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Author Topic: ICO's killing crypto  (Read 3632 times)
cryptoking710
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September 17, 2017, 10:29:13 PM
 #41

I think that cryptocurrency and ico should simply be regulated but within reasonable limits

Totally aggree with you. If governments bring in mild regulation then it can only be good for the whole market as a whole.

Regulation=Acceptance=Profits

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September 17, 2017, 10:40:04 PM
 #42

icos are the one thing that'll bring unacceptable heat on all crypto. if they had never existed i believe crypto would grow organically without interference in most places.

the chinese clampdown is almost certainly because of icos but it's also screwing everything there. if icos hadn't exploded after their exchanges were back online after the shutdown we wouldn't be dealing with this current crap.

they're a cancer on the scene. ideally we would've seen a succession of pathetic failures that would scare buyers away, but maybe it's gonna take some heavy handed action from regulators.

nkarm1
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September 18, 2017, 04:21:15 AM
 #43

This year, there are so many ICOs that usually hits millions of dollars in their cap. And this is very healthy for the market because it brings fire. The only cancer here is only few of them just stands out and usually continue their flowery words. But let's not blame only the developers, the investors also has problems that's​ why they are getting dragged by some nonsense projects. The government should focus on some actions about educating their people about investments. Not on regulating ICO and trading sites. ICO's not killing crypto.
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September 18, 2017, 09:20:18 PM
 #44

I don't think ICO's are killing crypto, but they need some kind of regulation in the future. Maybe the governments will step up.
Hyperme.sh
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September 19, 2017, 04:04:21 AM
Last edit: September 19, 2017, 04:27:55 AM by Hyperme.sh
 #45

On one hand, ICOs are taking precious market cap from what could be invested into Bitcoin.

They're taking focus away from those who have genuine innovation, yet are totally ignored.

On the other, they bring a whole new dimension to crypto that we have never seen before.

It is just such a shame they are almost always pump-and-dump scams. Undecided

Because those of us who want to build a long-term viable project, do not want to be involved with issuing/trading/promoting illegal MLM scams and illegal investment securities.

Regulators are going to need to send a lot of people to jail to get sanity back into crypto R&D. Yet I suspect TPTB are quite satisfied with allowing crypto to destroy itself with scams and render it's participants in jail after the global economic meltdown 2020ish.

If government doesn't get any profit from it, than it's a SCAM.

Yet regardless of whether securities regulation is dumb or beneficial, the fact is that those developers who are serious will not issue ICOs because of the legal uncertainty, thus predominantly the only ones issuing ICOs are scammers. Even if some few Ethereum, NEO, or Tezos developers might be sincere and skilled, the ones issuing the tokens for them are either well connected with the parasites you despise, else they have a criminal mindset and disregard securities regulation risk not only for themselves but also for all those who trade the tokens and for the future of the token itself.

Thus, iCOs are not helping to achieve any goal of defeating the parasites who control the governments, and instead of providing incrimination fuel for them to take control in the future.
nappoleon
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September 19, 2017, 04:11:47 AM
 #46

I don't think so. What's killing crypto is dumbness and greed.

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Hyperme.sh
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September 19, 2017, 04:13:27 AM
 #47

I don't think so. What's killing crypto is dumbness and greed.

ICOs are dumbness and greed.
Lpim01
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September 19, 2017, 04:44:38 AM
 #48

Actually not all ICO have bad intention towards bitcoin but most of them are destroying the image of bitcoin community.
Joining ICO is not a bad idea since it could rewards us for promoting their site, but see to it that it will not make a non-sense campaign that might affect the crypto world.
goku19
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September 19, 2017, 04:47:46 AM
 #49

I dont understand this how can ICO killing crypto...or i will say it is giving empowerment to crypto-currencies...introducing new coins with concepts..sorry if i am wrong but thats what i understand
Hyperme.sh
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September 19, 2017, 08:15:08 AM
 #50

I dont understand this how can ICO killing crypto...or i will say it is giving empowerment to crypto-currencies...introducing new coins with concepts..sorry if i am wrong but thats what i understand

Why haven't you read everything I have ever written?
CASPER_TEAM
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September 19, 2017, 08:21:59 AM
 #51

regulation here is only to protect ordinary people who dont give a fuck what crypto is, but still trying to invest.
nappoleon
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September 19, 2017, 08:22:06 AM
 #52

I don't think so. What's killing crypto is dumbness and greed.

