under 8mb that we have on BCC. Anyway choosing another fork is not the solution of the problem.
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August 09, 2017, 11:20:54 PM
 #15

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

If you have to wait for 1 confirmation to pay for the coffee, then it doesn't matter if Bitcoin cash has lower transaction fees. It would take an insane amount of time to find a block and complete the payment.
Offchain transactions are more secure in Bitcoin Cash

BUY / SELL bitcoins  --->  https://bit2me.com/?r=ryOV8xZNb
stompix
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August 10, 2017, 01:05:08 AM
 #16

CRAZY!

As the weeks go by the realization Bitcoin Cash is superior and a better version will cause it's value to sky rocket.

Shame on core and segwit2x.

And here we go with the lack of economic understanding.0, nada , none.

Fees are higher because currently the blocks of BTC are still full and bitcoincash are empty.Because nobody uses bitcoincash.
Demand and offer, need to transfer vs space in the block.And everything is pointing at BTC being the winner.

I work hard for my bitcoin and wouldn't spend anything but fiat on a cup of coffee.
Why wouldn't anyone spend crypto on anything so mundane?   And fees are only
part of the reason.   The opportunity cost alone makes it quite prohibitive.
Imagine if you'd wasted bitcoin on coffee last year...you'd be like that guy who
bought a 10,000BTC pizza.  I don't want that on my tombstone.

Without "the guy" that bought that pizza 99.99999999% of us would be here and the price would still be....
Oh, wait, there would be no price for it.

So show "the guy" a little respect.

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August 10, 2017, 01:10:46 AM
 #17

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

Cryptocurrency fees are very flexible, and their size determine how fast they will get their first confirmation. If your coffee merchant agrees to accept 0 confirmation and low fee payments, than you can buy coffee with Bitcoins with just a few cents in fees. But it's not a secret that transaction fees of any altcoin are cheaper than in Bitcoin for one simple reason - their networks process very small amounts of transactions, because no one really uses them, since their usage comes with security, volatility and conversion costs.

Currently:
On BSegwit chain around $1.1
On BCash chain around $0.15

So draw your own conclusion

With this kind of reasoning you should promote Dogecoin instead, since it has only $0.003 average transaction fee.
|I don't now exactly that how much fee would be for buying a coffee with bitcoins.But i am using electrum wallet and i could see the transaction fee has gone down after segwit activation.Since bitcoin price is rising very much,it would be better for you to just buy coffee just with fiat money itself.

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August 10, 2017, 01:19:20 AM
 #18

it is not a fair comparison. it would like comparing bitcoin fees with Dogecoin fees. you know $0.5 versus $0.0022
There could be some coffeecoin, or a gumcoin. Candycoin anybody? Actually DOGE moar and moar becomes mah favorite coin, much coin, very well. Maybe ETH has another edge in regards of technology development on the other hand.

Cynism aside, the highest fees model allready did failed by user acception. There is no future in it, and average satoshis per byte dwindled in recent weeks to no surprise.
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August 10, 2017, 02:56:45 AM
 #19

Currently:
On BSegwit chain around $1.1
On BCash chain around $0.15

So draw your own conclusion

Is that the transaction fees to move $2 worth of coins in Bitcoin and BitcoinCash? But I moved $30 worth of BTC a few days ago and it cost me around $0.21 in fees.

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August 11, 2017, 11:40:54 AM
 #20

I mean after segwit is activated of course.

Also how does this fee compares to bitcoin cash fee? Which will be cheaper to the consumer?

Also if bitcoins are worth $millions in the future and 1 satoshi equals $1 then how do you buy 50cents gum/candy? Or does bitcoin anticipate that in the future fiat inflation is norm meaning cents pricing will be gone in the future.

Since Segwit was activated, it is quite obvious that transaction fees have been lowered, and I am now saving a dollar or 2 every transaction I make, which eventually adds up, especially if you make a lot of smaller transactions. Have made 5 transactions after Segwit has been activated and saved like 7$ in transaction fees. Nice!
 
Don’t compare transaction fees of Bitcoin cash and Bitcoin, they are totally different things and Bitcoin is way more congested, therefore the fees should be higher. Barely anyone uses Bitcoin cash, so that is probably why fees are so small.

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