Is an Asic from butterfly labs worth buying?

[ande85]

I was wanting to purchase an ASIC from butterfly labs for $2500, and while yes it would render the current card useless for about one or two years, I figured it would be worth it if I could get the ASIC in around two or three months from now. The only problem? While I believe that some ASICs have shipped from BFL (I may be wrong on this) it is a really small number. However the Avalon unit, which is about the same in performance, costs 73+ bitcoins, or about $9000. Ahhh...

*points to his signature*

No. $2500 is enough to break the bank, but it is an investment, and I'm used to eatting cheaply as possible (the 75c ramen noodles are considered extravagant living for me, and don't get me started on the $2.50 noodles that are oh so silky and fine). The point is that an ASIC from Avalone is too far outside of my price range, and as a result, I have to go somewhere cheaper which is why I was wondering if BFL might be worth fooling with. Personally...I think I'm screwed all over again. :-(

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[talexeh]

The way I see it, ASIC is pretty much out of the reach for miners with limited budget. Sure, BFL's ASICs are affordable but when you look at the queue, there's a high chance that your ASIC is not going to pay itself back by the time you receive it.

I strongly believe that you'll be able to earn more profit by trading bitcoins instead of mining.

[Rampion]

I was wanting to purchase an ASIC from butterfly labs for $2500, and while yes it would render the current card useless for about one or two years, I figured it would be worth it if I could get the ASIC in around two or three months from now. The only problem? While I believe that some ASICs have shipped from BFL (I may be wrong on this) it is a really small number. However the Avalon unit, which is about the same in performance, costs 73+ bitcoins, or about $9000. Ahhh...

*points to his signature*

No. $2500 is enough to break the bank, but it is an investment, and I'm used to eatting cheaply as possible (the 75c ramen noodles are considered extravagant living for me, and don't get me started on the $2.50 noodles that are oh so silky and fine). The point is that an ASIC from Avalone is too far outside of my price range, and as a result, I have to go somewhere cheaper which is why I was wondering if BFL might be worth fooling with. Personally...I think I'm screwed all over again. :-(

What you need to understand is that you wil not get your units in "around two or three months from now". Best case scenario for the Jalapeño is something like 9 to 10 months from order to delivery (and that's the absolute best case). For the other units (Single, Mini Single, Mini Rig) nobody can know, they don't even exist yet.

[LuckyXIII]

From what I've observed and read so far on these forums, it seems like BFL is a huge SCAM. I was intrigued by the claimed stats on their machines, but they haven't delivered anything except a few of the GH/s Jalepinos so far. They keep pushing deadlines back further and further.

In my experience if something sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Especially when it comes to investments. If a company manufacture these devices so cheaply why would they sell them? Others on this forum have speculated that BFL took preorder cash to design and build prototype AISC rigs, and then is going to use them to mine for themself.

At current mining rates these machines pay for themself in a month or two. Imagine how much BFL could make producing these things and then running them themself for a few months before shipping (if ever) to the customer...

[Databit]

More is made selling hardware than actually mining with them, currently.
Just check ASICMINER overvalued wares.

[LuckyXIII]

More is made selling hardware than actually mining with them, currently.
Just check ASICMINER overvalued wares.

ASCICMINER hardware costs WAYYY more per GH/s than BFL. That's why BFL smells like a scam. Because why would someone sell a device so profitable, for so little money?

[Rampion]

More is made selling hardware than actually mining with them, currently.
Just check ASICMINER overvalued wares.

ASCICMINER hardware costs WAYYY more per GH/s than BFL. That's why BFL smells like a scam. Because why would someone sell a device so profitable, for so little money?

Because BFL hardware does not exist yet. They used (and are using) customer's money to fund development and production, and they are VERY late.

To the contrary, ASICMINER hardware is very well and immediately shipping, thus they can charge pretty much whatever they want. People is willing to mine at a loss just to get hold on an ASIC.

[monkeymonkey]

Don't confuse investing with speculation.  If you think you can buy a magic money machine for any price that will pay for itself in a month or two, that to me doesn't pass the too good to be true sniff test.

Whether or not BFL is a scam remains to be seen.  People bought in knowing the product was in development but not shipping.  The ship date has been perpetually pushed out.  People are understandably upset but BFL hasn't hoovered up the money and disappeared .. just checked, still seem to be maintaining a presence.

If I were you and subsisting on cup ramen, I'd need to evaluate my belief in bitcoin before buying anything.  Ask some questions like:

How long do I expect Bitcoin to remain profitable for the individual? 

What do I expect to get out of Bitcoin?

How bad off will I be if I buy this widget and it immediately becomes worthless?

[terman45x]

What you need to understand is that you wil not get your units in "around two or three months from now". Best case scenario for the Jalapeño is something like 9 to 10 months from order to delivery (and that's the absolute best case). For the other units (Single, Mini Single, Mini Rig) nobody can know, they don't even exist yet.