ICOs are dumbness and greed.

While that is true, I also believe in financial inclusion and alternative funding.

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September 19, 2017, 08:33:32 AM
 #53

On one hand, ICOs are taking precious market cap from what could be invested into Bitcoin.

On the other, they bring a whole new dimension to crypto that we have never seen before.

It is just such a shame they are almost always pump-and-dump scams. Undecided

I agree with your second comment.  ICO's are really helping provide exposure and creating new businesses that are leveraging blockchain technology.  It's a great thing for the overall industry.

However, I do think it's fine to have scams.  Anything worthwhile, will always have people trying to take advantage of the situation.  We can't prevent scammers just like we can't prevent stealing, robberies, etc.  

But it is OUR responsibility to not invest in the scams and warn the community so that the scams are minimized as much as possible and do not impact the community itself.
after so many emerging scammers and hackers that endanger ICO projects I think there must be special handling by the developer of a project. to overcome the losses to be received by investors.

Lieldoryn
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September 19, 2017, 08:53:44 AM
 #54

All crypto currency is a dangerous investment. It does not depend on China or any other country has banned the use of cryptocurrencies. It seems to me that the main problem is the large number of speculative capital. Crypto currencies have no damper and is therefore a Paradise for speculators. As soon as speculators will withdraw their capital ordinary users will be ruined.
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September 19, 2017, 09:10:26 AM
 #55

I dont like ICO, many of them just use a whitepaper to stolen our money.
Then gone.
vvadym
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September 19, 2017, 09:48:35 AM
 #56

I don't agree. There are a lot of successful ICOs. Only scam ICOs hurt cryptocurrency.
Hyperme.sh
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September 19, 2017, 11:21:35 PM
Last edit: September 19, 2017, 11:40:40 PM by Hyperme.sh
 #57

I don't think so. What's killing crypto is dumbness and greed.

ICOs are dumbness and greed.

While that is true, I also believe in financial inclusion and alternative funding.

The link of mine you quoted explains that the question of whether securities regulation is harmful or beneficial is irrelevant to the fact that it encumbers the ICO issued tokens with securities regulations that vary in every nation, means those tokens can become illegal to use in the future in different countries. It is multiple layers of legal jeopardy and legal uncertainty. Why would any group of developers that was serious about the long-term viability of the project and tokens they are working on, encumber their project and token with such legal jeopardy? I also explained in my posts over the past days that if instead they issued the tokens with proof-of-work or economic equivalent, the tokens would not be so encumbered and afflicted. I conclude because they do not care about the actual outcome and are unnecessarily just scamming to get money. I have explained how to raise money legally without afflicting and encumbering the tokens with liability of being securities.

I also explained upthread, that the problem is that serious developers such as myself, will not take on such legal risks when in fact I don't need to in order to raise money legally. Thus I conclude that those who risk incriminating themselves with ICO issues, either believe that with crypto they can destroy the nation-state (or that somehow nation-states will abrogate their duty to protect citizens from MLM scams and illegal securities issuance) or they have criminal mindset that does not calculate properly the long-term repercussions of their actions.

How will we ever move crypto into the mainstream of society with this sort of criminal and rebellious mindset? The world needs crypto solutions immediately, not after 20 years battle of daring the G20 to filter traffic on the trunk lines of the Internet and daring them to track down every ICO issuer in a Whac-A-Mole game.

A decentralized issuance such as proof-of-work entirely avoids the MLM scam and securities law. Satoshi designed it this way because he knew that ICOs would destroy everything else and then only Bitcoin would remain standing as the nation-states fight back. But 2016 research has shown that Bitcoin only remains incentives compatible with consensus as transaction fee revenue becomes significant relative to protocol block reward, if mining becomes controlled by a coordinated oligarchy (which appears to be the direction Bitcoin is headed with the Chinese controlling Bitcoin mining and only two 14nm ASIC fabs in the world in control of Bitcoin mining with surely the global elite controlling those fabs from behind the curtain). Also the block size issue has no possible solution (I analyzed this in great detail in an upcoming blog of mine which also described my decentralized ledger solution and compares it to all known designs such as PoW, PoS, DPoS, Byteball, SPECTRE, IOHK's Ourboros, IOTA, etc).

I'm idealistic but also pragmatic.

I want to move crypto to the mainstream immediately and legally. And health willing, I am going to organize that.

