Liberty Reserve Shut down

[Benson Samuel]

http://bitcoinmagazine.com/liberty-reserve-shut-down-for-money-laundering/

[1715540289]

1715540289

[1715540289]

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[1715540289]

1715540289

[nagatlakshmi]

What about our holdings?

[americandesi]

http://bitcoinmagazine.com/liberty-reserve-shut-down-for-money-laundering/

I saw this too.! I came to the forum to post the details but i saw your post.! This was a co-ordinated effort of 17 countries.
The main reason quoted by the feds are that the sender and buyer were opaque and the transaction was anonymous.!

It is reported that it surfaced in many high profile crimes including the recent $45 million dollar loot through ATM machines.

The best part is that Liberty Reserve was incorporated in Costa Rica in 2006 by Arthur Budovsky, who renounced his United States citizenship in 2011, and was arrested in Spain on Friday. So US officials arrested a guy / closed a company which did not have anything to do with US (unless the US citizens were using it) Something to ponder upon.

By reading the reasons quoted by IRS, it feels like all those reasons apply to a normal bitcoin transaction as well.

[americandesi]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/petercohan/2013/05/29/after-liberty-reserve-shut-down-is-bitcoin-next/

[Pinwheel]

http://bitcoinmagazine.com/liberty-reserve-shut-down-for-money-laundering/

The best part is that Liberty Reserve was incorporated in Costa Rica in 2006 by Arthur Budovsky, who renounced his United States citizenship in 2011, and was arrested in Spain on Friday. So US officials arrested a guy / closed a company which did not have anything to do with US (unless the US citizens were using it) Something to ponder upon.

US citizens been using LR a lot. 200K users from US. there is indictment posted on net somewhere, very interesting read

[Benson Samuel]

Any numbers on India users?

[Pinwheel]

Any numbers on India users?

not what I've seen
search for this file liberty-researve-cats-marmilev.pdf many interesting details.

compared to the way LR structured their operations, bitcoin exchanges in their childhood, somebody gonna pay and wake up. Mtgox already paying, wait not so much time left, we will see them on the move from Japan.

this pink childhood dreams, bout how world governments embracing bitcoins gonna cost someone.

[Benson Samuel]

Both the signatories on the pdf seem like Indian names.

Preet Bharara & Jaikumar Ramaswamy. Sigh....

[Pinwheel]

Both the signatories on the pdf seem like Indian names.

Preet Bharara & Jaikumar Ramaswamy. Sigh....

that was not me

[buysellbitcoin]

Both the signatories on the pdf seem like Indian names.

Preet Bharara & Jaikumar Ramaswamy. Sigh....

that was not me

Lol

[americandesi]

Both the signatories on the pdf seem like Indian names.

Preet Bharara & Jaikumar Ramaswamy. Sigh....

Isn't Preeth Bharara and Jaikumar Ramaswamy the IRS attorneys.?
I remember seeing their interviews on TV

[Benson Samuel]

Both the signatories on the pdf seem like Indian names.

Preet Bharara & Jaikumar Ramaswamy. Sigh....

Isn't Preeth Bharara and Jaikumar Ramaswamy the IRS attorneys.?
I remember seeing their interviews on TV

Not sure. First time I have heard of em.

[legendster]

Any numbers on India users?

Trust me there are atleast 100k users in India who do forex trades based solely on LR.
Even I opened a LR account JUST so that I can start funding my trading account.

[skysnap]

I have lost more than 100 USD in LR. I know that there are many other indians who lost more. I am moving towards Payza and BTC now.

[escrow.ms]

I have lost more than 100 USD in LR. I know that there are many other indians who lost more. I am moving towards Payza and BTC now.

Payza is fine but beware from chargebacks and fraud funds, they can lock your account anytime.

Ps: Check webmoney too (http://wmtransfer.com)

[skysnap]

I am not sure if webmoney has any exchangers for india. That would be another thing to see.

edit: just realized you have one link to exchanger in footer.