Thats too bad. I was considering buying one myselves because of the sweet butterfly ad here.

[Eisbeutel]

yeah, the ads and their website looks great, but I wouldn't advise on buying now...even if they ever deliver the hardware, you'll get yours way too late...

[ande85]

What about the stuff one ebay? I see people selling theirs at a huge mark-up. Then again I suspect a scam. One user even demanded payment using bitcoins right in the auction listing (red flag), had only two reviews, and those were in selling, (red flag again) and his username was runawayfaster (not making this up). Also, yes, I'm aware that some are buying someone else's place in line, but then again, others are saying they have the actual product in their hands, and are willing to ship. Yes, I smell a scam, but still, I have to ask.

As for the money making machine part, no, that's not what I'm looking at it for. I just want something where I can have a few hundred dollars extra a month. Basically even if it was $300 extra a month, to us, that is something substantial, even after the cost of electricity.

[110110101]

Disclaimer: I ordered a 5 GHs unit couple of months ago.

Is Butterflylabs a scam? Well they sure have raked in lots in pre-orders but delivered very few units. My choice was to get a unit and wait and see. From an investment point of view, it probably would have been wiser to have bought some coins and traded. Basically ordering a asicminer - especially on preorder - is to just pray that you get your box before the difficulty shoots through the roof. Otherwise you'll be sitting there with a nice paper weight.

Ordering/bidding on an ebay-unit is just asking for trouble and is not something I would recommend. These people probably don't have a unit and are hoping to scam others who can't/don't want to wait for shipments.

[Xian01]

It is not an easy question to answer.

They have not demonstrated an ability to reliably ship their products in a timely manner, and there have been reports of customer service issues.

[Yecchi]

No, they have 10,000+ preorders. They have shipped 50 units to date. Those people waited nearly a year.

By the time you would recieve yours, it would not make any money.

[Rampion]

No, they have 10,000+ 60,000+ preorders. They have shipped 50 units to date. Those people waited nearly a year.

By the time you would recieve yours, it would not make any money.

Corrected for you - everything else is 100% right.

[Yecchi]

That's even crazier than I thought. None of the ASIC manufacturers seem viable to buy into right now.

[slashnp]

If you want to invest money, buy high eng gpus like 7970, you will always sell them easily

[bitmania]

If you want to invest money, buy high eng gpus like 7970, you will always sell them easily

Seconded.

GPUs have a strong resale value and also have a use outside of Bitcoin mining - games. They can also by used to mine scrypt-based coins like Litecoin that no current ASIC will be able to.

[monkeymonkey]

What about the stuff one ebay? I see people selling theirs at a huge mark-up. Then again I suspect a scam. One user even demanded payment using bitcoins right in the auction listing (red flag), had only two reviews, and those were in selling, (red flag again) and his username was runawayfaster (not making this up). Also, yes, I'm aware that some are buying someone else's place in line, but then again, others are saying they have the actual product in their hands, and are willing to ship. Yes, I smell a scam, but still, I have to ask.

As for the money making machine part, no, that's not what I'm looking at it for. I just want something where I can have a few hundred dollars extra a month. Basically even if it was $300 extra a month, to us, that is something substantial, even after the cost of electricity.

I saw those eBay auctions.  the 'runawayfaster' was exceptionally sketchy.

$300/month after electricity is substantial.  I suggest plugging your numbers into one of the mining calculators like http://dustcoin.com/mining to find out what you'd need to reach your desired income target.  given how recently bitcoin has been highly valued i wouldn't put more money into bitcoin than you're willing to say take with you to Vegas and put down on table games.

I'd echo what people have said about GPUs.  They should have a stronger price they could fall to if bitcoin prices fall through the floor tomorrow.  the downside is of course that they suck up electricity.

remember, no one can see the future.  ASICs bought today might be wildly profitable in 1 year or worthless in a week.  like everything you read on teh internets take opinions here with a grain of salt and ultimately do what is right for you. 

P.S. if you might skip the whole mining thing and try buying Block Eruptor USB miners in group buys and selling them on eBay.  it seems like the fastest way to profit in a bitcoin related thing now.  at some point prices on eBay will likely settle closer to group buy prices.

[bradmeister]

I have been able to get in contact with BFL via email. It took them quite a while to respond to me, but they did both times. I have not been able to get a delivery date, they won't even speculate on it, saying they do not want to disappoint.

Has anyone seen this or have any ideas on what it is???
I ordered two 5 GH/S about a month ago. Yesterday I logged into my account to check the order status and there was a option to upgrade each device to another 2 GH/S for $100 each. I went ahead and did this ($200 total), figure at this point I'm already in over $500, what's another $200. Hopefully it pays off.