As for raising money from non-accredited investors without complying with individual nation state regulations (e.g. to do Regulation A+ or CF crowd equity fundraising to USA persons, the corporation must be a USA corporation), this is massive legal jeopardy. I will not accept funding this way without some entity indemnifying me. Ethereum went to Switzerland and I presume had layers of lawyers indemnifying them personally. I need to look into this more. But even if I did go that route, I would not issue tokens in exchange for investment, because I would not want to encumber the tokens with future illegality. Instead I would issue shares and pay dividends in tokens from the revenue earned from apps developed for the ecosystem.

In short, I want to do this in a smarter way.

I don't agree. There are a lot of successful ICOs. Only scam ICOs hurt cryptocurrency.

Name one and their accomplishements?

Ethereum?

Ethereum's entire raison d'être is ICO speculation selling bags to greater fools. There's no adoption for any other use case.



Quote from: knircky
Example exchanges: if it is illegal to exchange decentral exchanges must and will evolve.

The mainstream of society has no compelling reason to incriminate themselves unless it's to join some civilization destroying South Seas or Tulip Bubble. Are you determined to relegate crypto to the fringe of civilization or attempt to duplicate the Tulip Bubble disaster!



These days, ICO's is bringing crypto investments mainstream, with big publicity regarding currencies generating millions of dollars virtually over night.

Mainstreaming only greater fool speculation MLM bubble. There's no adoption at all for any real world use case. Zero. Zilch.

Thus ICOs are destroying crypto, by moving the focus away from real uses to pure greed.
zirt
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September 19, 2017, 11:23:37 PM
 #58

Hi
Indeed ICO amounts were (are?) trully amazing
People making a good pdf, a website, then people invest millions...
Good ideas and good teams are rare. But they exist.
Most of the ICO i don t participate, I wait coin to be traded on exchange to buy.

The more value is to invest in many small market caps and HODL almost forever...
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September 19, 2017, 11:30:24 PM
 #59

Recent news of the imminent closer of many Chinese exchanges is the direct result of them dealing in ICOs, I've been shocked for the longest time other countries have done so, allowing ICO's to fly under regulators radar, however its only just a matter of time.

It was obious but don't worry  goverment would ban crypto becouse some bad actrors will start using it.
This common in life excuses like terrorism pedofilia you don't realy need ICO to do that.
ICO is way to move arround IPO regulations - but for me this is ok people have freedom to fail at investment too.
ICOs are making harder life for BTC but same time people are greedy and want more ICO more x10 x3 ; ) in week this is casino sometimes.

While this is completely true in regards to ICO, the title of the thread is ICO's is killing crypto. Now, 3-4 years ago, i would of 100% agreed with you, because that was a totally different time then for those of us who where involved then. The ideas, perspective and outlooks for digital currencies.

These days, ICO's is bringing crypto investments mainstream, with big publicity regarding currencies generating millions of dollars virtually over night.

There is a lot of positives that have come from ICO, but, the negatives is what kelsey mentioned above.
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September 19, 2017, 11:42:48 PM
Last edit: September 20, 2017, 04:14:49 AM by Spoetnik
 #60

You all are ignoring what they are.
As in HOW THEY WORK and whether that is appropriate and.. fair.
Why did dev's drop mining coins and ramp up output (more coins) ?

You are all skipping over the ideology of crypto that was established many years before an ICO existed.

Lets recap.. when Ripple or Ethereum launched they were considered scammy..
Because they were an ICO.
That is history people.

Problem is the newer crowd joining in kept lowering the bar.. simply out of greed.
Don't kid yourselves this is not about "crypto currencies"
It is purely about profits.

Period.

So what do ICO's have to do with a crypto currency ?
Not a god damn fucking thing.
They are a scam vehicle.. a new age version of an old pyramid scheme scam design.
Can any of you with a straight face say the ICO distribution method is an improvement over a mined coin like Bitcoin ?
If Satoshi wanted to ICO Bitcoin he would have chucklefuck's.

All we have here is losers.. shitbirds and profiteers and investards.
The morality nose dived hard when mass SCRYPT cloning took hold and worthless garbage like Doge coin exploded in popularity.

The reality is crypto outgrew morality.. it has no need for it anymore and left it for dead.
And unlike all of you i will not contribute to this bullshit.
I quit.
I never have nor will i ever own or support an ICO coin in any way.
Apparently for a little Bitcoin "dust" many of you will.

Crypto is in fact being killed off.
It is now stained forever..

FUD first & ask questions later™
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