[escrow.ms]

I am not sure if webmoney has any exchangers for india. That would be another thing to see.

edit: just realized you have one link to exchanger in footer.

I do webmoney exchanges myself and you can use many exchange sites as well like the one i have in my signature, you can also withdraw your money to bank account like paypal.

There are 2 more currency systems which are popular with indians if you don't know.

1. Perfectmoney
https://perfectmoney.is

2. Skrill aka moneybooker
https://www.skrill.com/app/

[skysnap]

Thanks, perfectmoney looks better alternative. I can't say anything about skrill because they are now charging yearly fees.

[legendster]

Thanks, perfectmoney looks better alternative. I can't say anything about skrill because they are now charging yearly fees.

Are they ? I dont think so.

And PM has their own little loans section, which I think is pretty neat but useless.

[skysnap]

Sorry the dormant fees applies to the accounts that has no transactions for 18 months.

[Benson Samuel]

Sorry the dormant fees applies to the accounts that has no transactions for 18 months.

Skrill has a problem with receiving money in India.

Their account verification requires the exact amount shown on statement to be entered. If the amount is not shown in dollars on the bank statement, they reject verification.

Source: I used to pay for Evony using Moneybooker/ Skrill. Making payments is possible, receiving in India is not.

[skysnap]

so is it  not possible to use an exchanger for the moneybooker? I mean if we get moneybooker money to someone to exchange for INR NEFT. Is it not another better idea? I guess, it is possible.

[Benson Samuel]

so is it  not possible to use an exchanger for the moneybooker? I mean if we get moneybooker money to someone to exchange for INR NEFT. Is it not another better idea? I guess, it is possible.

Moneybooker is like Paypal, They use the existing bank networks to transfer funds.

Dislaimer: Last time I used them was over 3 years ago. I am not sure if they have changed much.

[skysnap]

I just checked the bank withdrawal charges for moneybookers, they seem to be charging 139 RS per bank withdrawal via SWIFT. Not sure if the charges add up depending on amount or is it fixed charge.

[Benson Samuel]

I just checked the bank withdrawal charges for moneybookers, they seem to be charging 139 RS per bank withdrawal via SWIFT. Not sure if the charges add up depending on amount or is it fixed charge.

I did want to login and check if anything has changed, but no luck.

Your account is closed. If you wish to reopen your account, please call our customer service team on +44 203 514 5562 .

[escrow.ms]

Sorry the dormant fees applies to the accounts that has no transactions for 18 months.

Skrill has a problem with receiving money in India.

Their account verification requires the exact amount shown on statement to be entered. If the amount is not shown in dollars on the bank statement, they reject verification.

Source: I used to pay for Evony using Moneybooker/ Skrill. Making payments is possible, receiving in India is not.

Well that exact amount verification is in paypal too, if you have netbanking enabled you can easily verify it. I actually forgot if they deposit USD or INR.

But verification is easy and i have withdrawal money to my bank account many times,however they charge high fees due to euro -> usd -> inr conversion.

[Benson Samuel]

Sorry the dormant fees applies to the accounts that has no transactions for 18 months.

Skrill has a problem with receiving money in India.

Their account verification requires the exact amount shown on statement to be entered. If the amount is not shown in dollars on the bank statement, they reject verification.

Source: I used to pay for Evony using Moneybooker/ Skrill. Making payments is possible, receiving in India is not.

Well that exact amount verification is in paypal too, if you have netbanking enabled you can easily verify it. I actually forgot if they deposit USD or INR.

But verification is easy and i have withdrawal money to my bank account many times,however they charge high fees due to euro -> usd -> inr conversion.

U using Skrill? When I had tried to verify few years back, they did not allow it. The amount showed up in Rs on my statement, but I was asked to enter the exact dollar amount.

I am verified on PayPal though, as they do accept INR inputs.

Please lemme know if you have a verified Skrill account for receiving and sending money.

[escrow.ms]

Sorry the dormant fees applies to the accounts that has no transactions for 18 months.

Skrill has a problem with receiving money in India.

Their account verification requires the exact amount shown on statement to be entered. If the amount is not shown in dollars on the bank statement, they reject verification.

Source: I used to pay for Evony using Moneybooker/ Skrill. Making payments is possible, receiving in India is not.

Well that exact amount verification is in paypal too, if you have netbanking enabled you can easily verify it. I actually forgot if they deposit USD or INR.

But verification is easy and i have withdrawal money to my bank account many times,however they charge high fees due to euro -> usd -> inr conversion.

U using Skrill? When I had tried to verify few years back, they did not allow it. The amount showed up in Rs on my statement, but I was asked to enter the exact dollar amount.

I am verified on PayPal though, as they do accept INR inputs.

Please lemme know if you have a verified Skrill account for receiving and sending money.

Well I was using it till  last year and my account was fully verified merchant account, but it's currently locked due to some problems.

http://prntscr.com/1aai5v i removed card for security reasons.
http://prntscr.com/1aai8p

They are asking me to send id proof hardcopy to their london office and i don't have time for that  

Ps: If you want to verify your address, it can take upto 1 month because they send letter via royal mail.
one more thing, if you ever do currency exchange with someone, don't ever write other payment processors name or  "currency exchange" in description. It's not allowed in their TOS.

[Benson Samuel]

Well I was using it till  last year and my account was fully verified merchant account, but it's currently locked due to some problems.

http://prntscr.com/1aai5v i removed card for security reasons.
http://prntscr.com/1aai8p

They are asking me to send id proof hardcopy to their london office and i don't have time for that 

Ps: If you want to verify your address, it can take upto 1 month because they send letter via royal mail.
one more thing, if you ever do currency exchange with someone, don't ever write other payment processors name or  "currency exchange" in description. It's not allowed in their TOS.

I was sure of the fact that deposits are not easy even with Skrill.

Even if you do get verified and are allowed to accept deposits, I am 100% sure that they will not allow domestic money transfer within India and they will have set limits on amounts to be received.
If they do not meet the conditions that I have mentioned above, then they are operating in the same fashion as LR. This is an observation from a regulatory perspective.

[skysnap]

I wonder how much can we withdraw to the bank? I do see the minimum bank transfer charges there but the USD transfer is quite hard to see there.

[Benson Samuel]

I wonder how much can we withdraw to the bank? I do see the minimum bank transfer charges there but the USD transfer is quite hard to see there.

The limits & restrictions show up when you are verifying your account.

[escrow.ms]

Well I was using it till  last year and my account was fully verified merchant account, but it's currently locked due to some problems.

http://prntscr.com/1aai5v i removed card for security reasons.
http://prntscr.com/1aai8p

They are asking me to send id proof hardcopy to their london office and i don't have time for that 

Ps: If you want to verify your address, it can take upto 1 month because they send letter via royal mail.
one more thing, if you ever do currency exchange with someone, don't ever write other payment processors name or  "currency exchange" in description. It's not allowed in their TOS.

I was sure of the fact that deposits are not easy even with Skrill.

Even if you do get verified and are allowed to accept deposits, I am 100% sure that they will not allow domestic money transfer within India and they will have set limits on amounts to be received.
If they do not meet the conditions that I have mentioned above, then they are operating in the same fashion as LR. This is an observation from a regulatory perspective.

Well you can send payment to other indian users, they allow that. There are some limits also, you need to check in your account and yeah i remember now, if you want to add your bank account, first set INR as your main currency. They will deposit verification money in INR

[Benson Samuel]

Well you can send payment to other indian users, they allow that. There are some limits also, you need to check in your account and yeah i remember now, if you want to add your bank account, first set INR as your main currency. They will deposit verification money in INR

In India, the withdrawal of money from Moneybookers is possible in the form of cheque request only.

http://finance.ilikeit.asia/moneybookers-money-transfer-india/

Not sure if it is a vetted article, but it sounds about right. RBI regulation in India does not allow any non banking entity to offer P2P facilities. This would make moneybookers void of this regulation if they do support bank transfers directly.
PayPal of course is an exception. And they have restrictions galore.
That is why after they offer a cheque. It is because they cannot get a banking partner in India. If they could, Bitcoin would have had a booming cash transfer market in place already.

[skysnap]

I have verified my address and some of the limit is lifted. I can send 2Lakh every 90 days which is huge for me on moneybookers.

So right now I am looking for anyone from india to exchange INR via NEFT to sell my moneybookers.

[escrow.ms]

Well you can send payment to other indian users, they allow that. There are some limits also, you need to check in your account and yeah i remember now, if you want to add your bank account, first set INR as your main currency. They will deposit verification money in INR

In India, the withdrawal of money from Moneybookers is possible in the form of cheque request only.

http://finance.ilikeit.asia/moneybookers-money-transfer-india/

Not sure if it is a vetted article, but it sounds about right. RBI regulation in India does not allow any non banking entity to offer P2P facilities. This would make moneybookers void of this regulation if they do support bank transfers directly.
PayPal of course is an exception. And they have restrictions galore.
That is why after they offer a cheque. It is because they cannot get a banking partner in India. If they could, Bitcoin would have had a booming cash transfer market in place already.

That article is very old (2010), you can withdraw funds to bank without any probem.

[escrow.ms]

I have verified my address and some of the limit is lifted. I can send 2Lakh every 90 days which is huge for me on moneybookers.

So right now I am looking for anyone from india to exchange INR via NEFT to sell my moneybookers.

check exchangemoneyforum.com and contact bhanu545 or rishabhmehra.

[skysnap]

Well you can send payment to other indian users, they allow that. There are some limits also, you need to check in your account and yeah i remember now, if you want to add your bank account, first set INR as your main currency. They will deposit verification money in INR

In India, the withdrawal of money from Moneybookers is possible in the form of cheque request only.

http://finance.ilikeit.asia/moneybookers-money-transfer-india/

Not sure if it is a vetted article, but it sounds about right. RBI regulation in India does not allow any non banking entity to offer P2P facilities. This would make moneybookers void of this regulation if they do support bank transfers directly.
PayPal of course is an exception. And they have restrictions galore.
That is why after they offer a cheque. It is because they cannot get a banking partner in India. If they could, Bitcoin would have had a booming cash transfer market in place already.

That article is very old (2010), you can withdraw funds to bank without any probem.

So you meant to say we can do moneybookers exchange to bank, at specified price in the withdraw page?

check exchangemoneyforum.com and contact bhanu545 or rishabhmehra.

Thanks, I will keep this in bookmark.

[Benson Samuel]

Well you can send payment to other indian users, they allow that. There are some limits also, you need to check in your account and yeah i remember now, if you want to add your bank account, first set INR as your main currency. They will deposit verification money in INR

In India, the withdrawal of money from Moneybookers is possible in the form of cheque request only.

http://finance.ilikeit.asia/moneybookers-money-transfer-india/

Not sure if it is a vetted article, but it sounds about right. RBI regulation in India does not allow any non banking entity to offer P2P facilities. This would make moneybookers void of this regulation if they do support bank transfers directly.
PayPal of course is an exception. And they have restrictions galore.
That is why after they offer a cheque. It is because they cannot get a banking partner in India. If they could, Bitcoin would have had a booming cash transfer market in place already.

That article is very old (2010), you can withdraw funds to bank without any probem.

This is very cool indeed. I would assume that it is because they are FSA certified.

[escrow.ms]

So you meant to say we can do moneybookers exchange to bank, at specified price in the withdraw page?

Yes you can, just add bank and you will be able to do withdraw.
Whenever your bank will reieve money they will might ask you to sign a "payment purpose" (1st time only) letter to clear payment.

[skysnap]

Yes, payment purpose is one thing that needs to be solved there. I am not sure if the process is one time or the recurring.

[escrow.ms]

Yes, payment purpose is one thing that needs to be solved there. I am not sure if the process is one time or the recurring.

It's one time only.

[skysnap]

I wonder if ICICI bank has the purpose code document that can be signed for once.  I want to clear it from that end in order to make things easy.